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Metrolinx: Sheppard East LRT (In Design)

Another 10 years. Now scarbrough gets nothing. I wonder if those along sheppard who opposes the LRT development have considered the positive effects that the LRT have on their property value.
 
k10ery said:
As to getting going on a small scale alternative, do any of us agree what that would be? BRT that eats traffic lanes will get no joy in the community I presume. What do you think? based on your previous writing I would have thought you would be a big proponent of SmartTrack.
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I'm a huge fan of chunks of SmartTrack, though don't yet know what if anything Tory can contribute. I'm mostly happy we have a mayor who isn't actively obstructing transit progress.

As for what should be done with Sheppard East, I have no idea and ceased to care much when my small business on Consumers Road effectively died. If locals really want everything or nothing, I'm content to let them take the nothing option.

If starting from scratch, I'd probably try for BRT or LRT on Finch East starting at Yonge and ignore the politics around Sheppard entirely. Both Finch East and York Mills have fairly high ridership and could use local improvements. Even a much longer Sheppard will struggle to attract many of these passengers due to the large block sizes (long walks)
 
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And so it begins. Here is some bullshit we can look forward to for many years to come now that the LRT is dead.

Scarborough councillor Jim Karygiannis planning to reintroduce Sheppard subway proposal.

“I’m ecstatic,” said Karygiannis, a staunch opponent of the light rail line on Sheppard. “I’m looking forward to resuming the battle for the Sheppard subway.”

Karygiannis said he wants to try and introduce the subway plan — again — in the fall, to coincide with the federal election. He argued the cost of a subway — which he estimated to be $1.5 billion but has been estimated as costing more than $4 billion — could be covered in part with federal money, extracted from vote-hungry parties in the 2015 election.

“They want to get people elected north of the 401 they better come to the table with some cash,” said Karygiannis. “If the Liberals want to win here they should speak to the residents of Wards 39, 40, 41 and 42. They got to say we want to work with you to get a subway here.”
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http://www.insidetoronto.com/news-s...ning-to-reintroduce-sheppard-subway-proposal/
 
BurlOak said:
That is not a major valley like the Bloor Street Viaduct. I would peg that cost at about $10,000/m2 x 4.5m wide x 2 (one track on either side of existing bridge) = $90M /km + cost of track, power, signalling, etc.

Elevated transit, whether above an existing road or a shallow to moderate valley, will cost about $120M/km to $150M/km. The bridge over the West Don River would actually be the cheapest part of this line.
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Agreed, elevating Line 4 between Sheppard Yonge and Downsview stations would be a great way to fill the gap between the two lines in a cost-effective manner... without requiring riders to take a 10 stop Finch LRT to get to the other line. Should definitely be studied as an alternative to underground.
 
howl said:
[tinfoilhat] All part of the plan to talk and talk and talk about transit to Scarborough but not actually build anything . . . ever. [/tinfoilhat]
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I don't think you need the hat.

Some politicians want Subway, some want LRT - but a large number want to continually delay because they are afraid of the consequences if they make a decision.
 
I read this on Steve Munro's blog:

From: Metrolinx Customer Relations <customerrelations@metrolinx.com>
Date: April 27, 2015 at 10:43:26 AM EDT

Dear [x]

Thank you for contacting us about the status of the Sheppard East LRT.

The Sheppard East LRT is fully funded and approved. The Sheppard East LRT underpass construction at Agincourt GO Station has been completed.

Preliminary design and engineering work will be happening over the next few years. Construction is expected to begin in 2017 and be completed by 2021.

I appreciate you taking the time to contact us.

Sincerely,

[x] Customer Service Representative
GO Transit, A Division of Metrolinx

http://stevemunro.ca/2015/04/27/finch-west-lrt-soon-sheppard-east-not-so/

What is going on? Is it starting construction in 2017 or 2021?
 
nfitz said:
The Sheppard East LRT budget was about $1 billion, though that didn't include the yard (which was part of the Scarborough RT replacement budget. So about $1.2 billion available. So roughly 4 km of subway. Hmm, might just be able to do it, if you just build one station at Bathurst, and another at Downsview.

Though I doubt the ridership justifies it in comparison to other projects. I'd think the Sheppard East LRT ridership would be higher entering Don Mills station.
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Ridership sometimes is not everything.

I think the benefits to connectivity in our transit network (and no, this goes beyond just painting lines on a map to look good) is a very justifiable reason for expansion. The great transit networks we laud in other cities are great for their connectivity and their diversity of transit route choices.

My only question mark is something that was brought up by 44 North in a previous page. Would Yonge Line users transfer on Sheppard to the less crowded Spadina line, or would the reverse happen with Spadina users transferring to an already overcrowded Yonge line? Such a thing should be studied before a Sheppard West extension happens.
 
This has also been discussed a few months earlier, but if the B-D extension happens then it is truthfully not a big distance to cover with subway on Sheppard.

Since the B-D route is not set in stone, the way I would do it is create a transit hub at Agincourt, have Sheppard Subway and B-D Subway both terminate at Agincourt. Have SmartTrack use the SRT ROW to reach Scarborough Town Centre and continue along the proposed SLRT route to Malvern (with future extension to Seaton on the books).

This way Sheppard Subway extension is a much shorter extension and only needs to have 4 stations built (Victoria Park, Warden, Birchmount and Agincourt), and Scarborough Town Centre has a much quicker commute downtown than they otherwise would have with the subway option. (And of course they're free to transfer to subway at Lawrence or whatever)

Sheppard east of Agincourt really does not need rapid transit.
 
nfitz said:
The Sheppard East LRT budget was about $1 billion, though that didn't include the yard (which was part of the Scarborough RT replacement budget. So about $1.2 billion available. So roughly 4 km of subway. Hmm, might just be able to do it, if you just build one station at Bathurst, and another at Downsview.

Though I doubt the ridership justifies it in comparison to other projects. I'd think the Sheppard East LRT ridership would be higher entering Don Mills station.
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I did the rough math a while ago, and a conversion of the subway to LRT plus a mostly at-grade extension to Downsview would also come in at about $1.2 billion. So there are certainly many options that can be undertaken with that money.

I think this type of solution will gain much greater acceptance after Eglinton opens, and people see how well the tunnel <-> surface connection works.

As an aside, if that conversion option is chosen, I wonder if there would be merit in creating an LRT spur off the main Sheppard LRT line at Consumers, with the line running into the core of the area. This would, in effect, be very operationally similar to a short turn at Don Mills, but would have the added advantages of: a) Serving the Consumers business park, and b) creating a loop off the main line that would make short turning much easier than if it was done on the main line right in Don Mills station.
 
WislaHD said:
My only question mark is something that was brought up by 44 North in a previous page. Would Yonge Line users transfer on Sheppard to the less crowded Spadina line, or would the reverse happen with Spadina users transferring to an already overcrowded Yonge line? Such a thing should be studied before a Sheppard West extension happens.
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They won't. Unless you're speaking of the East bus routes, which can be routed to new stations on the extension. There's no reason for someone who gets on at say, Finch or North York Centre to transfer at Sheppard to a train with less frequency. But the passengers already on line 4 will have the incentive to head over to the NW branch of line 1.
 
I'm pretty much of the belief now that Sheppard will only ever be a subway corridor. Not to suggest any subway extensions are happening soon, but the political appetite for subways-only on a line with a subway on it already is at least partly understandable.
 
Experiences in Paris and elsewhere seem to suggest that, in general, people aren't willing to trade additional travel time for extra comfort (for city-level journeys, long distance journeys are likely different). It seems that 99% of the people will simply deal with a quicker, more crowded journey than accept a longer journey with more space.
 
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