LNahid2000
Senior Member
I think this is an error on the Niagara schedule. The 17:00 train still shows on the new Lakeshore West schedule:
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GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)
- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
Allandale25
Senior Member
With only hourly service, it's much harder to respond to an increase in running time without adding another train, especially when you're looking at a route cycle time of around 4 hours (assuming thru-running between LSE and LSW). When you're running 15 min headways and running times increase as a result of construction, it's a lot easier to scale back to 20 min frequencies to keep the same route length and number of trains.
If they wanted to keep the same number of trains operating AND keep West Harbour, I suspect they would have needed to scale headways back to 1h10m or 1h15m, neither of which is preferable, because it impacts everyone on both LSE and LSW. Dropping West Harbour at least only inconveniences those going to West Harbour.
I suspect that once they have an additional train crew available, we'll see West Harbour return, with a lot more recovery time at West Harbour and Oshawa, with maybe a few extra minutes thrown in at Union too.
If they wanted to keep the same number of trains operating AND keep West Harbour, I suspect they would have needed to scale headways back to 1h10m or 1h15m, neither of which is preferable, because it impacts everyone on both LSE and LSW. Dropping West Harbour at least only inconveniences those going to West Harbour.
I suspect that once they have an additional train crew available, we'll see West Harbour return, with a lot more recovery time at West Harbour and Oshawa, with maybe a few extra minutes thrown in at Union too.
Allandale25
Senior Member
I'll just note that there is a Metrolinx board meeting coming up in case anyone wants to do a written deputation. There's been some constructive comments here and feedback on the rolling of of schedules, online version vs PDF schedule versions, and opinions on communication in explaining what is happening and why/why not. I think they tried to address some of the over-arching issues via that blog post I linked to above and in the GOExpansion twitter replies.
The letter will get a URL for the PDF which could then be sent to the Minister/MPPs.
The letter will get a URL for the PDF which could then be sent to the Minister/MPPs.
crs1026
Superstar
FWIW I took in the Jays last night, coming home on LSW. The 22:45 Union-West Harbour train took a 20 minute delay at Union, because a) it took that long to load, to absolute full and b) it then took that long for the crew to clear several passenger alarms - which under the crowded conditions required instructing enough passengers to offload to allow crew and security to enter the coaches and verify that the alarm was false. It did appear that one of the alarms involved a passenger who possibly fainted but was not seriously ill.
When the train reached Exhibition, that platform was quite full of passengers but only a few managed to board (mostly by being utterly aggressive).
There were plenty of GO security people at both Union and Exhibition, and they were attentive as far as ensuring that the crowding would not prevent the doors from closing - but did not attempt any real crowd control. There were announcements about how there was another train following, but that only had any credibility by virtue of the first train being delayed. There was a lot of grumbing about "yeah, sure"...which I can't blame people for making.
I have to say that having the upper levels of bilevel coaches that full of people is profoundly unsafe and cause for concern. Unless someone pulled the emergency brake (from the lower level, so unreachable from upstairs) and brought the train to a stop, even the emergency window exits would be unusable.
It's a single point of data, but it says to me that the situation is not merely inconvenient or needing improvement - but actually rather desperate.
ML brass need to publicly acknowledge it as such. If GO can't handle easily predicted peak crowds on a Tuesday evening....
- Paul
When the train reached Exhibition, that platform was quite full of passengers but only a few managed to board (mostly by being utterly aggressive).
There were plenty of GO security people at both Union and Exhibition, and they were attentive as far as ensuring that the crowding would not prevent the doors from closing - but did not attempt any real crowd control. There were announcements about how there was another train following, but that only had any credibility by virtue of the first train being delayed. There was a lot of grumbing about "yeah, sure"...which I can't blame people for making.
I have to say that having the upper levels of bilevel coaches that full of people is profoundly unsafe and cause for concern. Unless someone pulled the emergency brake (from the lower level, so unreachable from upstairs) and brought the train to a stop, even the emergency window exits would be unusable.
It's a single point of data, but it says to me that the situation is not merely inconvenient or needing improvement - but actually rather desperate.
ML brass need to publicly acknowledge it as such. If GO can't handle easily predicted peak crowds on a Tuesday evening....
- Paul
Allandale25
Senior Member
^ remind me of the frequency at that time? Hourly or half-hourly?
crs1026
Superstar
Bordercollie
Senior Member
You know when I was a kid (30 years ago) nobody at school ever mentioned working on the railroad as a career. Not did I ever see any of the major railways attend our school job fairs. Then again those were the days where we relied on learning from books and the internet was such an evil thing.
Undead
Senior Member
This hasn't changed much. When I was in high school 10 years ago, there never was much mention of trades. It seemed most parents wanted their kids to be managers, lawyers/doctors or something generally office related. The teachers never really brought up the trades either.
Bordercollie
Senior Member
And look where we are now.
christine
New Member
I've been following some of this mess ever since I had two consecutive train cancellations at West Harbour about a month ago (which happened again last night). I've found that if there are two events downtown on the same day (Jays game + Fan Expo or Indy or a concert) you'll be lucky if you can squeeze in by Long Branch heading towards Union. I'm sure funneling passengers from the Kitchener and Milton buses at Port Credit on the weekend doesn't help with the weekend crowding. Although illness cancellations on Lakeshore have gone down, 20+ minute delays, mostly due to "heavy customer volume" will often result in West Harbour-bound trains being short turned at Aldershot, reminiscent of the 501 streetcar of long ago.
Bordercollie
Senior Member
When the service becomes hourly it's going to be much worse. If they are able to maintain 80% of half hour services today how does that translate to moving to hourly all day?
lenaitch
Senior Member
I'm not surprised. In smaller 'railway towns' where they were major employer, they didn't have to and in larger places like Toronto, I imagine their staffing was satisfied with family members.
As others have mentioned, I was in high school in the '60s and there was a lot of aptitude testing and streaming. Shop training (our high school had lots of shops) was mostly relegated to those whose 'scores' didn't indicate university potential. Somehow, I ended up in the 5-year 'university-bound technical program - didn't even make it to Grade 13. We did get to take shops but were limited to electrical/electronic and drafting. I looked enviously on my mates who got to take the cool shops like auto, metal/welding, etc.
robmausser
Senior Member
Can anyone summarize what new service we got? and what is a return to pre-pandemic and what is truly new?
Thanks
Thanks
LNahid2000
Senior Member
LOL new service?? In terms of train service, all we got were cuts. For bus service, it seems to be a wash since trips were added on some routes while other routes were cut.