G-20 Summit in Toronto

[Juan_Lennon416]

Here is a lesson for all Torontonians after this weekend: Anytime you hear the term 'thug', please do not automatically assume young Black males in dark baggy clothing. Thugs come in all shapes, sizes and colours and I wish people stop jumping to that extremely annoying conclusion!

 

[kEiThZ]

Why are almost all of the protesters white? Doesn't Toronto have something like 49% visible minorities? Why does the racial makeup of the protesters not reflect the racial makeup of the city?

Because they aren't Torontonians. They are just professional protestors who roam from one international event to another.

 

[Benc7]

As a protestor, I think you'd be pissed at the ones who caused all the foolishness. You likely had a legitimate grievance and/or point you wanted to make, and those goons denied you the chance.

I'm terribly pissed-off at them. Terribly. I love this city, and watching what's happened to it over the last month( the construction of that vile fence)and especially over the last two days ...hurts.

 

[kEiThZ]

The Globe & Mail

Would someone be able to tell me the legality of using unmarked stationary vehicles for police roundups?

This isn't the US. There's no such thing as Miranda rights here. A Peace Officer or someone who has been deputed can make an arrest or detain somebody without any issues if he/she observes a crime. And they can use whatever vehicle or building they want to detain the individual.

 

[Redroom Studios]

^^^well stated Marko!

violence is completely futile. what these punks dont understand is that not only are corporations and governments their 'enemies', but that also the majority of public opinion is against them. They should thank their lucky stars that this isnt the south or mid-west US where citizens are more aggressive about defending their personal property with firearms. If these idiots dont like the civilization that we have, then they are welcome to go live out in the woods. But as Marko states, they are probably incapable of living outside their parents basement.

for those complaining that the violence has not been making international news, CBC ran a series of reports that aired on the American networks. Also I heard comments from a Japanese tv crew that they were spending more time covering the action in the streets than the conference itself.

 

[urbandreamer]

Why were many of the protesters white?

Because many of the (more violent, active) protesters are from the ROC--small town Ontario, suburban and smaller centres like Burlington, Hamilton, Guelph, K-W, Thunder Bay, Perth County, London, etc. The hippies were university students by the looks of things--un/under-employed kids with little to lose.

The very fact they chose to trash Yonge St and Queen West identifies them as out-of-towners.

Those arrested at UofT student residences? Probably foreigners and folks from Quebec, who love staying in these residences which are converted to cheap hostels during the summer.

I was on my long walk from the Beach to High Park along Queen Street yesterday afternoon when I saw the black bloc kids (they were kids mostly, teenagers, university students and some working class types) etc start charging eastwards. I was wondering where the protesters had gone, because the street was relatively empty. Yes, a crowd had gathered around the few kids smashing the cop car (eventually to torch it) at Queen and Spadina. Yes, even I watched some violence and smashing. But like most, we were typical polite Torontonians watching, filming the show, frightened to take action--is it really worthwhile to get hurt over a bunch of brats high on testosterone armed with hammers?

I moved west. Amused, but realizing neither the actions of the protesters nor the actions of the g20 leaders means a damn thing to me!

Dinner at the Drake proved amusing--out of touch Queen West yuppies politely discussed the protest while out of touch "part of the elite" CBC reporters Peter Mansbridge and co served as background noise on the TV display. I tuned out.

 

[gristle]

It's worse than that: I think governments generally benefit from the confusion in public opinion of legitimate concerns (e.g. social equity & conditions, the environment) with random violence, since it provides an extra excuse not to tackle the real problems, and changes the focus to the apparently more immediate problem of maintaining public order. Will it surprise anyone if provincial/federal parliaments spend a lot of time on revisions to public order legislation over the next year or two? And that their interactions with public interest groups will be even more narrow, debate with just those that meet some kind of ideological taste test. After all, "this must not happen again!". Best then, to sharpen the laws...

I think your suggestion is silly. You presume "government" to be some monolithic institution that is utterly out of touch with the population, but that is to be expected of apologists of violence - like you. I can guarantee you that those who carried out the public destruction and the intimidation of the populace don't give one shit about what goes on in the rest of the world. On the contrary, they use the cover of what you call "legitimate concerns" as an excuse for their violence. Some bunch of heroes. I'm pretty sure that the vast majority of these so-called "anarchists" have not had to suffer from extreme poverty of a lack of clean drinking water, but they use the existence of those things to legitimate their mass acts of vandalism. In the end, they achieve absolutely nothing positive or worthwhile for anyone - other than satisfying their selfish desire to cause damage and terrify others.

You also appear to be oblivious to the fact that it is the violent "anarchist" protesters who undermine reasonable forms of expression that can give voice to legitimate causes during these summits. You are so quick to condemn governments that you forget to recognize that the failure lies with those who can't express a legitimate reasoned thought, but opt instead to smash property and intimidate people. What we are left with is a situation where protest - the legitimate right to public free expression - comes with the anticipation of violence. In doing so, the entire idea of civil protest suffers because these violence-prone individuals have directly linked their destructive acts to protest activities. These individuals are true parasites. They feed off the good intentions of reasonable persons wishing to draw attention to a specific issue, they commit their callous crimes, and in doing so they undermine reasoned protest actions.

