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New Land Transfer Tax

Indeed. I would have thought that Flipper and his ilk would be flipping annoyed by any potential new tax that might act like sand in the lubricant of their next flip.
 
I feel like I'm in a time warp. Is that show still on?

Any tax will serve to discourage the completion of transactions to which it is subject, to some extent at least. This tax is not exactly a step forward IMO.

The real problem, as pointed out many times, is the ongoing failure of both federal and provincial governments to share revenues with the municipalities. The two senior levels collect taxes which increase automatically as the economy gets better (income taxes, federal GST, provincial sales tax). The better the economy does, the better these governments do. That is not true of the municipal governments, whose revenue stream remains pretty much static. This has been a problem for years, and in spite of a bit of progress on gas taxes, there isn't much willingness in Ottawa or at Queen's Park to make major changes.
 
Yeah, just as big as that big chunk of change we all saved when the GST was lowered. Everyone felt richer as a result.

Seriously, anyone who ever bought a home knows that one percent is nothing. It doesn't hardly make a dent in the contingency fund you have to have. Real estate is a long term investment, not a short term one. If the flippers can't stand the heat, they should get into something less risky. Like Casino Rama.
 
I don't doubt that you pay taxes. There are probably more than a few members of this board who pay an order of magnitude more in taxes than yourself.

If you know of anything significantly wrong at City Hall, then take it to the authorities. I somehow doubt they're misspending $500M per year simply based on the fact that Toronto has been raising taxes the slowest over the last 5 years (most Ontario municipalities have been bumping rates far faster than Toronto), spending really hasn't increased since the Harris/Lastman term (you know, fiscal conservative types), and most of the spending increases are in provincially mandated programs.

Firts off, I really could not care less about flipping properties. That appears to be your concern.

As for taxes, yeah, what I pay is of concern to me. Tough if you disagree.

As you seem to enjoy casting vast generalizations, then I can then assume that you completely support provincial downloading onto the city and the cost burden that this has placed on the city. In turn, you would appear to support any tax that would increase city revenues without caring how that money will be spent. I hear plenty of noise about raising taxes, but I don't always hear about specific reasons as to why - except for the chorus of needing cash. But hell, that's not of any concern to you.

The point is that the province has shifted a greater burden of cost onto the city. The province has increased taxes to cover its shortfall, and now the city will be increasing taxes to cover the money no longer arriving from the province. But what the hell, why bother mentioning it, you appear to support all of this.

Hey I love generalizations, too! What the phuc!

(watching my language!!!)
 
Yeah, just as big as that big chunk of change we all saved when the GST was lowered. Everyone felt richer as a result.

Seriously, anyone who ever bought a home knows that one percent is nothing. It doesn't hardly make a dent in the contingency fund you have to have. Real estate is a long term investment, not a short term one. If the flippers can't stand the heat, they should get into something less risky. Like Casino Rama.

I'm not a flipper, but I'm sure it would hurt them. You're right it is a risky business, nevertheless that 1.5% would add up and be costly for high volume flippers and developers.

And for the regular home purchaser, yes you can say that new tax is not a lot, but the problem is there is already a land transfer tax and we are adding on to it. In a few years we can add another 1.5% and another a few years after that. How much is too much? I mean if you think about it a 10% land transfer tax really isn't too much, just a tenth of the home price and in the grand scheme of your funds it can be swallowed.
 
The entire foundation of tax collection and distribution is that everyone helps everyone out. If you require an expensive operation, the rest of the country subsidizes your surgery so you're not out 50 grand. If a billion dollar bridge is required to link one province to the mainland, the entire burden isn't placed on its 150,000 residents. But when Toronto needs money to expand its urban infrastructure, we have to raise the money ourselves? That is fundamentally wrong, and it's not how this country works. It's a double standard. Period.

And the province is not off the hook either. For every additional tax dollar collected by Toronto, that's one less tax dollar the province has to spend on this city. Logic therefore dictates that if the province saves $30,000 when someone sells their home, then that same person should get a $30,000 provincial tax refund. If I now have to pay $60 extra to renew my licence, then the provincial portion of the license renewal fee should drop by $60 to even things out.

Whatever the province saves through these new tax powers, it should give back to the very same Toronto residents from whom that money was taken. That and only that would be fair, although getting rid of these propose taxes in the first place would be even easier.
 
I'm not a flipper, but I'm sure it would hurt them. You're right it is a risky business, nevertheless that 1.5% would add up and be costly for high volume flippers and developers.

If a one percent increase is a deal breaker, than clearly they can't afford it and need to look at lower priced properties. Taxes are a cost of doing business.
 
I would have thought that Flipper and his ilk would be flipping annoyed by any potential new tax that might act like sand in the lubricant of their next flip.

Yes, they're annoyed BUT they would be more annoyed if prices stopped climbing, though prices falling significantly is an interesting scenario for those with deep pockets :). Massive cutbacks at city hall would do far more to hurt real-estate in Toronto, both in the short term and in the long run, than this new tax. The big players know what the alternatives are and realize this is the lesser evil; they will adjust their spreadsheets and continue on.

Of course, they would have been far happier if the province stepped in and did something (see Toronto Board of Trade demands) but we all know that isn't going to happen.

When the TBOT demands more spending on services and no additional taxation, you know they really mean they'll hold their nose on the additional taxation if service improvements are done well.


It's a bit like the St. Clair street rebuild. There is a small group making a bunch of noise but the real money was standing on the sidelines watching and smiling. Change, positive or negative, is usually good if you want to make money and know how what you're doing.
 
I'm not a flipper, but I'm sure it would hurt them. You're right it is a risky business, nevertheless that 1.5% would add up and be costly for high volume flippers and developers.

If a one percent increase is a deal breaker, than clearly they can't afford it and need to look at lower priced properties. Taxes are a cost of doing business.

Thank you mr. broken record
 
Yes, they're annoyed BUT they would be more annoyed if prices stopped climbing, though prices falling significantly is an interesting scenario for those with deep pockets :). Massive cutbacks at city hall would do far more to hurt real-estate in Toronto, both in the short term and in the long run, than this new tax. The big players know what the alternatives are and realize this is the lesser evil; they will adjust their spreadsheets and continue on.

What exactly are these many improved services city hall will provide to the home purchaser? Do you mean this new tax will now make municipal services more efficient in charging taxes? We have home inspectors and people who give permits to allow new developments who already charge money for their services. I don't understand how this tax would improve the real estate market in any way. I do see how this tax would discourage people from moving to Toronto and encourage people from living in the suburbs outside of it.
 
Anybody that's freaking out about a 1% tax probably isn't meant to live in Toronto anyway (Canada's most expensive city) so a one-way trip to the suburbs sounds about right.
 

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