GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[aquateam]

This line of thought appears to have little more to it than:

1. Federal government funding.
2. ??????
3. Public transit utopia!

Just to play devil's advocate:

1. Federal government funding.
2. Public transit projects actually get built because they have funding
3. Public transit utopia

Not that I'm in favour of the Feds having too active a role. Otherwise you get situations where municipalities greatly overbuild because they can get "free money" from the feds, like how the US has all those pork-barrel projects. Then you get scenarios where municipalities feel "entitled" to subways or infrastructure that is unjustified and that they would never consider if it weren't for the fact that taxpayers on the other end of the country were paying for it.

Ideally you'd have some big federal fund that doles out money to projects of regional significance that already have matching provincial and municipal commitments. Quebec/Windsor HSR, Calgary-Edmonton HSR, the DRL, Vancouver's broadway line, Montreal's Champlain LRT to Longeuil, these would all be candidate projects for federal funding.

 

[mdrejhon]

To Canada's credit, many of our big-city transit have better farebox recovery than a lot of US cities. As much as Canadian transit wrangling is a big headache, one has to see the grander transit circus that some U.S. cities has, and that many end up having extremely poor farebox recovery (like a quarter for every dollar, for some of them).

 

[wopchop]

http://news.nationalpost.com/full-c...ransit-projects-in-biggest-cities-sources-say

this is good news

Although nowhere close to enough, especially considering it is an amount to be shared among the largest cities.

Only now they announce this, in an election year? Whatever. We need a new government.

So the budget dropped ...

Finance Minister Joe Oliver’s budget promises a Public Transit Fund of $750 million over two years starting 2017-18, increasing to $1 billion per year by 2019 per year. But details are slim, including how much Toronto can expect.

The federal government, however, is looking at using the $1 billion annually when it gets there to finance transit in a different way, a government official told the Star.
Rather than traditionally contributing one-third toward a transit project, Ottawa says the province or territory would cover off the federal portion and in return the feds would pay the interest and principle on that loan over 20 or 30 years. Federal officials says approaching it from that way means it can fund many different projects right across the country.

So really, this budget does nothing. Almost all the promises come into full effect in about 3 years.

 

[TOareaFan]

The federal government, however, is looking at using the $1 billion annually when it gets there to finance transit in a different way, a government official told the Star.
Rather than traditionally contributing one-third toward a transit project, Ottawa says the province or territory would cover off the federal portion and in return the feds would pay the interest and principle on that loan over 20 or 30 years. Federal officials says approaching it from that way means it can fund many different projects right across the country.

That is an interesting approach....even at 5% with a 25 year amort and semi-annual compounding (ie. the way Canadian Mortgages are but not traditional government bonds) that /$750,000,000 would allow for $10.7B of borrowing that would be reduced to zero over 25 years and with no interest cost to the province/city that borrowed it.

On a more basic simple interest basis at 5% and all you want to do is pay the interest would allow $15B of borrowing.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

To Canada's credit, many of our big-city transit have better farebox recovery than a lot of US cities. As much as Canadian transit wrangling is a big headache, one has to see the grander transit circus that some U.S. cities has, and that many end up having extremely poor farebox recovery (like a quarter for every dollar, for some of them).

This is fine but this is what allows the TTC, Mississauga, Durham and others to raise fares to 3.50 plus, because we have no subsidy and we'll pay. GO Transit has a weak subsidy as well. We have to fix that

(just to get this thread back on track.)

 

[BurlOak]

Ah, come on! Martin invented the earmarked gas tax transfer - you want to give Harper all the credit just because he never killed it?

Maybe we should give Mulroney credit since he brought in the GST - without the money, there would have been nothing for Martin and Harper to give.

 

[k10ery]

The federal government, however, is looking at using the $1 billion annually when it gets there to finance transit in a different way, a government official told the Star. Rather than traditionally contributing one-third toward a transit project, Ottawa says the province or territory would cover off the federal portion and in return the feds would pay the interest and principle on that loan over 20 or 30 years. Federal officials says approaching it from that way means it can fund many different projects right across the country.

Such a tone-deaf approach - as usual from these guys. The provinces don't want that debt on their books, they wany upfront cash from Ottawa. Why, Ontario just decided to sell its largest Crown corporation to finance transit, just so it could avoid issuing any more debt. Harper seems to rubbing Wynne's nose in it ... again!

 

[DavidH]

So the budget dropped ...
So really, this budget does nothing. Almost all the promises come into full effect in about 3 years.

First of, the budget absolutely does something. It bribes the public into a hoped-for reelection of the Conservatives.

Secondly, Steve Munro tweeted last night that it appears much of the transit money is a repurposing of the existing gas tax monies, but with more restrictions on usage.

 

[wopchop]

First of, the budget absolutely does something. It bribes the public into a hoped-for reelection of the Conservatives.
.

I had thought of that, and I suppose that it is "something" in the most meaningless sense of the word.

 

[k10ery]

I had thought of that, and I suppose that it is "something" in the most meaningless sense of the word.

Steve wasn't wrong, just a bit off point. The 750 million in indeed new money. But as usual they also announce again all the old money including the gas tax in the budget. It's confusing if you aren't use to reading the document.

Edit: sorry that was supposed to be a reply to David H's comment on Steve Munro

 

[christiesplits]

Public drinking on GO trains

http://www.blogto.com/city/2015/04/go_transit_cracking_down_on_illegal_drinking_on_trains/

 

[TOareaFan]

http://www.blogto.com/city/2015/04/go_transit_cracking_down_on_illegal_drinking_on_trains/

this seems appropriate. I am not, in anyway, opposed to alchohol consumption...nor would I be opposed to legal alcohol consumption on our trains. What I don't like is the creeping "rules don't matter" culture around events and, from observation, the few that just ignore the rules are more likely the type of people that would ignore other conventions like littering (I don't go to Jays games but the amount of discarded cans on GO trains and around GO stations for TFC matches is disturbing), loud behaviour to the extent it affects others enjoyment.

Again, just anecdotal, but the sort of people that might quietly, and unobtrusively, enjoy a beer on the way to an event don't do it because it is against the rules....they type that will take it to an extreme don't care about the rules .....or their fellow passengers.

 

[hihihi]

is UT planning on running a front page story on the recent $13.5Bn RER announcement? Looking forward to it if so...

 

[gweed123]

this seems appropriate. I am not, in anyway, opposed to alchohol consumption...nor would I be opposed to legal alcohol consumption on our trains. What I don't like is the creeping "rules don't matter" culture around events and, from observation, the few that just ignore the rules are more likely the type of people that would ignore other conventions like littering (I don't go to Jays games but the amount of discarded cans on GO trains and around GO stations for TFC matches is disturbing), loud behaviour to the extent it affects others enjoyment.

Again, just anecdotal, but the sort of people that might quietly, and unobtrusively, enjoy a beer on the way to an event don't do it because it is against the rules....they type that will take it to an extreme don't care about the rules .....or their fellow passengers.

Agreed completely. Increase enforcement of public intoxication, but loosen the laws surrounding public drinking. Coming in for Jays games on the GO Train, I have an hour to kill before I get there. I definitely wouldn't mind cracking open a beer or two to avoid having to pay 10x as much for even worse beer inside the stadium.

Or better yet, have GO create a Bar Car on each of their trains. I would suspect that would be pretty popular for rush-hour commuters on their way home. Serve coffee in the AM, drinks in the PM.

 

[JayBeeGooner]

I'm all for public drinking on GO trains, as long as the alcohol is in non-glass containers. You don't want broken glass.