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GO Transit Electrification | Metrolinx

Batteries are also more flexible. They can run on non-catenary lines where needed so expansion of the system can be done almost immediately with no new electrical infrastructure needed.

Extremely wrong.

The power required to re-charge train batteries in any reasonable period of time is immense, and the local grid around the stations where charging happens would likely require serious upgrading. There's also the issue of supply reliability. A length of 25 kV catenary is fed by multiple substations/feeder points along it's route, with the failure of any single substation a manageable event as adjacent substations can carry the load. Catenary systems are specifically designed that way. The short piece of overhead rail at a station where charging occurs however is a single point of failure in the system. You can manage it by running a second feeder to an alternate segment of the grid ($$$), or you can manage it by doubling the train's battery capacity so it can get to the next charging stop, but that's double $$$ as now you're both buying more batteries and require twice the power to charge it without crippling the schedule.

Solvable problems? Of course, but certainly not a case of "no new electrical infrastructure needed".
 
Solvable problems? Of course, but certainly not a case of "no new electrical infrastructure needed".

Exactly. That’s the whole point of 25KV power supply - less supply infrastructure, minimising feed points.
The incremental savings by not stringing stretches of catenary is pretty small as a proportion of project costs. Admittedly, there could be savings where one doesnn’t have to replace current bridges that are too low for catenary, but in the GTA the low bridges are frequently in zones where wires would have to be strung - eg the Dufferin-Sunnyside area, Long Branch.

- Paul
 
3rd rail is not an option as it would require the complete ripping up of the current infrastructure and building new which is way beyond just simple electrification. Also, RER, at least not initially, is a non-grade separated system which 3rd rail must be due to safety.

Battery and hydrogen are viable options because they can be done but whether you think they are good one or not is another matter. There are functional hydrogen and battery powered EMU trains be used and that means that, at least hypothetically, they are options.
 
3rd rail is not an option as it would require the complete ripping up of the current infrastructure and building new which is way beyond just simple electrification. Also, RER, at least not initially, is a non-grade separated system which 3rd rail must be due to safety.

Battery and hydrogen are viable options because they can be done but whether you think they are good one or not is another matter. There are functional hydrogen and battery powered EMU trains be used and that means that, at least hypothetically, they are options.
How would you have to rip up the current infrastructure for 3rd rail operation? Platform height increases are still an option anyways. The problem with 3rd rail (and catenary for that matter) involves interactions with freight trains. Some cars can't travel under catenary or next to a third rail due to clearance or arcing risks, and both CN and CP don't want to have to train electric safety to crews.
 
How would you have to rip up the current infrastructure for 3rd rail operation? Platform height increases are still an option anyways. The problem with 3rd rail (and catenary for that matter) involves interactions with freight trains. Some cars can't travel under catenary or next to a third rail due to clearance or arcing risks, and both CN and CP don't want to have to train electric safety to crews.

While the interface between third rail and "other" railroad equipment is certainly a concern, I would argue that massive increase in fixed plant and thus costs - substations every mile, rather than every 25 - represents a far greater worry.

Dan
 
How would you have to rip up the current infrastructure for 3rd rail operation? Platform height increases are still an option anyways. The problem with 3rd rail (and catenary for that matter) involves interactions with freight trains. Some cars can't travel under catenary or next to a third rail due to clearance or arcing risks, and both CN and CP don't want to have to train electric safety to crews.

Third rail also has speed limitations and issues with snow and ice. Catenary has issues with snow and ice too but they arent as significant as third rail and can be solved more easily.
 
Third rail also has speed limitations and issues with snow and ice. Catenary has issues with snow and ice too but they arent as significant as third rail and can be solved more easily.
I was under the impression that Third Rail didn't have significant icing issues because they can be covered. Unlike a catenary, which is out in the open.

There's definitely a surface area argument there though.
 
I was under the impression that Third Rail didn't have significant icing issues because they can be covered. Unlike a catenary, which is out in the open.

There's definitely a surface area argument there though.

The best implementation of third rail that doesnt ice is inverted third rail, where its upside down (the contact shoe presses up against the third rail)

Its not a perfect solution, ice...ahem...finds a way.
 
