GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[Urban Sky]

This is not the reality.

The only Kitchener Line schedule changes since 2013 which reduced service levels were the March 2020, June 2020, January 2021, and January 2022 timetables, and all of those reductions were in direct response to severe drops in ridership and/or crew availability. Look for yourself. Every other schedule change has increased service, which is how we ended up with 10 trains per day from Kitchener in September 2021, compared to just 2 trains in 2013.
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Prior to 2013, the only service reductions I'm aware of were in 1993 when GO's budget was slashed and 2010(?) when construction began on the Georgetown South railway expansion project.

Thank you for setting the record straight! I really don't understand people who cry that there are no service improvements - less than half a year after (on 2021-08-31 and thus in the middle of the pandemic!) frequencies were increased to their highest-ever level and they are still higher - if we look at the green line - higher than they've been some six years ago...

Anyways, I guess that's why some of us have our own timetable archives to correct such highly distorted claims...

 

[reaperexpress]

So due to flooding at Shakespeare, Ontario the London GO train got canceled and there were so many passengers going west of Kitchener that they had to send a second shuttle bus

I wonder how many of those passengers at Kitchener were VIA customers. What did VIA do? Did they run VIA 87 via Brantford and run a shuttle bus via Kitchener? or give out GO tickets? Or did they just tell riders to figure it out themselves (thereby causing passengers to take GO instead)?

 

[Krypto98]

I wonder how many of those passengers at Kitchener were VIA customers. What did VIA do? Did they run VIA 87 via Brantford and run a shuttle bus via Kitchener? or give out GO tickets? Or did they just tell riders to figure it out themselves (thereby causing passengers to take GO instead)?

They ran a J-Train with VIA75 to london and apparently didn't give any accommodations for passengers going to Stratford and St marys.

 

[Bordercollie]

They ran a J-Train with VIA75 to london and apparently didn't give any accommodations for passengers going to Stratford and St marys.

That's nice of them...which is likely why the GO train was busier than usual.

It would be nice to have weekend trains also..

 

[emphurent]

Thank you for setting the record straight! I really don't understand people who cry that there are no service improvements - less than half a year after (on 2021-08-31 and thus in the middle of the pandemic!) frequencies were increased to their highest-ever level and they are still higher - if we look at the green line - higher than they've been some six years ago...

Anyways, I guess that's why some of us have our own timetable archives to correct such highly distorted claims...

Excuse me if I am reading your message wrong (this is more in response to your post before this) but:

I frankly do not like that you are using old timetables to push the idea that currently bad service levels should be accepted "because service was bad not that long ago."

I've been using the GO train since 2019. I didn't start using it as a transit enthusiast or anything, just for college. I found the service in 2019 as adequate/useful as I did in 2021 even with less frequency. The timetable doesn't tell the whole story.

Let me be clear on my point:

The service to Kitchener GO is now is the worst it has been pretty much throughout the entire pandemic, while the ridership is at its highest.

Having used it throughout the pandemic, even the early days where only 3 people would get on in August 2020 and there were less trains, I can say the service is inadequate now because:

1. the trains are piled into the early morning in this timetable for no reason; there was always some afternoon and late night train for leisure purposes beforehand.

Why are you saying it's okay now that ridership has returned; "it was that bad 3 years ago". That's not a defense. That's embarrassing for service I considered adequate between 2019 and 2021.

2. the lack of trains now leads to heavy crowding, especially on some train cars near the end. Crowding should be seen as a blessing because it signals a need for more frequency. But Metrolinx is way too slow to respond. It's been crowded for weeks yet service remains the same.

Easy fix: Add a late morning/early afternoon train: I've already posted photos months ago that a portion of Friday riders need a later train because they are using it to stay in Toronto for the weekend or even to go the the airport. Numbers won't tell you the number of suitcases using the train though! Or even trip patterns. Timetables just show Metrolinx needs to pay attention to rider habits more, instead of reverting to the ancient idea that GO is some commuter only service.

 

[crs1026]

^If the ridership is there, you can expect the service will be adjusted accordingly..

The issue is just the logistics of how often GO wants to change schedules, recall crews from layoff, bid the jobs etc.

The observation that ridership is growing back is encouraging. If a year goes by and nothing is done, then yes I’m eager to protest. But it has been a difficult few months, and I’m not faulting GO for doing what it has had to do during covid.

What would be more telling is whether siding construction and other improvements eg bridges get off to a good start when spring arrives. I have lost track of what tenders have been let and whether the anticipated work is now being done inside Oncorr or still proceeding separately. I’m hoping for lots of activity in 2022.

- Paul

 

[trainfanjacob8]

I wonder how many of those passengers at Kitchener were VIA customers. What did VIA do? Did they run VIA 87 via Brantford and run a shuttle bus via Kitchener? or give out GO tickets? Or did they just tell riders to figure it out themselves (thereby causing passengers to take GO instead)?

I was scheduled to ride VIA 84 from Stratford to Toronto today (February 19). VIA sent me an email yesterday (February 18) and told me that 84 was cancelled 'for reasons beyond their control' and that no alternative transportation would be provided.

