G-20 Summit in Toronto

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

Oh, stop.

Apparently you're the minority. Unless the polls are asking the wrong people and incorrectly polled. Majority don't feel people have rights who live/work/hang out downtown. Maybe that is why Toronto has garnered so much hate? "Torontonians think they are the centre of the universe", "Torontonians are cold (like other big cities)." As the city expands, we've lost our concern for others and only have concern for ourselves. It's not to say everyone is like that, but a majority. Although NYC is labelled as a cold place, I have met a few nice people. As in Toronto, there are a few nice people but many don't care unless it's an inconvenience to themselves.

Toronto is one of the nicest places to live downtown or near downtown on the planet. The G20 soap opera has become an excuse for histrionics on all sides. It was a couple of days of Sturm und Drang, and it's over. The weekend after, a million people got sunburned in the same downtown, and the world was back to normal. Maybe we shouldn't hold summits here any more, and maybe the cops or the protesters or both went over the top, but Toronto is still a great place to live.

 

[nfitz]

Apparently you're the minority.

I assume that say they acted correctly are unaware of the numerous detailed reports of police brutality. These people are ignorant.

As opposed to those that are aware that the police have broken the law and abused people. I have not met one of those in the real world. Such peole who approve of police ignoring the laws and brutalizing people, are really awful, disgusting, people.

In a 2-day period more than double the number of people were arrested, than during the entire October crisis in 1970. And for that we were under martial law with the military taking control of certain areas. I'm sure you remember all the outcry for the next decade about how the police and military had abused their powers in October 1970 with mass arrests that were not warranted (I recall that there were a surprising number in British Columbia, where the RCMP decided it gave them carte blanche to deal with people who had nothing to do with Quebec).

Given the outcry and inquests in to the way the police mishandled the events of October 1970, I can't imagine we are not going to have similiar about this, where twice as many people were arrested, in only one city, in only 3 days.

 

[Catapult]

I assume that say they acted correctly are unaware of the numerous detailed reports of police brutality. These people are ignorant.

As opposed to those that are aware that the police have broken the law and abused people. I have not met one of those in the real world. Such peole who approve of police ignoring the laws and brutalizing people, are really awful, disgusting, people.

I suspect those that support the police's handling of the events don't support police brutality. I think there is some sceptism amongst those people that many of the acts in question were in fact cases of police brutality and instead have been fabricated or exagerated (e.g., as a defence or to further a political objective) or were required in the circumstances (e.g., mass arrests during the rioting wewre required because of the guerrilla and clandestine tactics of the rioters). Eg. while the story of the amputee having his artificial leg "ripped off" sounds terrible, I'm sure it is standard procedure when arresting someone with an artificial limb to remove it as it can be used as a weapon (club). That being said, I suspect there were some cases where certain officers acted improperly but generally speaking I support the police's tactics. They were unable to effectively contain the rioting and the ensuing destruction of property on Saturday using more restrained tactics so needed to adopt a more aggressive approach on Sunday. People have a right to peaceful protest. Once it turned violent these rights became secondary. I have very little sympathy for those so called innocent people that got caught up in the mess - in most cases they should not have been there once things turned violent. I'm surprised there is not more anger on here directed at the violent protestors. Without them the police would have just sat back and drank their Tim's coffee and the peaceful protests could have gone on.

 

[nfitz]

I suspect those that support the police's handling of the events don't support police brutality.

Perhaps not. in 1970 there was wide-spread public support for the handling of the police, and the government. It's only afterward, that things started to come out. I think the 2 major investigations into the RCMP's handling of the event, didn't start until years afterwards!

I'm surprised there is not more anger on here directed at the violent protestors.

There has been anger. And no one countered it. What's bizarre is that no one here is defending the violent protestors (or likely that concerned about their arrest), I'm simply amazed that we have people here defending police abuses and violence. You read studies in the past, of just how quickly people start behaving like the Nazis did in those 1950s pscyhological testing ... well now we are seeing it play out in the real world.

 

[AKS]

I assume that say they acted correctly are unaware of the numerous detailed reports of police brutality. These people are ignorant.

As opposed to those that are aware that the police have broken the law and abused people. I have not met one of those in the real world. Such peole who approve of police ignoring the laws and brutalizing people, are really awful, disgusting, people.

You still don't get it....It's not ignorance. People DON'T CARE. You've read some of the posts here. They say, G20 is over. Leave it alone and get on with life. THEY DON'T CARE.

Some maybe even scared of standing out if arguing when you're the minority. In China, you "disappear into the night" if you oppose the government or something bad will happen to you. I'm sure some people in Canada may habour such fears. They would just say, leave it to the investigations to decide. They don't care what happens as long as they are comfy and nobody troubles them.