Year end updates from a Metrolinx email received. The last update mentions OnCorr and public meetings coming up. OnCorr as we know includes the electrification component.

This year-end overview provides an update on all projects within the Union Station east rail corridor. Keeping you informed is important to us, and we look forward to sharing further updates as they occur in 2020.

Don Yard
Don Yard Upgrade & Expansion project has come to a close with the contractor demobilized from site in November 2019. The project delivered 1.5km of upgraded new track work, grading, drainage and servicing upgrades to the Don Yard. With this project coming to a close, the next stage in Don Yard development will begin in late 2020 with the Wilson Yard Expansion project.

Wilson Yard
The Wilson Yard Train Storage Expansion project will enable expansion of storage capacity to support the planned increase in GO Train service. By locating a yard close to Union Station, trains can be stored nearby, while reducing the need to move empty trains long distances. This project will also include removing hydro towers in the area. Construction is expected to begin late 2020.

Pedestrian & Cyclist Connectivity Study
The PCCS was initiated in the fall of 2018, and is currently in Phase 2, which has included identifying preferred options at a conceptual level in consultation with the City of Toronto, Waterfront Toronto and the USRCE CAC Sub-Group for the PCCS. On December 10th, a final presentation on the Phase 2 options was shared with the Sub-Group, before proceeding with the preparation of functional designs and high-level costing in the New Year, as Part of Phase 3. The study is targeted to be completed in spring 2020.

Union Station Enhancement Project
The Union Station Enhancement Project (USEP) is the next improvement scheduled for Union Station. Once completed, the project will encompass wider platforms with canopies, new stairs and elevators connecting to new concourses below. There will be pedestrian connections from the new concourse to Bay and York Streets as well as the concourses to the north and Scotiabank Arena to the south. In addition there will be two new tracks designed to allow for future passenger train speeds up to 45mph, with associated signal works. Storm water management system and other necessary building systems will be incorporated to ensure these improvements meet service needs well into the future.

After suggestions were provided from the industry, this project is being re-tendered using a new procurement (Alliance) model that is a more collaborative approach, sharing risks and responsibilities and gives the flexibility to manage new or changing project risks collaboratively. Request for Proposals was issued on October, 2019.

USRC Signalling System Project Overview
The USRC Signalling System Project (USRC SSP) is part of Metrolinx Signalling and Train Control Improvement Program designed to improve reliability of our signalling and train control systems. The existing system is 90+ years old and is locally controlled from three individual towers (Cherry, Scott and John Streets). Once completed, the new signalling system will reduce signal disruptions and recovery times while allowing operations to be under one control centre, thereby providing a more effective service. The new system will provide higher reliability, be electrification-immunized, meet future RER capacity requirements and interface with the future GO Transit Control System (GTCS). The sequencing in of track circuits will begin in the spring 2021 with the signalling system scheduled to be fully commissioned into service in 2022

Union Station Bus Terminal
The new Union Station Bus Terminal (USBT) is being built in the new CIBC Square at 81 Bay Street. The project is a partnership between Metrolinx and Ivanhoe Cambridge and Hines. The enhanced USBT will give customers a safer, more convenient and more efficient transit experience, with better connections to rail and subway services as well as other popular destinations. The new USBT is being built just south of the rail corridor at 81 Bay Street, and is scheduled to open in 2020.

Bay Street Overbuild Park
In addition to the new USBT, the CIBC Square development includes two office towers and an overbuild park spanning the GO rail corridor. The park spanning the GO rail corridor is designed to connect people with the community, curated activities and nature. The park will be programmed all year-round with food markets, concerts and lively activities, activating the space in the summer, and a large skating rink surrounded by holiday markets in the winter. The Overbuild Park will be a public green space situated over the rail corridor at Bay Street and is expected to be partially opened as part of Phase 1 of the project in 2021 and fully opened as part of Phase 2, at the beginning of 2024.

