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Benjamin Hemric
New Member
Hi! I'm a new poster from NYC, and I've never been to Toronto. (But would love to visit someday -- as I've heard only positive things about it.) I'm doing research for some articles on Jane Jacobs that I hope to eventually write (but, so far, I am unpublished -- so don't hold your breath) and would like to make a comment and ask some questions that relate to Jacobs and Toronto.
Comment:
Although I'm not sure if I agree with the protestors' end point or not (regarding the proposed rezoning of Coney Island), it is indeed a very funny, attention getting, and clever (getting the message across) protest! It's interesting that the Jacobs image (e.g., conservative suit, pearls and GLOVES!) chosen by the protestor in the above photograph seems to from Jacobs' don't demolish Pennsylvania Station protest, circa 1962.
Questions:
1) I've recently been reading about Jacobs' role in the construction of Dundas-Sherbourne Lanes (now called, I believe, Dan Harrison Community Complex), what neighborhood (or "neighbourhood"!) is this complex in? Would this be considered Cabbagetown?
2) (I realize that this controversy may be ancient history, as most posters I've run across on the internet seem to be too young to remember what happened in 1973, but I thought, "Why not ask anyway?")
Most accounts agree that this controversy had a number of stages, but they are unclear about the early stages of the project. One account seems to imply that the very first proposal involved the construction of a high-rise for high income people, but that the developer's request for a rezoning was thwarted by community groups and so the developer then entered into a deal with provincial authorities to build a high-rise (or high-rises) for low-income people instead.
I get the impression from the internet, though, that this area is not only considered a rough area now but that it has been considered a rough area "all along." Does anyone know (or have any suggestions as to how I can find out) if the projects that have been proposed for this site have always been state-assisted housing for low-income people, or whether there was a time in the early 1970s when the area might have been considered "right" by a developer for affluent people ("gentrifiers") also. (Although I'm just beginning my research, it's fascinating to learn that another development, St. Jamestown, seems to have been built for affluent people but that it wound up for less affluent people instead. So although I'm skeptical from my readings so far that Dundas-Sherbourne in 1972-1973 was considered a good site for high-income high rises, maybe it was?)
3) From an admittedly superficial look via the Google satellite map, it seems that most high-rises in Toronto are of what I would call the "tower-in-the-park" or "tower-on-a-podium" (with parking, maybe, on the lower floors?) type. Does Toronto have any sections where the high-rises resemble those in New York or Philadelphia (or, from what I hear, Chicago), where an apartment house fills out the building plot (and there are no spaces between it and the buildings next door) and has stores (or doctor's offices, in non-commercial districts) on the ground floor?
4) This is more of a general question (not for the article that I'm now trying to write, but maybe for a future one): I'd always thought that Manhattan was the only place with blocks that are too long, but looking at the Google maps of Toronto, Toronto seems to have more long blocks than Manhattan. Does anyone know if Jacobs ever suggested that Toronto might be better off with shorter blocks and, if so, what the reaction was?
Thanks in advance for any thoughts and suggestions that anyone might have!
Regards,
Benjamin Hemric
Thurs., October 22, 2009 -- 11:08 p.m.
Comment:
Although I'm not sure if I agree with the protestors' end point or not (regarding the proposed rezoning of Coney Island), it is indeed a very funny, attention getting, and clever (getting the message across) protest! It's interesting that the Jacobs image (e.g., conservative suit, pearls and GLOVES!) chosen by the protestor in the above photograph seems to from Jacobs' don't demolish Pennsylvania Station protest, circa 1962.
Questions:
1) I've recently been reading about Jacobs' role in the construction of Dundas-Sherbourne Lanes (now called, I believe, Dan Harrison Community Complex), what neighborhood (or "neighbourhood"!) is this complex in? Would this be considered Cabbagetown?
2) (I realize that this controversy may be ancient history, as most posters I've run across on the internet seem to be too young to remember what happened in 1973, but I thought, "Why not ask anyway?")
