Metrolinx: Sheppard East LRT (In Design)

[Rainforest]

It would appear that way. Though I'm not sure why the Metrolinx estimates for Finch come in higher per km than Sheppard East, given the Sheppard East project needs all the tunnel between Consumers Drive to Don Mills, large-scale modifications to Don Mills station, the grade-separation at Agincourt, and an extra large yard, because the majority of it is actually for the SRT. It's not that I think Sheppard East is high ... I've never understood why Finch West is even higher, without those issues.

That's interesting indeed. Perhaps the main reason is that Finch has been pushed to 2015 - 2019, whereas Sheppard was supposed to be done in 2011 - 2014. That could account for a 15 - 20 % difference dependent on the construction cost inflation rate. If Finch gets moved up in the queue now, then we might expect it to get slightly less expensive.

 

[nfitz]

That's interesting indeed. Perhaps the main reason is that Finch has been pushed to 2015 - 2019, whereas Sheppard was supposed to be done in 2011 - 2014. That could account for a 15 - 20 % difference dependent on the construction cost inflation rate. If Finch gets moved up in the queue now, then we might expect it to get slightly less expensive.

No, that's not it. It's slightly higher (though almost the same) in 2010 dollars. By the time you look at the Metrolinx actual year of spending, Finch is much higher (and the SRT more so) as so much of the spending is in the last year of the budget ... by which point there is 59% inflation in Metrolinx's estimates (1.05^9.5 = 1.5896).

 

[quicksilver]

Which is why I was so pissed at Webster arrogant answer to Conc.Del Grande's question: Are there any plans to connect Sheppard east "in whatever form that may be" to the Scarborough Town Centre?

Webster just coldly answered: There's no plans to go to STC. People would have to get off and transfer to a bus to go to STC.

That's effective transit planning???
I hate the way he was fired because that made him look like a martyr but change was way overdue in TTC way of thinking about planning and project management

Just as a reminder, Stinz's February 5 motion has the SRT continuing on to Sheppard. So yes the SELRT will connect to STC and Centennial College, which by the way has 16,000 full-time and 22,000 part-time students.

 

[quicksilver]

If tunneling under the 404 is to happen regardless, and so many people are determined the Sheppard subway go to Victoria Park, why not stay with the heavy rail technology and make the transfer to LRT underground at Victoria Park? The cost difference would be minimal and the beef those people have with another transfer between Victoria Park and Yonge would disappear.

 

[rbt]

If tunneling under the 404 is to happen regardless, and so many people are determined the Sheppard subway go to Victoria Park, why not stay with the heavy rail technology and make the transfer to LRT underground at Victoria Park? The cost difference would be minimal ...

The cost difference would approach $700M.

LRT to the end of the line and Subway to Vic Park have the same price tag. The main reason is that the LRT comes aboveground before Consumers Road avoiding over 2km of tunnel (don't forget about tail tracks), 2 stations, a set of crossovers among other things.

 

[quicksilver]

The cost difference would approach $700M.

LRT to the end of the line and Subway to Vic Park have the same price tag. The main reason is that the LRT comes aboveground before Consumers Road avoiding over 2km of tunnel (don't forget about tail tracks), 2 stations, a set of crossovers among other things.

That is a big difference. Perhaps if there were only to be one more subway stop at Consumers or Settlers Rd. it might make sense. Straight line from Don Mills Station to Consumers is only 1.2 km.

 

[Paleo]

Why extend subway to Victoria Park? What if a future DRL goes up Don Mills to Seneca College?

 

[Dan416]

Why extend subway to Victoria Park? What if a future DRL goes up Don Mills to Seneca College?

What difference does that make? It's far from confirmed that the DRL will even make it up that far.

