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General cycling issues (Is Toronto bike friendly?)

First, the City studied a 12-hour period, not 24. Midnight-Six Am was never counted.

Second, I think you'll find many residents, particularly on Woodbine are not unhappy (some are), but for many it meant that they gained permanent on-street parking, where previously they had to move their car in rush hours. The street is also quieter in the off-peak now.

Third, the majority of marginally inconvenienced motorist do not live in the area in question, they merely pass through, they don't get to vote for ward councillor.

Finally, you can't just extract the bike lane from Kingston to Gerrard as if that section of street operates in isolation.

If you have 2 lanes northbound up to Gerrard and it then drops to one, you would have to force traffic in the right-lane to exit, or merge w/the left lane.

The road to the north would not have capacity to absorb traffic from the south.

These things have to planned in a coordinated way.


Apologies I misread your post as 24. Kinda lost interest to do more than glance when you started off kinda arrogant.

Guess you read something else as well as I never directly implied anything about extracting the lane from the section of Kingston to Gerrard. Just stated their has been greater impact while serving so few. Bottom line far too many people need to drive and until that changes these cycling projects removing lanes should not be implemented around the Core.
 
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Bottom line far too many people need to drive and until that changes these cycling projects removing lanes should not be implemented around the Core.
More people cycle into and out of Toronto's core on cycle lanes than motorists do on the DVP. That stat has been the case for a couple of years now, and continues to steadily increase.
 
More people cycle into and out of Toronto's core on cycle lanes than motorists do on the DVP. That stat has been the case for a couple of years now, and continues to steadily increase.

Do you have a source for that? Would love to find out more.
 
Do you have a source for that? Would love to find out more.
It was published roughly three years back in support of what a success the Adelaide and Richmond lanes had been. I'll try and dig it out, but it was a City of Toronto published report. I found it astounding at the time until the figures were broken down and realizing that the great majority of cars coming down the DVP were single occupant.

Give me some time to dig that out, it's a stat that's been overlooked of late, and I'll have to find the right Google tags.

Quick Google shows this, but finding the DVP reference is going to take time. It was a City claim at the time.
The city has released new numbers that show a dramatic, 1,500-per-cent increase in the number of cyclists on Richmond and Adelaide streets since bike lanes were installed in 2013.

“We’ve moved from a couple hundred cyclists a day on the corridor to over 6,000 cyclists a day,” said Shawn Dillon, manager of Cycling Infrastructure and Programs. “So, it’s just been an astronomical change.”

The lanes are part of a pilot project that has also led to a significant decrease in the number of cyclist-involved collisions. On Richmond, collisions are down 79 per cent, and on Adelaide, they’re down 63 per cent.

Despite the success story, the city has not yet made the lanes permanent.
[...]
https://toronto.citynews.ca/2018/06/29/toronto-bike-lines/
 
More people cycle into and out of Toronto's core on cycle lanes than motorists do on the DVP. That stat has been the case for a couple of years now, and continues to steadily increase.

Which is great, I fully support reasonably integrated cycle lanes and improvement. But this stat is a complete aside from this specific poorly used lane that took out lanes from another highly used transit mode. I fully acknowledge its a difficult task trying to squeeze safe cycling infrastructure into the limited space. As someone who both cycles and is forced to drive to certain job locations because of poor performance of public transit, I see certain projects like these as jumping the shark where the benefits are for the minority. Until we can provide comparable service levels, we need to be more mindful towards removing vehicle lanes.
 
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Which is great, I fully support reasonably integrated cycle lanes and improvement. But this stat is a complete aside from this specific poorly used lane that took out lanes from another highly used transit mode. I fully acknowledge its a difficult task trying to squeeze safe cycling infrastructure into the limited space. As someone who both cycles and is forced to drive to certain job locations because of poor performance of public transit, I see certain projects like these as jumping the shark where the benefits are for the minority. Until we can provide comparable service levels, we need to be more mindful towards removing vehicle lanes.

Given that in rush hour, cycling traffic is not far below the volume of a single lane of Danforth, would you support bike lanes on the Danforth instead of Woodbine?