Most accounts agree that this controversy had a number of stages, but they are unclear about the early stages of the project. One account seems to imply that the very first proposal involved the construction of a high-rise for high income people, but that the developer's request for a rezoning was thwarted by community groups and so the developer then entered into a deal with provincial authorities to build a high-rise (or high-rises) for low-income people instead.
I get the impression from the internet, though, that this area is not only considered a rough area now but that it has been considered a rough area "all along." Does anyone know (or have any suggestions as to how I can find out) if the projects that have been proposed for this site have always been state-assisted housing for low-income people, or whether there was a time in the early 1970s when the area might have been considered "right" by a developer for affluent people ("gentrifiers") also. (Although I'm just beginning my research, it's fascinating to learn that another development, St. Jamestown, seems to have been built for affluent people but that it wound up for less affluent people instead. So although I'm skeptical from my readings so far that Dundas-Sherbourne in 1972-1973 was considered a good site for high-income high rises, maybe it was?)
3) From an admittedly superficial look via the Google satellite map, it seems that most high-rises in Toronto are of what I would call the "tower-in-the-park" or "tower-on-a-podium" (with parking, maybe, on the lower floors?) type. Does Toronto have any sections where the high-rises resemble those in New York or Philadelphia (or, from what I hear, Chicago), where an apartment house fills out the building plot (and there are no spaces between it and the buildings next door) and has stores (or doctor's offices, in non-commercial districts) on the ground floor?
4) This is more of a general question (not for the article that I'm now trying to write, but maybe for a future one): I'd always thought that Manhattan was the only place with blocks that are too long, but looking at the Google maps of Toronto, Toronto seems to have more long blocks than Manhattan. Does anyone know if Jacobs ever suggested that Toronto might be better off with shorter blocks and, if so, what the reaction was?
Thanks in advance for any thoughts and suggestions that anyone might have!
Regards,
Benjamin Hemric
Thurs., October 22, 2009 -- 11:08 p.m.
adma
Superstar
It's a little "involved" for me to presently address all points in your post, but re
Said image isn't of a "Jane Jacobs" protestor. It's of Lady Gaga.
Said image isn't of a "Jane Jacobs" protestor. It's of Lady Gaga.
Benjamin Hemric
New Member
Although I've heard of Lady Gaga, I'm only vaguely familiar with her. (I only looked her up on the internet a few weeks ago.) So, I suppose that helps explain the "thingy" on the top of the wig, which I thought was just a protestor's -- "I can't help myself" -- creative, modern "twist" on the Jacobs' image.
But I hope people do get a chance to check out a photo of Jacobs at the Save Pennsylvania Station protest -- it does indeed seem like it could be the inspiration for such a "look" (minus the thingy).
Thurs., October 22, 2009 -- 11:59 p.m.
But I hope people do get a chance to check out a photo of Jacobs at the Save Pennsylvania Station protest -- it does indeed seem like it could be the inspiration for such a "look" (minus the thingy).
Thurs., October 22, 2009 -- 11:59 p.m.
wwwebster
Active Member
“Austin Bramwell on the urban wisdom of Jane Jacobsâ€
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/cobblestone-conservative/
“A TAC symposium on Jane Jacobs's classic on urban life and city planningâ€
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/janejacobs/
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/cobblestone-conservative/
“A TAC symposium on Jane Jacobs's classic on urban life and city planningâ€
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/blog/janejacobs/
RC8
Senior Member
That American Conservative article is quite silly. They depict Jane Jacobs as a right wing reactionary that didn't care for the poor.
In reality she fled the US as she opposed the Vietnam war, helped design social housing in Toronto, and publicly sided with Miller's NDP.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
Robert Moses wrote a response to Robert Caro's book "The Power Broker". It is a 23-page typed, double-spaced letter, that has been published by the Bridge and Tunnel Club. See this link for the entire 23-page letter.
Robert Caro wrote a response to Robert Moses' Response to Robert Caro's "The Power Broker". See this link, its a lot shorter.
BTW. Robert A. Caro's book "The Power Broker" is about 1,100 pages.
Robert Caro wrote a response to Robert Moses' Response to Robert Caro's "The Power Broker". See this link, its a lot shorter.
BTW. Robert A. Caro's book "The Power Broker" is about 1,100 pages.