hw621
Senior Member
Wouldn't there be a need for that? Or ECLRT would do that?
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GO Transit Midtown Corridor
- Thread starter DonValleyRainbow
- Start date
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Neither ECLRT nor Line 2 is regional rail kind of express. That's should be the focus of this corridor.
AoD
micheal_can
Senior Member
I imagine if the Smart track ever gets going, this could be part of Smart track phase 2.
crs1026
Superstar
Keep in mind that before this could be a reality, Ontario would have to
a) convince CP and CN to allow a bypass route
b) build same bypass
c) pay CP a king’s ransom to buy the right of way
d) build stations, perhaps grade separate the remaining crossings, etc
The province won’t be in a position to fund this for a long time.
This project is post 2030 at the earliest.
- Paul
a) convince CP and CN to allow a bypass route
b) build same bypass
c) pay CP a king’s ransom to buy the right of way
d) build stations, perhaps grade separate the remaining crossings, etc
The province won’t be in a position to fund this for a long time.
This project is post 2030 at the earliest.
- Paul
hw621
Senior Member
It is not in the Metrolinx's 2041 RTP, so it is probably post that.
Leo_Chan
Senior Member
2030? More like 2050.
There's also the consideration that Vaughan and Markham do not want more freight traffic even now with only the Missing Link 407 Rail Bypass. With the Midtown corridor with even less freight, the York Sub corridor could triple or quadruple in freight.
cplchanb
Senior Member
Its a shame that theres no connection on the ECT for the richmond hill line. its a major opportunity missed.
BMO
Senior Member
It's mentioned in the latest Regional Transportation Plan by Metrolinx as projects beyond 2041 and references issues with the train yard in Scarborough that need to be resolved before this can be feasible and hence blocks this corridor from being feasible for two of the three potential end routings.
SaugeenJunction
Senior Member
The only additional passenger service that this line will see in the near future is for VIA Rail’s High Frequency Rail/Dedicated Tracks plan (if approved by the Government of Canada). Trains would run from where the Don Branch meets up with the Midtown line to past Agincourt Yard towards Peterborough and beyond. A stop is currently envisioned for Eglinton Ave, but I wouldn’t compare this hourly-ish service to anything like what GO could provide. So far, it’s unclear what additional infrastructure VIA will build along this corridor to enable this project.
robmausser
Senior Member
Smarttrack Phase 2/3 could look like this, as more than just this area is freed up with a "CP" Bypass
ShonTron
Moderator
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This sort of rail banking is not entirely without precedent. GO Transit purchased tracks between Stouffville and Uxbridge as CN was abandoning its line to Lindsay in 1990-1991 to protect for the future extension. GO trains still don't go as far as Uxbridge, but it allowed for the extension to Lincolnville, with a new larger yard that allowed for service expansion (and negated the need to build more parking in Downtown Stouffville).
SaugeenJunction
Senior Member
Exactly. Metrolinx also has “banked” the Don Branch (purchased from CP) and the Canpa Sub which it recently upgraded to welded rail and rehabilitated crossings on (also purchased from CP).
crs1026
Superstar
It’s one thing to bank ‘unwanted’ lines that don’t generate any freight revenue. It’s another to convince a railway to move off its heavily trafficked backbone onto another railway’s right of way.
A North Toronto line will be transformative for the city, but it will be a huge deal to arrange - a bigger deal even than the Relief Line to sell.
It will be an interesting one to watch - I expect to be in a walker by then !
- Paul
A North Toronto line will be transformative for the city, but it will be a huge deal to arrange - a bigger deal even than the Relief Line to sell.
It will be an interesting one to watch - I expect to be in a walker by then !
- Paul
micheal_can
Senior Member
With all of the freight yards North of the 401, why would they even want to go through the city? Or am I missing something?
crs1026
Superstar
I'm sure they have their pro's and con's list.
I'm sure that in a perfect world they would like to not have a city as a neighbour, but that's only one factor. In the end, it comes down to money.
The CN Bypass in Halton/Peel makes sense because it would leave CN with a shorter route with less grades. So the main thing standing in the way of CN's endorsement is the purchase price, and getting CN comfortable that it will be cheaper to operate and offer enough capacity for the long term.
We don't know if a bypass would ease grades and reduce overall track investment for CP (I suspect it would, because the climb from Yonge to Agincourt is a fair grade also). But the North Toronto line represents very expensive real estate. So even if CP got a better route, for free, they would likely prefer to sell the old ROW to developers instead of to the Province for continued rail use. Developers would offer more money than the taxpayer will. And again, how much capacity will the new line offer over the longer term?
Another consideration: Toronto is not the only city wanting CP to move its tracks. CP has only so much managerial horsepower to project manage these moves. Doing Toronto at the same time that they are doing Winnipeg, or Calgary, or wherever, is problemmatic. Where is the incentive for CP to tie its managerial brains up doing the bypass?
This picture from Ray Kennedy's Old Time Trains website adds a further dimension. Note who was here first : CP, not the city.
At the end of the day, I'm sure CP would jump at the offer if the price were right. That "right price" would probably make the taxpayer gag. And there's the obstacle.
- Paul