GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[luk3yd]

‘There are too many bikes’: A sharp rise in the number of food couriers commuting into Toronto’s core has left GO Transit struggling — and the workers scrambling

In recent months, GO Transit operations have been adjusted to accommodate a growing influx of food delivery workers and their bikes in the GTA.

www.thestar.com

A few excerpts:

What are peoples thoughts on 'upgrading' one car every train (maybe every cab car as you know there's always one of those per consist) to remove seats on the lower level to accommodate bikes? Could still have additional dedicated bike coaches on heavy use lines/trips (like Niagara Falls on weekends and Kitchener for bike couriers), but it would then allow/promote people to bring their bikes for their last mile journeys on either end of their trip.

 

[anb]

Maybe they should work it out to have at least minimum 10 car trains at all times for the Kitchener weekend service including a bike coach. It will certainly make a night and day difference. They could also just introduce 30 min service to/from Bramalea for both weekdays and weekends as well but that doesn’t feel like a reality for another 2-3 years.

 

[crs1026]

There's a slippery slope here. As much as I like the idea..... no transit system I can think of really aims to carry bikes in that volume.

The bike couriers get a little extra sympathy because it's a lousy low-paying job and clearly they can't afford to live close to their work. It's tempting to think we are addressing the unpleasant realities of Toronto housing problems aside by making this gesture.... but it may be little more than virtue signalling in the bigger picture. I wonder how Manhattan bike couriers for example make this work.

It would probably be cheaper to offer a subsidised courier targeted bikeshare out of Union station, than to impose all the capacity restraints on GO trains as a network. Bikes take up a lot of passenger-carrying space on a train.

The Niagara train is a bit of a mixed message and as a precedent it has its down side. It's great as a one-of, but it's a model that ML can't easily transpose to the business of everyday commuting. Even our model comparator system in the Netherlands charges 10 euros a day for bikes.

- Paul

 

[afransen]

It makes more sense to provide secure ebike parking/charging facilities in the city. Maybe locate it in various Green P lots.

 

[nfitz]

People I've known who live in the burbs, who use a bike for the last mile of their commute, leave it parked at Union station.

I'd think enabling and expanding that would be better for everyone, than needlessly transporting bikes back and forth every day.

 

[Northern Light]

People I've known who live in the burbs, who use a bike for the last mile of their commute, leave it parked at Union station.

I'd think enabling and expanding that would be better for everyone, than needlessly transporting bikes back and forth every day.

Does anyone know if Union's bike storage facility has open capacity or if its a wait list?

Be interesting to consider.

The one at Union is only 168 bikes in capacity which is pretty tiny if the idea catches on.

The fees aren't overly large, but I wonder if they represent an obstacle at all.

The registration service seems a bit cumbersome, you actually have to speak to staff during business hours, and for that, you have to make an appointment.

I'm not quite sure why one can't do the entire process online; but perhaps there is a compelling reason.

 

[afransen]

People I've known who live in the burbs, who use a bike for the last mile of their commute, leave it parked at Union station.

I'd think enabling and expanding that would be better for everyone, than needlessly transporting bikes back and forth every day.

Bringing bikes on transit is not scalable for peak commuting. Even bike parking has its limits as demonstrated by the NL with ten thousand + bike parking garages in some city centres. Bikeshare for last mile is probably a better solution in terms of space utilization. We might need to get cleverer at handling huge volumes at peak and repositioning. But for bike couriers, paid secure storage downtown probably makes more sense. I imagine ebike charging makes this more complicated, especially with dodgy ebikes that are prone to battery fires. We're probably going to have to start collecting additional fare for bikes if not banning them altogether (not just at peak).

 

[APTA-2048]

especially with dodgy ebikes that are prone to battery fires.

I was thinking about that a couple weeks ago while on a train with a few e-bikes and e-scooters after watching a news piece on fire hazards of non safety certified bikes.

 

[afransen]

I was thinking about that a couple weeks ago while on a train with a few e-bikes and e-scooters after watching a news piece on fire hazards of non safety certified bikes.

I fully expect there is going to be some kind of incident with a battery fire on a transit vehicle. I don't expect there to be many casualties, but it will get a lot of headlines.

