Parliament Streetcar

[W. K. Lis]

In the long term, along with the Port Lands redevelopment and expansion of streetcar service into the Port Lands, we may see a PARLIAMENT streetcar (565?) operating as a branch of the QUEENS QUAY EAST streetcar out of a rebuilt Union Station streetcar loop. From link.

The bad news is that they will spend all that needed money on the Line 2 extension instead.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

In the long term, along with the Port Lands redevelopment and expansion of streetcar service into the Port Lands, we may see a PARLIAMENT streetcar (565?) operating as a branch of the QUEENS QUAY EAST streetcar out of a rebuilt Union Station streetcar loop. From link.

The bad news is that they will spend all that needed money on the Line 2 extension instead.

Where did you find this? This is pretty good. This is how a city would expand streetcars normally, but this is Toronto.

 

[ShonTron]

Where did you find this? This is pretty good. This is how a city would expand streetcars normally, but this is Toronto.

It's a fantasy map.

 

[robmausser]

It's a fantasy map.

im starting to think all maps of transit expansion in toronto are fantasy maps, even the official ones.

 

[drum118]

It's a fantasy map.

It has to be as I have never seen this map during any meetings pertaining to the Waterfront Transit Plan.

In fact 517 is a bus route since the city removed the LRT plan for it.

513 has been looked at, but the Bremmer line will be bus, if it gets off the ground.

566 was in the master plan of 2006 going all the way out to Kingston Rd 100% on the lake shore and to go west over the Humber River and connect to the current Lake Shore line as an interline route. Part of that west extension is still on the table going west of Dufferin St. As it stands today, no LRT on the Lake Shore east of Bathurst St.

The $400 million plus for expanding Union Loop is almost dead with 5 option for it to the point, no lines will service the loop at all. Option 5 calls for the lines to run on the surface of Bay St, with Bay close to traffic either south of Queen St or Front St using duel end cars. It will be a transit pedestrian mall. You can have 4 platforms under Union Station overhead. In fact, there been calls to take lines north on Bay St to Bloor using Duel end cars to act as a relief line for the Yonge line

524 will get down to Commissioner St with an option to Unwin at the Portland Energy Centre only.

There will be a route from Broadview Station to the CNE bypass Union on the Queens Quay.

514 could be come a loop in both direction using King and the Queens Quay.

When the extension is built to Dufferin St, X line could run from Sunnyside Loop to X spot by the Queens Quay.

There are plans being look at to fix the Bathurst-Fleet-Lake Shore intersection at this time.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

It's too bad there would be too much capital cost to make a connection to Castle Frank station. That would be pretty cool to do for all us streetcar romanticists, and I'm supportive of converting any diesel bus to electric propulsion from an environmental and air quality perspective.

That said, here's an idea: bring back trolley buses. Converting Parliament to a trolley bus could be done for relatively cheap, because the capital costs would merely be installing overhead between Carlton and Castle Frank's existing bus loop, and anywhere south of King (I'd advocate for Corus Quay). Then we can table a streetcar discussion until one day when ridership demands it.

 

[drum118]

It's too bad there would be too much capital cost to make a connection to Castle Frank station. That would be pretty cool to do for all us streetcar romanticists, and I'm supportive of converting any diesel bus to electric propulsion from an environmental and air quality perspective.

That said, here's an idea: bring back trolley buses. Converting Parliament to a trolley bus could be done for relatively cheap, because the capital costs would merely be installing overhead between Carlton and Castle Frank's existing bus loop, and anywhere south of King (I'd advocate for Corus Quay). Then we can table a streetcar discussion until one day when ridership demands it.

You will never see a trolley bus line in Toronto in service again, as its far cheaper to go battery.

The Parliament Streetcar has been brought up more than enough over the past 10 years with TTC kicking it to the side. It is still a line that can happen in time, but not in the top ranking at this time. The capital cost is not that expensive since you only have to pay for the extension north of Carlton and south of King St to connect to the QQE line. It should cost about $200 million to do it. TTC has stated it cost them $10 million per km for double track and someone else can get the real distant to see what the cost would be for today.

I should note 517 is dead and will not happen as plan. In fact, 517 was to go up Leslie St. The city doesn't even see a line on Unwin until 2060, if at all and why it was removed from the Master Transit Plan approved in 2006. The one issue is the Cherry St bridge that the city not willing to spend money on to fix it today or allow a line on it because of the cost to reinforce it. It should still be on the map as a future extension as plan.