 

[Bureaucromancer]

less than half a year after (on 2021-08-31 and thus in the middle of the pandemic!) frequencies were increased to their highest-ever level

I really don't get how having had the frequencies for a few months is anything to celebrate when they are now non-existent and we are hearing precisely nothing about restoring them.

 

[reaperexpress]

I really don't get how having had the frequencies for a few months is anything to celebrate when they are now non-existent and we are hearing precisely nothing about restoring them.

The fact that GO actually increased service to record-high levels in the middle of the pandemic indicates that they are trying to implement service improvements despite the challenges. The subsequent reduction in service in January 2022 was not by GO Transit's choice, it was unavoidable due to severe a lack of operators which meant that they were physically unable to operate the scheduled service and countless trips got cancelled on a daily basis. At least with the reduced schedule they could now operate the trips that were scheduled.

The fact that we are hearing nothing about restoring them doesn't mean much given that we normally don't know about service changes until a couple weeks beforehand anyway. I think it has now been long enough that we should start asking GO questions about their operator availability rate, and by extension when they can restore better service to Kitchener, but it is too early to be making accusations.

I frankly do not like that you are using old timetables to push the idea that currently bad service levels should be accepted "because service was bad not that long ago."

I and Urban Sky never made any claims about whether the service "should be accepted" or anything of the sort. We were directly refuting @Bureaucromancer 's claim that service has been stagnating, when in fact GO has clearly been consistently improving service when they are able to.

Why are you saying it's okay now that ridership has returned; "it was that bad 3 years ago". That's not a defense. That's embarrassing for service I considered adequate between 2019 and 2021.

Nobody is saying that. We all agree that service should be increased as soon as possible.

2. the lack of trains now leads to heavy crowding, especially on some train cars near the end. Crowding should be seen as a blessing because it signals a need for more frequency. But Metrolinx is way too slow to respond. It's been crowded for weeks yet service remains the same.

Easy fix: Add a late morning/early afternoon train: I've already posted photos months ago that a portion of Friday riders need a later train because they are using it to stay in Toronto for the weekend or even to go the the airport. Numbers won't tell you the number of suitcases using the train though! Or even trip patterns. Timetables just show Metrolinx needs to pay attention to rider habits more, instead of reverting to the ancient idea that GO is some commuter only service.

Again, yes, we want the shoulder-peak and off-peak trains to be reinstated as soon as possible. The question is whether GO is physically able to do so (i.e. do they have enough operators).

 

[Northern Light]

FWIW.........@smallspy might know better than I; but I'm hearing about significant service restoration/expansion soon.

 

[emphurent]

The fact that GO actually increased service to record-high levels in the middle of the pandemic indicates that they are trying to implement service improvements despite the challenges. The subsequent reduction in service in January 2022 was not by GO Transit's choice, it was unavoidable due to severe a lack of operators which meant that they were physically unable to operate the scheduled service and countless trips got cancelled on a daily basis. At least with the reduced schedule they could now operate the trips that were scheduled.

The fact that we are hearing nothing about restoring them doesn't mean much given that we normally don't know about service changes until a couple weeks beforehand anyway. I think it has now been long enough that we should start asking GO questions about their operator availability rate, and by extension when they can restore better service to Kitchener, but it is too early to be making accusations.



I and Urban Sky never made any claims about whether the service "should be accepted" or anything of the sort. We were directly refuting @Bureaucromancer 's claim that service has been stagnating, when in fact GO has clearly been consistently improving service when they are able to.



Nobody is saying that. We all agree that service should be increased as soon as possible.



Again, yes, we want the shoulder-peak and off-peak trains to be reinstated as soon as possible. The question is whether GO is physically able to do so (i.e. do they have enough operators).

While none of my post was really directed at you in the first place, I am glad to hear that was not the point being made. I responded without reading enough that's my fault. My defensiveness may come from the fact that this service is basically a lifeline for me and has been over the pandemic.

And you're right, the increased service during the pandemic is promising.

I apologize for taking out some of my frustration in that post, much of it stems from the fact that Metrolinx wasn't clear to the public when they stated that services wouldn't be disrupted by vaccine mandates. I just wished they were more transparent from the start that cuts would have to be made and stated they were temporary.

I do worry though how much future ridership will be affected by such weak communication from Metrolinx though.

 

[smallspy]

FWIW.........@smallspy might know better than I; but I'm hearing about significant service restoration/expansion soon.

So.......

I'd been hearing from the staff in the office that they were planning on restoring a large amount of the service on March 1st.

But......the guys on the ground apparently haven't heard a thing, and they need about 2-to-3 weeks notice before the changes can be instituted.

Dan

 

[Bordercollie]

So.......

I'd been hearing from the staff in the office that they were planning on restoring a large amount of the service on March 1st.

But......the guys on the ground apparently haven't heard a thing, and they need about 2-to-3 weeks notice before the changes can be instituted.

Dan

So will they need to re-qualify those crews that where put on temp leave?

 

[ARG1]

FWIW.........@smallspy might know better than I; but I'm hearing about significant service restoration/expansion soon.

I second this.

 

[Krypto98]

So will they need to re-qualify those crews that where put on temp leave?

Qualifying is usually every 3 years no?