 

[jje1000]

Sounds like another TTC meeting is in the works, this time hosted by the citizen group SAFE (Subways Are For Everyone) on March 19, at 7:00 p.m. at the Scarborough Civic Centre. Judging from the brochures, it sounds like another astroturfed rally by the Fords. People, you've got to attend these rallies and hold your own information sessions or else more people will become misinformed!

http://ward39.blogspot.com/2012/03/town-hall-meeting-on-future-of-toronto.html

Brochure:
http://www.mikedelgrande.ca/documents/event20120319.pdf
Website:
http://www.notolrt.com/
Facebook (If you choose to repute their claims):
https://www.facebook.com/notoLRT

Some choice quotes to make your blood boil:

Claim: LRT’s could help alleviate traffic congestion in more neighbourhoods.

FACT: LRT expansion would increase noise and traffic congestion. Removal of lanes of traffic to accommodate street cars and LRT’s, both during and after construction, will result in traffic chaos.

Rebuttal: Sheppard construction?

Claim: LRT’s would reduce green house gases and smog

FACT: Increased traffic congestion from the addition of LRT’s to already busy streets will worsen pollution and traffic times. Congestion already costs the GTA $6 billion a year.

Claim: There is insufficient ridership numbers along Sheppard to justify subways.

FACT: The population of the GTA is expected to double in the next ten years. While a subway system delivers the capacity required to accommodate future growth in Toronto, an LRT is greatly restricted in its ability to accommodate future ridership.

 

[CanadianNational]

My Gawd. It's like pitchforks and torches out there.

One thing this group seems to have in common with the Fords is tone - and the "I'll cut off my nose to spite my face" stance.

These people have been had. They've been played by Ford with his empty election promises, and they don't want to admit it, or know where to put their fury. They're making it very difficult to feel sorry for them, however. They'd better be careful about wishing for nothing - that's one political goal that's easy to achieve.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

I agree if Sheppard LRT is so controversial AND the Sheppard Subway is such a mushroom cloud of a failure than why bother to ever serve that corridor at all. After all it is an unmitigated disaster according to some. Just build the other lines along with the Finch LRT that crosses the whole city (E and W) which should soak up some of the demand and let the Sheppard subway wallow in it's own mess.

 

[Justin10000]

Mike Del Grande is a joke of a councilor. That flyer is full of lies. Boston has 123 stations, and Chicago's system is larger than New York's?

How is a subway station with multiple entrances easier to police than a simple surface stop? God!

 

[Palma]

Great idea

 

[JoeParez]

My Gawd. It's like pitchforks and torches out there.

One thing this group seems to have in common with the Fords is tone - and the "I'll cut off my nose to spite my face" stance.

These people have been had. They've been played by Ford with his empty election promises, and they don't want to admit it, or know where to put their fury. They're making it very difficult to feel sorry for them, however. They'd better be careful about wishing for nothing - that's one political goal that's easy to achieve.

And this is what bothers me the most!
Even if Ford get's his "plan", which is the MOU -- they're still getting an LRT -- it's just underground! Same trains, same frequencies. I'm actually scared that the people of Scarborough feel that they're going to get an extensive system with the current subway trains in their borough. (I'm not trying to sound mean, or like a jerk -- it's just that we know the "underground plan" is LRT).

Eglinton is a go regardless of the outcome and if it's going to cost $8.2 billion just to put it underground (not to mention it's interlining with the current SRT layout) -- where is the Sheppard money going to come from and why hasn't anyone answered that or believe that it's going to either take a compromise or new funding sources to get it done?

This will probably get me in trouble here but, yes you can look to the Spadina-Vaughan extension -- but at the very least -- Vaughan is paying 1/3rd of the extension, +/- $352 million dollars worth, which would cover Vaughan's two stations.

 

[jje1000]

Mike Del Grande is a joke of a councilor. That flyer is full of lies. Boston has 123 stations, and Chicago's system is larger than New York's?

How is a subway station with multiple entrances easier to police than a simple surface stop? God!

Another good time to bring this back up:

This is how Ford intends to stop the Sheppard East LRT.