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GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)
- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
Metroscapes
Active Member
Makes sense to me. Hell, even a couple hi-rails or an extra UPX car.
Allandale25
Senior Member
^ I see your hi-rail truck and raise you this: http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1999803
dowlingm
Senior Member
If only there were such a thing as an “extra” UPX DMU.
Now I want to see the YouTube where Chris Fox McGyvers ETCS into the Rapido RDC…
Allandale25
Senior Member
This could also be posted in the TTC or Union Station threads but I'll put it here.
www.thestar.com
New Year's Eve transit fiasco may result in fatalities next year
If we cannot handle the crowds of a large event, and refuse to learn from the past, how on earth are we going to be able to accommodate an increase
www.thestar.com
anb
Active Member
Maybe this is the push needed for GO to introduce more frequent services all cross the board for this year, and for TTC to create a better and efficient crowd control plan.
For next year, a thing that could've been done differently is to try to divert people throughout the 2 concourses depending on the platform of the train instead of making both concourses available. For example if LSW was on Platform 8/9 and Kitchener was on 10/11, make York concourse handle the former only, while Bay handles the latter. Letting people know ahead of time through updates like days before the new year would be nice so the detour wouldn't come as a shock or confusion and people would know where to go.
They should close streets and give them to pedestrians/transit only. Maybe closing Lake Shore to them only would help a lot and GO buses can get in and out of the city efficiently. If they can close Lake Shore for summer weekends, they can definitely do it for New Years as well.
As for the TTC, they should either only run 1 side of Line 1 at Union while detouring riders for the other side, or completely detour both sides to St Andrew/King so we have a better flow despite the short walk, but it is a massively better idea than what had actually happened.
But another thing that should happen are the improvements to the overall public transit itself that should be the focus of this entire year.
GO finally introducing more frequent all day service to Bramalea and Unionville while bringing back 15 min service to Oakville will be a nice start, and making new express trips on these lines a little before peak times could help a lot more.
UPX should run at least until 2AM to match with the subway, and for events it should aim to run at a 10 min headway if the Kitchener line can't do 15 min Bramalea service just yet.
Aside from the mentioned TTC idea above which they could also do during events, aiming to get Eglinton and Finch open for sure this year should be the plan. Although both are far from downtown, they both can help in different cases in other parts of the city that needs relief badly.
That's just my take on the situation. Not sure if its the best plan, but there needs to be change as this might be the tipping point. 2023 for transit in the GTA as a whole had routes and lines at the highest capacity they've ever been and at times it made travelling completely insufferable, so for it to end like this was unfortunately extremely fitting but it obviously shouldn't be like this at all. Let 2024 be the redemption year as we know ourselves that there's so much potential for Toronto to change into a potential transit city.
For next year, a thing that could've been done differently is to try to divert people throughout the 2 concourses depending on the platform of the train instead of making both concourses available. For example if LSW was on Platform 8/9 and Kitchener was on 10/11, make York concourse handle the former only, while Bay handles the latter. Letting people know ahead of time through updates like days before the new year would be nice so the detour wouldn't come as a shock or confusion and people would know where to go.
They should close streets and give them to pedestrians/transit only. Maybe closing Lake Shore to them only would help a lot and GO buses can get in and out of the city efficiently. If they can close Lake Shore for summer weekends, they can definitely do it for New Years as well.
As for the TTC, they should either only run 1 side of Line 1 at Union while detouring riders for the other side, or completely detour both sides to St Andrew/King so we have a better flow despite the short walk, but it is a massively better idea than what had actually happened.
But another thing that should happen are the improvements to the overall public transit itself that should be the focus of this entire year.
GO finally introducing more frequent all day service to Bramalea and Unionville while bringing back 15 min service to Oakville will be a nice start, and making new express trips on these lines a little before peak times could help a lot more.
UPX should run at least until 2AM to match with the subway, and for events it should aim to run at a 10 min headway if the Kitchener line can't do 15 min Bramalea service just yet.
Aside from the mentioned TTC idea above which they could also do during events, aiming to get Eglinton and Finch open for sure this year should be the plan. Although both are far from downtown, they both can help in different cases in other parts of the city that needs relief badly.
That's just my take on the situation. Not sure if its the best plan, but there needs to be change as this might be the tipping point. 2023 for transit in the GTA as a whole had routes and lines at the highest capacity they've ever been and at times it made travelling completely insufferable, so for it to end like this was unfortunately extremely fitting but it obviously shouldn't be like this at all. Let 2024 be the redemption year as we know ourselves that there's so much potential for Toronto to change into a potential transit city.
Dan416
Senior Member
drum118
Superstar
Were you on any of those 2 trains going in or out???
I was on the first one both way and a huge different in ridership both way. Very few on the one going on, but full load leaving and no clue on the 2nd one..
The QQ was to be closed between X-X, but it wasn't adding to traffic issue.
Lake Shore is a gridlock at peak time without pedestrian flow not like New Year Eve 10'000's of pedestrian using Bay and Yonge St. The only way onto the Gardiner going west is at Jarvis and York St well Going east is at Spadina and Bay.
Bay was the worse compared to Yonge that it goes back to my 2008 recommendation that it be close permanently from QQ to Queen as a pedestrian transit mall
Police hard a hard time trying to stop the flow of the crowd crossing the intersections that they gave up.