 

[crs1026]

I fully expect there is going to be some kind of incident with a battery fire on a transit vehicle. I don't expect there to be many casualties, but it will get a lot of headlines.

Even without harm to humans, I would hate to see a GO coach scorched in a bike fire. An expensive loss.

(The folks who are dying for the newly rebuilt cab cars to return would be heartbroken if one went up in smoke)

- Paul

 

[WB62]

Should something similar to GO Dial A Bus or an on demand service operated by Metrolinx be implemented on parts of the network? I’m thinking an implementation in rural areas like Bloomington or Grimsby station when it gets built could possibly be useful:

 

[APTA-2048]

Should something similar to GO Dial A Bus or an on demand service operated by Metrolinx in the future? I’m thinking an implementation in rural areas like Bloomington or possibly Grimsby in the future could possibly be useful:View attachment 501065

Various transit agencies have already started on-demand bus service to varying degrees. Some of them could be better, though.

 

[reaperexpress]

Does anyone know if Union's bike storage facility has open capacity or if its a wait list?

Be interesting to consider.

The one at Union is only 168 bikes in capacity which is pretty tiny if the idea catches on.

The fees aren't overly large, but I wonder if they represent an obstacle at all.

The registration service seems a bit cumbersome, you actually have to speak to staff during business hours, and for that, you have to make an appointment.

I'm not quite sure why one can't do the entire process online; but perhaps there is a compelling reason.

There are around 300 secure spaces in the garages at Union, though according to the website only 168 are available for use, which are the ones in the new garage on York north of the underpass. Prior to the renovation there was a bike parking garage with about 120 spaces on York under the south edge of the underpass. I don't know what the status is of the old garage, it has been boarded up.

Old garage sitting vacant in 2021

Old garage boarded up in 2022:

The reason couriers don't use the secure parking at Union is that the maximum stay in the garage is 48 hours. So if they decide not to go downtown more than 2 days in a row, they will get a fine. Very few people would be willing to accept those terms, especially with more people commuting only a couple days per week.

Terms and Conditions, Toronto Bicycle Stations:

The simple solution to encourage bike couriers to leave their bikes downtown rather than shuttling them back and forth from Brampton on the train is to reopen the old bike garage at Union in addition to the new garage, and increase the maximum duration of stay to 7 days or so. This may need to be accompanied by a small fee for bringing bikes onto a GO train (maybe $1 or $2 flat fee) to encourage people to consider other options if possible.

For comparison my local bike parking garage at Delft Station in the Netherlands has a maximum stay of 14 days for the main garage over the tracks and 28 days for the garage further away. There are 10 000 spaces in total. As mentioned earlier, it is quite expensive to bring a bike aboard a train. I've only done it three times in three years, and all three were one-way trips specifically for the purpose of moving one of my bikes to a different city where it would remain.

 

[luk3yd]

Another random thought that keeps popping up for me, is after seeing stuff on YouTube about the Winter Park Express in Colorado, is if there would be any public interest in a limited extension of the Milton line (once it has 2 way all day service) to the Glen Eden ski area. Given it already has the CP line running right beside it's parking lot, and it's less than 8k's away from the Milton station, it would hopefully not be a contractual nightmare to get a handful of paths to run 1 or 2 trains in the morning to there in the morning, and 1 or 2 trains from there in the afternoon.

Could potentially update the Niagara specific bike coaches to be used for Skis / Snowboards in their 'off' season, and provide a way for car-free Toronto residents to get to the snow.

I'm sure a simple single platform station would still be very expensive, but if we didn't overbuild or gold plate it, it may be doable given the infra that is already there.

 

[afransen]

The reason couriers don't use the secure parking at Union is that the maximum stay in the garage is 48 hours. So if they decide not to go downtown more than 2 days in a row their bike is at risk of being removed. Very few people would be willing to accept those terms, especially with more people commuting only a couple days per week.

Seems like a policy that needs to be revised in light of hybrid work anyway. I don't know if they are trying to modulate demand by imposing customer-hostile usage rules. It would be better to raise daily parking rates and allow 7 or 14 day storage. If prices need to be set very high to manage demand, that is a good problem to have and a signal to add capacity. Rather than building infrastructure that is only useful to a specific niche of insiders or worse, goes unused.