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Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

Swarley said:
I don't see how they could manage to award the contract before the new council comes in, even with their accelerated schedule.
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I agree, but things like that have been done before. Could be some fireworks during the remaining sessions of the current council.
 
Coruscanti Cognoscente said:
I agree. The 2 hour limit for GO trips is insufficient. It should be 4 hours, which is the amount of time you have to use a GO ticket after you've bought it.
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Hear, hear. Maintain the analog standard in the digital conversion.
 
TJ O'Pootertoot said:
I know I said it upthread but this isn't about superior tech or what's best for riders: it's merely a game of political chicken between Toronto and the province.
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Yeah, but ultimately, the province is Colonel Sanders.
 
This Star article on the situation really puts the absurdity into perspective:
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/art...payments-queen-s-park-tells-ttc-commissioners

In her letter, Transportation Minister Kathleen Wynne says she understands the desire for an open payment system.
“That’s why Presto is developing its next generation of devices to include the option of paying with a credit or debit card, or other mobile device,” she said.
The government has said that it will be at least three years before open payments are incorporated into Presto, however.
The TTC has suggested the system might be available in as little as two years without the expense of installing Presto electronic readers across all its buses and subways.
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So, it will take "at least three years" for Presto to have that tech but the TTC is spending $700,000 on the RFP alone, trying to get a contract passed by a lame duck council because THEIR system "might be available in as little as two years."

Well, now they've gone and sold me on the idea. Just think of the weeks and weeks we can enjoy the system when we'd otherwise have been waiting! Just think of the money we'll save (minus $700K in lawyer fees alone, of course!) on the Presto stuff, some of which is already installed!

It's almost enough to make you vote for Rob Ford.
 
TJ O'Pootertoot said:
It's almost enough to make you vote for Rob Ford.
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Ford most certainly would not be spending $400M on Presto (single sourced contract) instead of tendering to a number of agencies for something that could be had for $100M or less.

Vancouver is expecting to install an open-payment system for less than Ottawa is on the hook for installing Presto. Presto really is a flawed piece of technology (cards are active rather than just being used to identify a customer).


Once you pay a large amount to get Presto installed, you also have to get the system maintained. There is exactly 1 firm which can do that for Presto and they get to set their rate. There is zero chance of selling the technology or having it installed in convenience stores, etc. (they've already gone Open Payment).

An Open Payment backend will also be proprietary BUT you can swap it out with any other Open Payment based backend. As seen by the Vancouver and TTC tenders, there are a dozen companies actively interested in providing this type of service and knowledge. That means you can actually put out a tender and get competition to bid on a rate.


The province is trying to save face at the moment but I wouldn't be surprised if Presto ends up in scandal within 5 years for total money spent on the project and resulting in a highly proprietary system.
 
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TJ O'Pootertoot said:
This Star article on the situation really puts the absurdity into perspective:
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/art...payments-queen-s-park-tells-ttc-commissioners



So, it will take "at least three years" for Presto to have that tech but the TTC is spending $700,000 on the RFP alone, trying to get a contract passed by a lame duck council because THEIR system "might be available in as little as two years."

Well, now they've gone and sold me on the idea. Just think of the weeks and weeks we can enjoy the system when we'd otherwise have been waiting! Just think of the money we'll save (minus $700K in lawyer fees alone, of course!) on the Presto stuff, some of which is already installed!

It's almost enough to make you vote for Rob Ford.
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I guess you did not read the part of your quote that said
without the expense of installing Presto electronic readers across all its buses and subways.
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If the province wants the TTC to install the presto system then they should be footing the bill, otherwise they should get lost.

However I don't agree with the TTC trying to push this through now.
 
Voltz said:
I guess you did not read the part of your quote that said

If the province wants the TTC to install the presto system then they should be footing the bill, otherwise they should get lost.

However I don't agree with the TTC trying to push this through now.
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These funding things are never as simple as "you want it you pay for it"...didn't the TTC get funding for some stuff on the condition that they install Presto (I thought I read that)....would it be more palatable if the province paid the $400mil to install Presto but deducted it from the other stuff?
 
TOareaFan said:
These funding things are never as simple as "you want it you pay for it"...didn't the TTC get funding for some stuff on the condition that they install Presto (I thought I read that)....would it be more palatable if the province paid the $400mil to install Presto but deducted it from the other stuff?
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As far as I know the TTC is required to install Presto on new lines such as Transit City and other subway extensions in order to get funding for those projects, in which case the cost should be included in the funding for each line.
 
Voltz said:
As far as I know the TTC is required to install Presto on new lines such as Transit City and other subway extensions in order to get funding for those projects, in which case the cost should be included in the funding for each line.
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Metrolinx is buying the new LRTs for Sheppard East - they took over the option from TTC. If they want to pay to put Presto machines on them, all the power to them. I don't think there is any such clause on the Spadina subway extension ... but even then, they can always simply put machines in each of the 6 stations (presumably they will already for the 3 with entrances in York Region); TTC doesn't seem to have had any issues putting Presto machines in 9 stations already.
 
This thread was started in 2006, it's almost 2011 and Presto still hasn't panned out. Now their saying it will be 2014 before it's ready for open payments?
 
Yes, the whole thing is absolutely absurd - contracting to Accenture to do something that should be able to just have been implemented (i.e. copied implementation) from Singapore's MRT system. Why do you need a consulting firm, or anything else - just hire an existing agency that has already done it to implement it. Corruption or stupidity - I still do not know which.
 
The whole Milton line is now running on PRESTO. Also Kipling and Islington stations are up. Georgetown is the next line, scheduled to be done by mid-November.
MT and BT must be getting close to their launch.
A recent tweet from PRESTO says student fares are still scheduled to be available this fall.
Also HSR will start live testing PRESTO this month. No idea what that means exactly.
 
GenerationW said:
Apparently a decision has been put on hold until after the election:
http://www.insidetoronto.com/news/c...--ttc-puts-hold-on-approving-open-fare-system
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The tender isn't due until November 2010; I'm not sure what has been put on hold here.

GenerationW said:
Giambrone was desperate to ram this through but backed off when he failed to get enough support. That keeps his 2010 political average hovering around .000.
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I fail to see the need to start slurring councillors in threads that have nothing to do with this - particularly ones that have accomplished so much in a short period of time. I'll be happy if the next TTC chair accomplished half of what Giambrone accomplished in only 4 years.
 
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