New Generator Project
To ensure that Union Station remains fully operational in the event of a significant power outage, a new emergency generator will be positioned east of the Scott Street Tower. A substation will be housed in the Bay East Teamway, where conduits will run to the generator further east. Associated work included a new condenser unit on the Union Station train shed roof and the restoration of the Yonge Street bridge trainman's walkway.
The reason for this installation is to increase capacity of backup power, to accommodate future development and expansion of Union Station. The generator is anticipated to be installed in December 2019, where testing will ensure that it is fully operational by the end of February 2020.

Union Station Rail Corridor Maintenance work impacts
Track maintenance is ongoing and at times unable to be prescheduled. As safety remains our top priority, work crews continually assess the condition of rails, joints, ballasts and frogs, and in some cases emergency work must be performed. In 2019 a lot has been done to reduce the number of rail joints, and as a result contributed to a reduction of operational noise from the corridor. These improvements include 700 track ties replaced throughout various locations from Jarvis to Cherry Street, track replacement in 200 foot sections over the Jarvis St Bridge and at Cherry Street, and 500 feet of worn rail near Eastern Avenue.

What's on track for 2020 maintenance work impacts include 500 to 1000 track ties to be replaced at various locations between Jarvis to Cherry Street, track replacement in 200 foot sections over the Sherbourne St Bridge, and other tentative track replacements, as scheduled work blocks and safety protocols will permit, all further contributing to a reduction in rail joints and noise impacts.

On the Horizon - OnCorr
Metrolinx is working to bring communities across the region more GO Train service to get you where you need to go — better, faster and easier. GO Expansion means reliable and efficient service every 15 minutes or better, two-way, all-day, during the evenings and on weekends, in core areas of the GO network. To deliver this service, Metrolinx is planning to build new track and signals, construct new rail facilities, modify and build bridges, improve crossings and build electrification infrastructure across the GO network. To support the program, Metrolinx will host public meetings in the New Year to share more information with the communities we serve. As a recipient of this newsletter, you will receive an invitation to attend. Please look out for more details in early 2020.
 
I was under the impression that Third Rail didn't have significant icing issues because they can be covered. Unlike a catenary, which is out in the open.

There's definitely a surface area argument there though.
This is a non starter issue. Nordic and winter climate countries have had cantenary for ages and theyve sorted it out. As long as we dont try to reinvent the wheel on this an follow what they do it should be fine.
 
This is a non starter issue. Nordic and winter climate countries have had cantenary for ages and theyve sorted it out. As long as we dont try to reinvent the wheel on this an follow what they do it should be fine.
By no means do I really want to open the debate, but I would think icing (freezing rain) issues would hurt catenary more than a third rail. Snow, in general, is the bigger issue in nordic countries, and clearing the third rail requires specialized equipment.
 
Due to RER, at least initially, not being completely grade separated for the entire 200km, 3rd rail is NOT, optional, Full stop.

Anyone who thinks differently I encourage them to go their nearest subway station and walk across the tracks and see if you make it across to the other side. There is a reason why there is no such thing as 3rd rail streetcars or LRTs, ANY contact with someone means they fry.
 
Anyone who thinks differently I encourage them to go their nearest subway station and walk across the tracks and see if you make it across to the other side. There is a reason why there is no such thing as 3rd rail streetcars or LRTs, ANY contact with someone means they fry.
DLR_106.jpg

3rd Rail LRT

3rd Rail Streetcar

LIRR_sampler_electric_and_diesel_services.jpg

3rd Rail RER with grade crossing

Francisco.jpg

3rd Rail Rapid Transit grade crossing

They exist, and if you had to electrify GO with 3rd rail, you could, it would just be a huge non-starter and would be insanely inefficient. However, it'd still be more practical than full Hydrogen or Battery electrification.
 

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I would say that the London Docklands line counts more as a grade-separated light metro line similar to a traditional subway, whereas the latter two (MTA and Chicago) really count more as legacy systems full of compromises that would not be built as-is today.

Only the ground level power supply could be considered, and even it's for streetcar loads, not full mainline cars- and more for aesthetic rather than efficient reasons.

Regardless, the discussion over power supply has always been silly IMO. Plenty of postulation over no information.
 

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