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Lawsuit forces bus drivers to call out all stops

HSR has until the end of the year to install automatic voice stops announcement for all buses, pressured by the Ontario Human Rights Commission. At the same time GPS technology will be added. The city just spent something like $2.5 million for the technology. Motorola is the contractor.
 
"The Ontario Human Rights Commission contact with the City of Hamilton follows orders in the City of Toronto and the City of Ottawa to implement bus stop announcements of all bus stops in response to complaints in each of the two communities. It is expected by the OHRC that Hamilton will have system-wide bus stop announcement, manual or automated prior to year end."

That additional capital funding of up to $2,200,000 from the dedicated Federal Gas Tax for Transit Reserve, at an upset budget limit of $3,200,000 to expand the scope of the previously approved capital projects to include automated bus stop announcement and a Global Positioning Satellite (GPS)/Automated Vehicle Location (AVL) solution for the entire Transit Program (ATS and HSR), be approved. CARRIED

Within 6 months all HSR buses in Hamilton will have GPS that includes next stop voice announcement, Global Positioning Satellite (GPS)/ Automated Vehicle Location (AVL).
 
Excellent. I ride the TTC a few times a month when I'm in Toronto, and their automatic announcements have spoiled me. I was just wondering the other day when we'd be getting the automatic announcements, actually. When I was taking the bus back from Metronauts at McMaster, I missed my stop because I'd never been on the route before and it was pouring rain, causing the bus windows to be all fogged up. Nice to know that won't happen after this year.
 
This wouldn't be a problem if most drivers weren't so damn rude/angry/generally malevolent when you ask them to kindly point out when is Eglinton station or whatever. Now, not all drivers are like this - the majority of course are friendly - but I've asked 3 times in my life before the arrival of stop announcements and was greeted with a grunt or a snarl. fool me once, shame on me. but fool me 3 times?

what's good about this is not so much the stop announcements but the idea of transit systems having to add gps to their fleets - which opens the door for LED screens at transit shelters telling you the approx arrival time for the next bus, subway, streetcar or train. It's cold waiting for the bus in winter !
 
request
Good morning, my name is Marc Moll,

My name is Marc Moll. I was told that you are the right person to contact when it comes to the history of bus transportation in Canada Toronto.
Unfortunately, it is quite difficult to get information on this subject.
I had a discussion with a friend about bus transportation in the 70's, especially in the 80's and 90's. I will also be giving a presentation on this topic (public transportation) in class. l

My first question is: When did buses start having automatic announcements and stop displays?

Before there were automatic stop announcements and displays, did the bus driver have to announce the stops over the microphone?
Did bus drivers do this when they had to announce the stops themselves? Was this also done in practice?
Or how was a passenger supposed to know where the next stop was?

.
How did the bus drivers handle this? Did they follow it exactly, did most do it or only half, etc.? What percentage of bus drivers always announce the stops without being asked?
Did the announcements work equally well during the period mentioned (1970, 1980, 1990) or was it worse at the beginning or end of that period?


Are there many former bus drivers or others who rode the bus frequently during this time period (1970) or 1980/1990 who know what it was really like or experienced it themselves?



I look forward to your reply

With kind regards

Marc Moll
 
alexsheneal said:
So, according to CP24 that annoying David Lepofsky character has won another ruling. All TTC drivers must now call out the names of all stops, on all routes.

Am I the only one who thinks this is ridiculous?? If a visually impaired person would like to have stops called out, why can't they just ASK the bus driver when they board the bus?? Why force everyone in the entire city to be subjected to constant noise just for that tiny chance there might be a blind person onboard a bus.

Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against blind people. But I do have a problem with self-righteous idiots like David Lepofsky who keep wasting tax payers' dollars fighting for their causes rather than simply adapting to a system that already works. (Seriously, is it that hard to say "Can you please announce stops?" when you board a bus??)

Alex
Click to expand...
Does anyone have some info for me?
 
marc224 said:
Does anyone have some info for me?
Click to expand...

?

@AlvinofDiaspar provided you a link to this thread, as well as the human rights case that got this started.

His post was here: https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/threads/go-studies-bolton-rail-service.6512/post-1780659

Between those two, many of your questions are answered.

****

In terms of personal anecdotes, be patient, not everyone is reading every thread, every day.

****

May I suggest that you contact Steve Munro through his website; he may be willing and would certainly be capable of providing you some of the insights you desire.

www.stevemunro.ca

His contact email is here: https://stevemunro.ca/category/site-news/email/

****

I would also suggest you contact Mr. Lepofsky.