524 will not make it south of the shipping channel. If it did, it would be to the old power plant, not as noted on the above plan.

 

[Cobra]

The bad news is that they will spend all that needed money on the Line 2 extension instead

That's a stupid comment that only serves to exacerbate the division Suburb vs. Downtown.

We're still awaiting the Waterfront Reset project details. One thing is clear, the city will have to pay for some of its projects, especially streetcars projects.

Congestion charge, sales taxes or other measures will have to be introduced. Scarborough has nothing to do with it

 

[dowlingm]

Can trolleybus wiring schemes actually coexist with pantos? It does seem like the past rather than the future *if* battery life and quick charging are proven out in both winter and summer scenarios in the same equipment.

 

[dowlingm]

That's a stupid comment that only serves to exacerbate the division Suburb vs. Downtown.

We're still awaiting the Waterfront Reset project details. One thing is clear, the city will have to pay for some of its projects, especially streetcars projects.

Congestion charge, sales taxes or other measures will have to be introduced. Scarborough has nothing to do with it

The city has a capital borrowing limit and political cowardice has no limit. Saying these things above doesn't make them true.

 

[drum118]

That's a stupid comment that only serves to exacerbate the division Suburb vs. Downtown.

We're still awaiting the Waterfront Reset project details. One thing is clear, the city will have to pay for some of its projects, especially streetcars projects.

Congestion charge, sales taxes or other measures will have to be introduced. Scarborough has nothing to do with it

Don't hold your breath for seeing much as well how it will be funded.

Any money for the Waterfront will have to wait until more detail cost of the white elephant is known as well when it will open. That will tell the city what it can spend on transit for the whole of Toronto, not just the Waterfront.

We have been waiting 3 years already as to when QQE was to be in service and going to be another 10 at the rate things are going.

The Waterfront Reset is to be built as cheap as it can be regardless how bad the weak links are to be, considering Transit was to be First from day one.

Miller said 10 years ago, QQE was was around the corner, but TTC is hold it up.

I am not a great fan of the current debit system and its time to pay the piper. There always will be a war between the downtown and suburb since the downtown has the lion share of riders in the first place that needs more of everything.

There are places in Europe where Trolley bus and Tram share the overhead, but not that much in the first place that I have seen. Trying to recall what Seattle was doing for the overhead in the tunnel section and could be wrong, but it was partly share.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

Miller said 10 years ago, QQE was was around the corner, but TTC is hold it up.

I though funding was the hold up as they wanted to try and get the business along QQE to help chip in for the rebuilding of that section much like the other business improvement districts across the city have but there wasn't any interest in them wanting to pay up. I could be wrong in that though.

 

[DSC]

I though funding was the hold up as they wanted to try and get the business along QQE to help chip in for the rebuilding of that section much like the other business improvement districts across the city have but there wasn't any interest in them wanting to pay up. I could be wrong in that though.

I have never heard of any BIA paying for transit infrastructure here in Toronto, I would be amazed if any have done so. They do (frequently) help pay for streetscape projects - work on Bloor, Front, College, Wellington etc).
Of course, there is actually no BIA on QQ East at the moment, which is not surprising as there are very few businesses on QQ east of Yonge. The Waterfront BIA is west of Yonge, the St Lawrence BIA is north of the rail berm.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

I have never heard of any BIA paying for transit infrastructure here in Toronto, I would be amazed if any have done so. They do (frequently) help pay for streetscape projects - work on Bloor, Front, College, Wellington etc).
Of course, there is actually no BIA on QQ East at the moment, which is not surprising as there are very few businesses on QQ east of Yonge. The Waterfront BIA is west of Yonge, the St Lawrence BIA is north of the rail berm.

I don't think it was necessarily paying for transit it was more they wanted to improve the streetscape and not have to pay as much for it and the Streetcar was going to be a bonus to the area.

 

[DSC]

I don't think it was necessarily paying for transit it was more they wanted to improve the streetscape and not have to pay as much for it and the Streetcar was going to be a bonus to the area.

OK, but Waterfront Toronto has plans to make QQE look like QQW - at the same time as they add the streetcar - so I doubt anyone will be spending much money on fixing up the street while that major work is still planned (if not funded!). I would say that the most we can expect would be that as buildings appear on the north side of the street (and they are coming) the north sidewalks get finished to the new standards, paid by the developers. I suspect that the south sidewalk and the street itself will not be fixed up until the LRT is built or a firm decision is made NOT to build it. (Of course, we have a hard time making firm transit decisions here!)