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Montréal Transit Developments

too bad they ignored the west Island. The winners here are clearly Laval and Longueuil but to be fair, they've paid their share of Subway maintenance for years.

Montreal Mayor (incompetent and corrupted) should have took the opportunity to ask for the green line to go west and the blue line as well. Provincial government get that generous on public transit only once in a while...Missed opportunity...

Just like Miller not asking for DRL, complete Sheppard with is Transfert city.
 
West Island is barely dense enough to accomodate regular bus service. The only major corridor is along 20, and the solution there is to increase service on the commuter line. I'd think that if they extended the Metro along there, it would still be hard to beat the 211 Metrobus.

I really can't ever see the metro going to West Island. Perhaps one day it would make it as far as Dorval ... but not West Island. I am surprised they don't extend the Blue line to meet the commuter rail at Montreal West though ... that idea has been in the works for 30-years - thought he odd municipal politics in Cote-St. Luc, Hampstead, and Montreal West would probably be self-defeating.
 
A stop in NDG, Dorval and Fairview Pointe-Claire (which almost every west Island routes stop by) would be worth it.

Stations are not needed in Cote St-luc or Hamstead. The line could go straight to Cavendish which belongs to Montreal
 
A stop in NDG, Dorval and Fairview Pointe-Claire (which almost every west Island routes stop by) would be worth it.

Stations are not needed in Cote St-luc or Hamstead. The line could go straight to Cavendish which belongs to Montreal
Sure, but the distances involved make it difficult. It's 4 km to Montreal West; but then it's another 8 km to get out to Dorval. And after that another 12 km to get out to Fairview. That's 24 km total ... 20 km after Montreal West ... which is the total of the rest of the expansion. That's a long way, for a relatively small number of customers. Montreal West I expect one day ... Dorval eventually. I'd be surprised if it ever goes to Pointe-Claire!
 
Sure, but the distances involved make it difficult. It's 4 km to Montreal West; but then it's another 8 km to get out to Dorval. And after that another 12 km to get out to Fairview. That's 24 km total ... 20 km after Montreal West ... which is the total of the rest of the expansion. That's a long way, for a relatively small number of customers. Montreal West I expect one day ... Dorval eventually. I'd be surprised if it ever goes to Pointe-Claire!

Good point

then the solution would be the 2 AMT lines going throught the west island should have more frequent service off peak (30 minutes) and peak (10 minutes)
 
then the solution would be the 2 AMT lines going throught the west island should have more frequent service off peak (30 minutes) and peak (10 minutes)
Yes, I think that's the solution. And combined with the planned rail link to Dorval airport, it would more than serve ... and provide much quicker transit to downtown than a slow metro ride.
 
Now to stay on topic,

Do you guys think that the fact The Montreal Metro ambitious plan to extend the network by 33% will motivate the next mayor,Metrolinx and the Ontario government to refocus on Subway technology for the near future?

***I say next mayor because Miller is clearly living on another planet when it comes to transit.***
 
Now to stay on topic,

Do you guys think that the fact The Montreal Metro ambitious plan to extend the network by 33% will motivate the next mayor,Metrolinx and the Ontario government to refocus on Subway technology for the near future?

***I say next mayor because Miller is clearly living on another planet when it comes to transit.***
I really don't see how this is staying on topic.

Besides, Miller has already okayed 21 km of Toronto subway and SRT extensions ... similiar length to Montreal; 15 km is already fully-funded, and should be on-line before any of the Metro Extensions, except perhaps the new Pie-IX/Jean-Talon station. And another 9 km of streetcar-subway on Eglinton is fully-funded and should also be on-line before the Metro opens. And now Toronto is looking at a downtown line, with the first phase being at least 5 km. We're already well ahead of Montreal in terms of subway expansion, without even looking at the new surface LRT lines, and the massive GO expansion that dwarfs what AMT is doing.

I can't imagine any of his opponents moving faster!
 
Now to stay on topic,

Do you guys think that the fact The Montreal Metro ambitious plan to extend the network by 33% will motivate the next mayor,Metrolinx and the Ontario government to refocus on Subway technology for the near future?

***I say next mayor because Miller is clearly living on another planet when it comes to transit.***

Maybe the next mayor will be as obsessed with Montreal envy as you are. He will also convert our subways to rubber tires and reduce reliability so it's more like Montreal. :rolleyes:
 
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^
That is a stupid comment.

If the entire argument for LRT-to-the-future is that subways are some kind of ridiculously unpractical and super-expensive systems that can only be built with slave labor or in some kind of autocratic theme park like Dubai, then pointing out the expansion of metro systems elsewhere in Canada is totally legitimate.
 
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Maybe the next mayor will be as obsessed with Montreal envy as you are. He will also convert our subways to rubber tires and reduce reliability so it's more like Montreal. :rolleyes:

ha ha! very funny.

The point is that replacing a much needed subway extension with an LRT on Sheppard and upgrading the RT instead of a subway from Kennedy to STC is a mistake.

I was just wondering if the next mayor would rethink some of those projects.

And no I don't want Toronto to look like Montreal. God no, I left that city for many reasons...

I'm also wondering if the fact that subway construction being done by private contractors was the reason for the metro + the station (overbuild by our standards) being 150M/km.

Is it because TTC employee build the subway here?

If yes, can they find a way to make it less expensive?
 
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I'm also wondering if the fact that subway construction being done by private contractors was the reason for the metro + the station (overbuild by our standards) being 150M/km.

It is probably the same group of companies that builds most of the transit infrastructure in Toronto, Vancouver, and the rest of North America.


Many differences between Montreal and Toronto can contribute to construction cost differences:

1) Land quality/soil conditions

2) Building codes (Ontario's are likely stricter in the ways of fire safety)

3) Competition from private investment -- condo development is still rolling along sucking up huge resources. Pearson Airport rebuild caused a visible construction price increase across the city; these do too.

4) General wage, health and safety regulations, etc. Often the qualified companies (PCL, etc.) are the same in both provinces.

5) Materials pricing. Quebec isn't as picky about sources of things like aggregate.

6) Willingness to disturb locals during construction. Toronto often goes well out of its way to avoid closing streets which forces "just in time" delivery of materials and crews. Very significant communication overhead.

7) Advertised vs. actual budget. TTC will probably hit their numbers. Montreal has a bad habit of underestimating by a wide margin with the Laval metro expansion being a really good example (actual cost was 6 times the original budget; "only" doubling the price would be an improvement and in the same ballpark as TTC costs). Comparing costs after the fact is far more appropriate.

8) TTC includes (for the most part) storage, facilities, and rolling stock in its estimates. Montreal, to my experience in the past, has not.

9) Bidding process or transparency/fairness of government. Not surprisingly, the more controls in the bidding process the more work it becomes to bid and that pushes prices up. We seem to prefer spending $5 to monitor the process than risk losing $1 to questionable activities.
 
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The other biggies in cost difference is that they only require a single tunnel in Montreal, because of the narrow trains, and more co-operative geology (mostly tunelled in bedrock, rather than the unconsolidated sands that make up much of Toronto) ... and that the last metro extension blew the budget by a factor of 6. I doubt they have a factor of 6 this time, but there is a long, long, long, history of lowballing costs during the approval phase of projects in Quebec.
 

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