He has a Twitter Account:


I'm not sure if his email address is current, but this was it a few years ago:

dlepofsky @sympatico.ca

If you search his name and TTC on google, you'll find several articles discussing his fight for change.
 
Last edited:
Northern Light said:
?

@AlvinofDiaspar providing you a link to this thread, as well as the human rights case that got this started.

His post was here: https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/threads/go-studies-bolton-rail-service.6512/post-1780659

Between those two, many of your questions are answered.

****

In terms of personal anecdotes, be patient, not everyone is reading every thread, every day.

****

May I suggest that you contact Steve Munro through his website; he may be willing and would certainly be capable of providing you some of the insights you desire.

www.stevemunro.ca

His contact email is here: https://stevemunro.ca/category/site-news/email/

****

I would also suggest you contact Mr. Lepofsky.

He has a Twitter Account:


I'm not sure if his email address is current, but this was it a few years ago:

dlepofsky @sympatico.ca

If you search his name and TTC on google, you'll find several articles discussing his fight for change.
Click to expand...

I remember the Dark Ages when I'd frequently find myself crammed like a sardine on one of those high-floor, rattling GM boxes errr buses with windows that you couldn't see out of if you were standing (if they were even clean enough to do so) before automated stop announcements existed. Some drivers were kind enough to manually announce them - most didn't GAF. I often had no idea where I was in my journey and frequently had to guess if my stop was coming up. It was horrible and really soured the transit experience for me growing up in Toronto.
 
Towered said:
I remember the Dark Ages when I'd frequently find myself crammed like a sardine on one of those high-floor, rattling GM boxes errr buses with windows that you couldn't see out of if you were standing (if they were even clean enough to do so) before automated stop announcements existed. Some drivers were kind enough to manually announce them - most didn't GAF. I often had no idea where I was in my journey and frequently had to guess if my stop was coming up. It was horrible and really soured the transit experience for me growing up in Toronto.
Click to expand...
In the dark ages, the streetcar drivers tended to announce the stops. The bus drivers tended not to.

Today, we have transit apps that do not work correctly. Disappearing vehicles, arrival times that are more guesses than real time, or they count "out of service" vehicles as being in service.
 
Towered said:
I remember the Dark Ages when I'd frequently find myself crammed like a sardine on one of those high-floor, rattling GM boxes errr buses with windows that you couldn't see out of if you were standing (if they were even clean enough to do so) before automated stop announcements existed. Some drivers were kind enough to manually announce them - most didn't GAF. I often had no idea where I was in my journey and frequently had to guess if my stop was coming up. It was horrible and really soured the transit experience for me growing up in Toronto.
Click to expand...

Those buses were hell. Loud rattling, high pitch squealing breaks, no AC, rough bouncy ride. Sitting at the back of those old buses was like a thrill ride at Wonderland. I remember when i was a kid, my mom took my friend and I shopping, we were sitting at the back of the bus, and the bus jumped a curb, which sent my friend flying through the air like a rag doll, he landed about two rows away, 🤣 Luckily he wasn't hurt.
 
W. K. Lis said:
In the dark ages, the streetcar drivers tended to announce the stops. The bus drivers tended not to.

Today, we have transit apps that do not work correctly. Disappearing vehicles, arrival times that are more guesses than real time, or they count "out of service" vehicles as being in service.
Click to expand...
Hello ,

Thank you first of all for the interesting messages and effort and for forwarding the contacts.

I have to say that when I read your messages, at that time (for example in the 1980s).
Some bus drivers had little thought of service.

Passengers seemed to rely on the bus stop announcements and the behaviour of the bus drivers at that time was not ok.
There was nothing difficult about announcing the stops.

Did no one complain?
Had nothing improved then

I have relatives in Germany and Switzerland and I was told that 80 per cent of the bus drivers there always announced the stops without being asked.

How high would you estimate the percentage of bus drivers who always announced the stops or the most important stops in the 1980s?
Can you give me a rough estimate?

Many greetings

Marc
 
W. K. Lis said:
In the dark ages, the streetcar drivers tended to announce the stops. The bus drivers tended not to.
Click to expand...
I preferred the days when there were no stop announcements. Back in the 1980s as a lad I hadn‘t considered the visually impaired. I just liked the ride. Nowadays it’s announcement after announcement. This is the stop name, mind the doors, doors are closing, the next stop is, this the stop name, and repeat, plus wear a mask and other mundane repeated announcements. I’m a big proponent of “know where you’re going, go where you’re knowing”, so I use my phone to plan and track my route, ignoring the announcements.
 
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