I think you'd find many cyclists would make that trade.
 
Regarding the Woodbine bike lanes:

I have a friend who is volunteering for a Beaches East York council candidate, and he said that 95% of residents at the doorstep are opposed to the Woodbine bike lanes. Why is there so much resistance?
 
Regarding the Woodbine bike lanes:

I have a friend who is volunteering for a Beaches East York council candidate, and he said that 95% of residents at the doorstep are opposed to the Woodbine bike lanes. Why is there so much resistance?

There are only 220 cyclists using the path.

Compare that to a 25% increase in the time it takes to drive it at evening rush hour. From 8 minutes to over 10. For over 20,000 vehicles daily.

So we are inconveniencing a majority of these 20,000 for the benefit of 220. Hence the resistance.

And this was even before the addition of 3 more lights along Woodbine. I expect that the 25% time increase has gone to almost 50% after these lights were/will be installed.
 
Compare that to a 25% increase in the time it takes to drive it at evening rush hour. From 8 minutes to over 10. For over 20,000 vehicles daily.

You're mixing your time periods. How many evening rush hour vehicles are inconvenienced?

Or what is the average impact to all vehicles over that route?

Odds are commute minutes are relatively high without mixing units.
 
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You're mixing your time periods. How many evening rush hour vehicles are inconvenienced?

Or what is the average impact to all vehicles over that route?

Odds are commute minutes are relatively high without mixing units.

Not only is there a time period mix-up; but an odd conflation.

The vast majority of rush-hour users of Woodbine don't live in the ward.
 
You're mixing your time periods. How many evening rush hour vehicles are inconvenienced?

Or what is the average impact to all vehicles over that route?

Odds are commute minutes are relatively high without mixing units.

sorry....what...1/2 of all users are at rush hour? So only 10,000 users are impacted to the benefit of 220? Regardless of the numbers unless you have enough users on a bike lane (thousands per day) the perception of people on the road is that the bike lane is EMPTY (and at 220 it is). If we were removing one lane for thousands of bikes it makes sense. If we were removing parking for hundreds it would make sense.

But removing a very busy traffic lane for 220 bikes makes zero sense.
Unless the people truly want a war on the car.
 
Honestly, the way Toronto has developed, particularly the suburbs, all the modes of transit are screwed. The streets don't work for anyone: car, transit, bike and pedestrian. And because everything is built out, there is no room for widening the roads to add bus/bike lanes. Any shift from one mode will inevitably feel like a "war" to users of the other modes.
 
Honestly, the way Toronto has developed, particularly the suburbs, all the modes of transit are screwed. The streets don't work for anyone: car, transit, bike and pedestrian. And because everything is built out, there is no room for widening the roads to add bus/bike lanes. Any shift from one mode will inevitably feel like a "war" to users of the other modes.

All of the major E-W roads in Scarborough and through most of North-York, east of Bayview have an ROW designed for six-lanes.

Most do not use that space over their entire length. In those sections, widening a 4-lane cross-section to add separated bike lanes is entirely do-able.

Closer to the core, where cycling demand is also higher, there is far less room with which to play.

The six-lane sections of the suburban roads are more problematic, though, many have a central lane for turning movements, which if removed, could allow for bike lanes instead.

***

While I support the Woodbine Bike lanes, I agree it would have been nice to build support for cycling in a steady way, first.

Regrettably, neither the cycling unit in Transportation, nor many councillors have shown an inclination for strategic thought.

Ideally, the east end would have had the Donlands bike lanes first, (no lane reductions required south of Cosburn).

Then Coxwell, between Upper Gerrard and Cosburn or O'Connor.

Maximize the roll-out of Bikeshare, incent more transit users.

Then begin rolling the Danforth Bike lanes east, then do Woodbine.

However, that would have required the cooperation of certain Councillors were not inclined to be cooperative.

It would also have required a clear-minded push from Transportation in an orderly way.

Neither happened.

Have to take what you can get and the political flak that goes with that.
 
I think BRT lines would be much more useful than bike lanes in suburban areas.
 

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