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Langstaff Gateway, at Yonge and Hwy. 407

taal

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Notice I didn't say CityPlace downtown ... I mean cityplace on sheppard ... that's a great opportunity for employment land, why not any there?

I agree, downtown city place ... it's fine - it'd be nice to have a more mixed use community ... and by that I don't mean retail per say - live work units or the podium being offices.


But Sheppard (cityplace) and the waterfront development ... although I'm not sure about the exact plans - I'd like both of these to be more like the langstaff project in terms of employment
 

taal

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There is that new Canadian Tire office building that will be built beside Parkplace.

Right, by chance ... in no way was that part of the plan - also it's just one building, 500-1000 people?
 

lead82

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I'm not a big fan of the Langstaff gateway plan. It is too much density and this time it has terrible connections to the existing road system. It will have 1 road going north, and one connector east and west. That is insane. They are pushing for Yonge subway, but the subway even if extended can't really cope with more demand. The GO corridor wont really see much improvement over the next decade, as the winding nature of the lower half of the route will make it difficult to install all-day bi-directional service on this line.

Realistically their plan is doomed to fail due to poor transportation connections. It seems as if they expect many people to walk/take transit around. They are expecting the kind of transit use as midtown Toronto, and that simply wont happen with no matter how much density they put into this area. One thing I don't get is why would anyone even want to live here in such high density? The area will be bounded on one side by 2 highways and hydro corridor (problems: ugly, electro-magnetic field, dust from cars whizzing by), on the other side you have a large cemetery. Not everyone may want to look at a graveyard. Don't forget, that right in the middle you have a rail corridor. I prefer Richmond Hill's plan to intensify the existing big box stores, which are set back away from the highways, and have a better grid road network.
 

Ervin

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I'm not a big fan of the Langstaff gateway plan. It is too much density and this time it has terrible connections to the existing road system. It will have 1 road going north, and one connector east and west. That is insane. They are pushing for Yonge subway, but the subway even if extended can't really cope with more demand. The GO corridor wont really see much improvement over the next decade, as the winding nature of the lower half of the route will make it difficult to install all-day bi-directional service on this line.
Consider the fact that this will take years to build. By the tame any substantial number of people will settle in, the TTC will have new, bigger automated trains, Yonge-Bloor will recieve it's upgrades, the DRL (hopefully) won't be far from starting construction, and the Richmond Hill line will be extended which will hopefully include more trains. Difficulties with transit isn't going to fail this project, transit can be improved. If anything this is giving the transit operators more customers, and thus helping with the operational costs of these extensions, and underlining the need for further improvemnts to the system.
 

TJ O'Pootertoot

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The catch with Langstaff, as lead82 says, is that there's tonnes of transit infrastructure right there, but it's not all coordinated. They're trying to figure out the integration of GO/TTC etc but any way you slice it, people from mid-Langstaff will have to go a few hundred metres up to the transit hub. There will be some kind of circulator bus (and maybe PRT down the road).

Personally, I find it doubtful they will hit their full density target. But, as pointed out elsewhere, this is over the course of DECADES. Everything is phased so virtually nothing will go forward without the subway approval (and if approved today, it would take like 8 yrs to build) and if they're not hitting their ambitious modal split targets (60%!) further phases will be pro-rated downwards.

You have to admire the ambition...but I agree they might be too ambitious in some respects.
Oh, and WK Lis is likely wrong about the fare issue. I don't think there's any doubt some kind of new fare system is coming into play over the next few years.
 

scarberiankhatru

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If memory serves me correctly, Langstaff is proposing more units than CityPlace, and in more buildings. Concord has been going full steam ahead since the 90s and is, what, barely over half done? Langstaff won't be finished in less than 20 years even if all phases proceed immediately...this isn't Dubai, where 30 cranes pop up to build 30 buildings simultaneously. Maybe it'll be built out by 2040 - even if the Yonge subway extension and revamped GO service is delayed by years or a decade, that may not hurt Langstaff's progress.

One thing I don't get is why would anyone even want to live here in such high density? The area will be bounded on one side by 2 highways and hydro corridor (problems: ugly, electro-magnetic field, dust from cars whizzing by), on the other side you have a large cemetery. Not everyone may want to look at a graveyard. Don't forget, that right in the middle you have a rail corridor.

Then how do you explain the unending parade of condos near the raillands/Gardiner or the huge cluster of towers at Davisville overlooking Mount Pleasant Cemetery? A good 2/3 of the units in Langstaff will be facing other buildings and the interior roads and parks, anyway.
 

lead82

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Then how do you explain the unending parade of condos near the raillands/Gardiner or the huge cluster of towers at Davisville overlooking Mount Pleasant Cemetery? A good 2/3 of the units in Langstaff will be facing other buildings and the interior roads and parks, anyway.
The difference is that cityplace is downtown, and people love to live near all the action. This is not downtown.
 

scarberiankhatru

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The difference is that cityplace is downtown, and people love to live near all the action. This is not downtown.