It could be many factors.

Welcome to the real world.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

AKS:

And you accuse Torontonians of being "self centered" and not caring of others? You just tacitly acknowledged and justified the same attitudes exhibited. Thankfully, rule of law isn't as fickle as opinion polls.

AoD

 

[Admiral Beez]

Well that's one person who supports the police beating people already in custody?

You can add me to your list. Toronto cops did good work.

 

[Admiral Beez]

If I remember correctly. Bill Blair said because of the huge amount of police in the area. Downtown Toronto will be the safest city in Canada. How did the safest area become the most dangerous area?

Are you seriously referring to downtown Toronto on that Sunday as the most dangerous place in Canada? How many people died? Never heard of Abbotsford-Mission, the murder capital of Canada? Now that's a dangerous place.

 

[Second_in_pie]

^^ Could you name another place in the country in which you can be just arrested "for being there" ? Oh wait, military bases. But do these areas have riot police everywhere, speculation to attract a terrorist act on world leaders, and havethe main street in the city/town/base sacked by rioters?

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Sip:

If the threats are so great, then declare a state of emergency and suspend civil rights - the government has the power to do so. Clearly, it is not deemed so much a threat that necessitated restriction on the physical presence of citizens, bar the physical barrier.

AoD

 

[Second_in_pie]

The point is that, with cops being brought in from all of the country, we still saw Yonge street sacked. And then because the cops didn't retaliate against an actual threat and make things safer to ordinary people, they made it more dangerous to the average person, deciding to crack down on all protests. And so, apparently you had it coming if you're hanging around downtown and were arbitrarily arrested for being in your city, and then not even charged for any crime. I'm pretty sure that's actually against our constitution.

 

[AKS]

AKS:

And you accuse Torontonians of being "self centered" and not caring of others? You just tacitly acknowledged and justified the same attitudes exhibited. Thankfully, rule of law isn't as fickle as opinion polls.

AoD

I am saying people don't care. Niftz says they are ignorant. Well, would you label all people who don't care ignorant? Whether ignorant or not, that seems to be how people act. I'm just making a statement. I'm sure many places in Canada hate Toronto and couldn't care less what happens to them. And coldly, I think Toronto doesn't care about others too.

Are you seriously referring to downtown Toronto on that Sunday as the most dangerous place in Canada? How many people died? Never heard of Abbotsford-Mission, the murder capital of Canada? Now that's a dangerous place.

If you felt Toronto was so safe on Sunday. How come you are blaming others for hanging out on Sunday downtown saying it's their own fault for being there? The police were suppose to protect them, not mistreat them and take them to detention centres.

 

[tkip]

At this point I don't have a clue as to what happened on that weekend.

People are blaming Blair but wouldn't he needed the okay from the Premier's office or something like that? I'm not sure Blair can take the blame in all this. He might have wanted to handle things differently but had his own orders. A public inquiry will probably reveal what many suspect. That the cops overreacted in their zeal on sunday, possibly due to SOMEONE ordering the crackdown but why the crackdown if there was no credible or immediate threat?

Something about this whole affair still seems off.

 

[picard102]

Majority of Canadians believe hosting G20 a mistake: poll

Please take Canada serriously and consider us a major player on the world stage, but please don't have a major event here. And if you do want us to be a part of the world community, please do not have us host it in our biggest and best city.

 

[gristle]

People live downtown. There's quite a few condos surrounding Queen and Spadina, where the police corralled and arrested everyone no matter their reasons for being trapped there. People work downtown. I had to work the weekend specifically because of the summits. People shop, eat, be entertained downtown. There was still a major jazz festival downtown, Second City was running, as were most restaurants and most stores downtown.

I'm one of those people who live downtown - not at all far from where the events of Sunday took place. I have to report that most of the people walking through the area around that time were not held by the police. I passed through the Queen-Spadina intersection myself while people were protesting there, and I moved on. I find it hard to believe that anyone carrying out this kind of activity on this particular weekend were not aware that it would attract police attention. It's not unreasonable to suggest that this certainly was one purpose for this particular protest. Had it been any other weekend, and had a roving group of protesters sat down on the middle of that intersection, it would obviously have drawn the attention of the police.

The fact is, most of those held that evening were not arrested. The police can do that. And while I know that there are people who believe that there is some well-defined right to watch an unscheduled protests that shuts down streets, they should be aware that when they are told to move on by police, they probably should move on. There is no way to clearly distinguish on-looker from protester. Add to that, police vehicles were attacked and destroyed about a block away less than twenty-four hours earlier. Those participating were tuned into the fact that police would show in large numbers. That's what they wanted.