Yonge & Lake Shore
Dan416
Senior Member
I was not, but I take the Milton train frequently and it's pretty full on a normal day, especially when there's big gaps, like 30 minutes between the 5:25 and the 5:55 trains.
generalcanada
Senior Member
Yea so living downtown you can see from like 7pm on...sooo..many...cars
Its like people by default assume driving is the best way then get surprised when thousands of people think the same way.
I saw people turning onto Dan leckie to QQ just to see a road closed sign. There is absolutely zero foresight with drivers
In my opinion you honestly have to close the entire downtown core to personal cars on NYE, as you heard with the willowbrook go drivers being unable to get to the don yard to serve riders.
allow the gardiner to bypass the city, but its just unworkable to find any solution for the NYE traffic that doesnt include removing access to cars
drum118
Superstar
One thing GO/ML must deal with is the labour laws and union agreement as well lack of crews to put more service online for New Year Events as well other events. At the same time, crews want time off to celebrate various events with family and freinds, regardless of whether the pay is double or triple for overtime or extra time that adds to crew shortages.
This year saw extra trains added to various lines with the expectation of larger crowds, but it was more than they expected as well poor planning of having crews in place to have trains place in the right time slots since these extra trains were not store at Union in the first place. Don't know if trains were stored at Don or North Bathurst yard as well what the crews did to kill the time from the time the trains were place in the yard to departure time.
There could have been a shortage of dispatchers that caused some delays as well as equipment issues.
The Lakeshore trains were supposed to be running every 15 minutes then moved to 30 and 60 minutes with crowds on other parts of the line causing delays.
Until the standard how someone can become an engineer in NA like Europe as well those who can quality to be one, ML will be hard press finding crews to provide the higher quality of services that been promised for years to meet the current needs as well future needs. NA RR and governing bodies must look at Europe standards for training Engineers from 9 months to over a year for non HSR that takes 18-24 months if not more depending on the system and country. Not everyone can be an engineer as well the hours they operate at. Then there are the engineers who can be off up to a year or more after they hit someone to the point, they don't return at all.
GO can only run more services on tracks own by ML and permissions of CN/CP on their lines if there is the motor power to do so. We don't know if we will see an extra 13 locomotives by 2025/26 to put more service out there.
It's great to say more service should been on hand for Jan 1st home trips must look at the big picture that ML/GO has on hand for staff and equipment.
This year saw extra trains added to various lines with the expectation of larger crowds, but it was more than they expected as well poor planning of having crews in place to have trains place in the right time slots since these extra trains were not store at Union in the first place. Don't know if trains were stored at Don or North Bathurst yard as well what the crews did to kill the time from the time the trains were place in the yard to departure time.
There could have been a shortage of dispatchers that caused some delays as well as equipment issues.
The Lakeshore trains were supposed to be running every 15 minutes then moved to 30 and 60 minutes with crowds on other parts of the line causing delays.
Until the standard how someone can become an engineer in NA like Europe as well those who can quality to be one, ML will be hard press finding crews to provide the higher quality of services that been promised for years to meet the current needs as well future needs. NA RR and governing bodies must look at Europe standards for training Engineers from 9 months to over a year for non HSR that takes 18-24 months if not more depending on the system and country. Not everyone can be an engineer as well the hours they operate at. Then there are the engineers who can be off up to a year or more after they hit someone to the point, they don't return at all.
GO can only run more services on tracks own by ML and permissions of CN/CP on their lines if there is the motor power to do so. We don't know if we will see an extra 13 locomotives by 2025/26 to put more service out there.
It's great to say more service should been on hand for Jan 1st home trips must look at the big picture that ML/GO has on hand for staff and equipment.
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Dan416
Senior Member
I would never drive downtown on New Year's Eve, but clearly the transit options were insufficient, as witnessed by the crowding in Union Station. The people driving downtown are unlikely to be able to substitute their trips with TTC trips, so GO would most likely have been their only option, and as evidenced by the lack of Milton trains (just 2) it was hardly a real option for people on the Milton line. Milton riders know how quickly one train can fill up, so they probably avoided GO for that reason.
T3G
Senior Member
I don't know how it is with train drivers, but many cities in Europe are currently experiencing a shortage of transit operators.
Krypto98
Active Member
The freight operators are pretty short on manpower, CN a bit better than CP however from what ive been told and experienced. I've heard somewhere VIA was short on both man power and equipment...
I'm not sure about GO but I haven't seen the CSA job posting in a while. However if they are going with just enough crews for regular assignments and a spareboard, then having a bunch of extra trains on new years might deplete any spareboard that is maintained.
Allandale25
Senior Member
Bowmanville Extension TPAP approved by the Minister per this article posted today.
GO train extension to Bowmanville one step closer
January 4, 2024 | 12:30 pm
Durham has the environment minister’s approval to move ahead with the GO train extension to Bowmanville.
The project that will add four new stations passed an environmental assessment. The Transit Project Assessment Process (TPAP) ensures any potential negative impacts to the natural, social, cultural and economic environment are protected.
Regional Chair John Henry says he’s thrilled the project continues to achieve major milestones, bringing this extension one step closer to fruition.
“Students, residents and visitors will be able to seamlessly travel across Durham and beyond, creating more connected communities,” said Henry.