So it has nothing to do with actually being near a highway or a cemetery...that's what I thought. If it was, the West Don Lands would be doomed.

Shockingly, some people base their home purchases on more than just the number of trendy bars within cheap taxi fare distance. If they did want to be at the centre of the action, they'd probably want to live north of the rail corridor and not next to the Gardiner.
 

canarob

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from: http://www.yorkregion.com/news/article/1035564--mini-manhattan-approved

‘Mini Manhattan’ approved
But Richmond Hill opposes Markham’s desire to move ahead with Langstaff Gateway

Langstaff Gateway.

CONSTRUCTION LEADS TO ROAD CLOSURE
If you drive on Langstaff Road, you may need to find an alternate route starting next week.
The road will close between Huntington Road and Hwy. 27 from July 4 to Aug. 8 for construction work.
The work includes regrading and construct a new crossing at Rainbow Creek.
Local traffic will still be allowed on the stretch.
This is the third and final closure of Langstaff for improvements, dating back to November 2010.
Markham can finally move forward with what its mayor describes as “the leading urban growth centre in North America†but not everyone is happy about it.
Regional council gave its approval last week to Markham’s secondary plan for the Langstaff Gateway.
The approval allows developers and the town to move forward with the first phase, totalling 5,000 units, on the island of land between Bayview Avenue and Yonge Street, south of Hwy. 407.
A motion by Richmond Hill Mayor Dave Barrow to hold off for a few months failed to pass. He and his fellow Richmond Hill councillors raised concerns about the region putting the cart before the horse, approving Markham’s local plan while a regional official plan amendment governing both Markham and Richmond Hill awaits approval.
“I agree it would be the leading growth centre in North America, but it has to be looked at in context of other growth in the area,†Mr. Barrow said. “We seem to be here looking at it as two halves.â€
The growth centre is one of 25 earmarked by the province for high-density development, but it’s the only one split between two municipalities, roughly bisected by Hwys. 7, 407 and the hydro corridor. The confluence of transit — Viva, YRT and a future subway and rapid transit along Hwy. 407 — has lead to planners envisioning it as a “Union Station North,†with densities exceeding the provincial minimums by as much as 500 per cent.
When fully developed decades from now, the entire site should house about 48,000 residents and 30,000 jobs.
“We had a process here. We agreed to it and now we’re being told to push it aside because half the partners are ready to proceed,†Richmond Hill Regional Councillor Brenda Hogg said.
Markham Mayor Frank Scarpitti told concerned Richmond Hill officials that the official plan amendment was based on the principles in Markham’s plan and there was neither a conflict nor any new information that would change things before that amendment comes before regional council for final approval in the fall. The town spent four years developing the plan and already waited 18 months to co-ordinate efforts with Richmond Hill, which is still months away from its own detailed plan for the north half.
“We’ve been single-family low-rise ... and to step outside of that, to have a bold vision to go beyond what’s been typical... all of a sudden, people pay a lot of attention,†Mr. Scarpitti said.
Regional planning commissioner Bryan Tuckey agreed the plan was sound and there was no reason to delay approval.
Richmond Hill already approved 2,000 units and Markham can soon go forward with 5,000 more along with crucial infrastructure such as new roads.
When the Yonge subway extension is announced, another 2,000 units will be available across the site but the highest densities will only be achieved when the subway opens, followed by the launch of the 407 Transitway bus service.
The plan includes numerous sustainable features including on-site energy, a rehabilitation of Pomona Creek in Thornhill and a target of up to 70 per cent of trips taking place by transit rather than cars.
Both Richmond Hill and Vaughan sent letters officially questioning how Markham would achieve its densities and what they would mean for the surrounding area.
Further stoking the fires at a planning committee meeting the previous week was Pat Berne, representing Yonge-Bayview Holdings.
The ownership group that includes Metrus owns 14.5 acres on the Richmond Hill side and has long-term leases for properties such as SilverCity, precisely where the region aims to construct a transit hub. They are displeased with the lack of co-operation so far, Mr. Berne said.
“I’m not being negative, I’m being practical,†he said, warning the region they have no backup if the subway doesn’t materialize and urging flexibility in the plan.
Because Markham’s plan is transit-dependent, phasing is crucial. Regional monitoring will ensure development does not proceed without adequate infrastructure.
“This is not carteblanche at all ... there’s a lot more to be done,†regional chairperson Bill Fisch said.
 

shortbranch

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I see Beaver Valley Stone has relocated and they have cleared the land. Anyone know of a future development here?
 

innsertnamehere

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First phase rezoning application is finally in. Condrain has been on site doing remediation for a while now, so I've been expecting this to turn up at some point. IBI, max height of 154m.

Langstaff 4.JPG

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