They deserve no protection and no defence for their actions. They should be exposed and repudiated by government, police and civil protesters alike.

 

[kalvinone]

As a visible minority myself, I wanted to contribute my 2 cents... thankfully, I don't live in the heart of downtown T.O. when things like this happens. I must agree that for the majority of Torontonians, we are to .... how to put this? afraid?? of getting involved.. it's like that psycological thing where: a) if I don't do it, someone else will.... and b) we avoid danger. I personally hate to see violent things happen in the city.... otherwise, I might as well move to (no offence) Chicago or something.
I'm PRO democracy, I'm PRO voicing, protesting and rallying for issues which I believe in, but when it turns ugly... it is something that I don't want to be involved in and avoid. By having violent protestors in the streets, just means to me, your fighting for a lost cause.

Com'on folks, there will always be things that we are personally be against that someone else will be PRO for... why? because we are all different and have different morals; and given the certain limitations which all leaders face (e.g. budget defecit and amount of money that they can spend, etc) there will always be trade-offs. Ultimately, we'll have to make sacrafices in some ways and need to make a decision somehow. Will your decision count? Yes it does - through your votes in elections and your candidates. They are the one's who should be representing your values. If everyone were to get in a room and just debate it, we'd never leave the room - so thankfully we don't have to, but our politicians do and should be candid about it.

If I were some big strong person who had bullet proof vests and so on, like some sort of super vigalante, I'd be kicking those violent protestors ass.

 

[Second_in_pie]

I might possibly be okay with these people if they had an actual cause. Burn a few cars and yell at people to show what life's like for a person in Somalia or DRC? Get aggressive because the government's still sitting on the fence over environmental damage? But no, they're just being rowdy for the fun of it, or at the very least for some very insignificant and/or stupid reasons. And as a result, they wrongfully discredit many other noble causes which tried to gain attention at the G20 to actually make the world a better place in their eyes. If they want anarchy, they should just buy themselves a one way ticket to Afghanistan or Somalia.

 

[gristle]

I might possibly be okay with these people if they had an actual cause. Burn a few cars and yell at people to show what life's like for a person in Somalia or DRC? Get aggressive because the government's still sitting on the fence over environmental damage? But no, they're just being rowdy for the fun of it, or at the very least for some very insignificant and/or stupid reasons. And as a result, they wrongfully discredit many other noble causes which tried to gain attention at the G20 to actually make the world a better place in their eyes. If they want anarchy, they should just buy themselves a one way ticket to Afghanistan or Somalia.

These morons know nothing of what goes on in Somalia or elsewhere. How would they presume to have a right to dictate such experiences to the people of this city? Exactly what "right" do they have to "get aggressive" over government inaction on the environment (or any such other accusation). Obviously they clearly failed to notice the kind of smoke and fumes that come from a burning automobiles. And they likely paid no attention to just how close one of those burning vehicles was to nearby buildings. The point is, they could not give a shit about others.

 

[marathe]

Why are almost all of the protesters white? Doesn't Toronto have something like 49% visible minorities? Why does the racial makeup of the protesters not reflect the racial makeup of the city?

As has been said, Quebec, Quebec, Quebec.

Did you hear the group after they burned the first police car? All shouting in French at one another.

Same as the group being escorted out of the residences and into jail. All quebecois.

I'd love to see some counter-protests whereby we'd go burn down parts of montreal or whatever backwater these idiots are from, but knowing the way Canada works we'd just wind up paying for the rebuilding (unlike Toronto, where our affected shopkeepers aren't likely to see squat).

Highly impressed with the police's reaction on the whole. Minimal violence and minimal deployment of the non-lethal stuff they had at their disposal. To hear what people were saying beforehand, this was going to be a total haze of tear gas, plastic bullets and sirens from the LRAD. Instead, we got what, two cannisters of tear gas and three plastic bullets.

 

[Second_in_pie]

These morons know nothing of what goes on in Somalia or elsewhere. How would they presume to have a right to dictate such experiences to the people of this city? Exactly what "right" do they have to "get aggressive" over government inaction on the environment (or any such other accusation). Obviously they clearly failed to notice the kind of smoke and fumes that come from a burning automobiles. And they likely paid no attention to just how close one of those burning vehicles was to nearby buildings. The point is, they could not give a shit about others.

There's a four letter word that goes really well to this situation in context: read. As in, read what my post said.

These people obviously have little cause to actually get angry about. They're just pillaging for self gratification to make them feel like big manly men. I said that if the people rioting were actually drawing attention to a cause form the govenment, such as poverty or the environment, that'd be justified in my opinion. Not hurting or killing people, but if you have to light up a few cars to get people to listen, I'd say that's tragic but not making them moronic dickheads. This kind of activity does.

EDIT: marathe, if you're looking for a target for that it'd be Sanguenay or Quebec, not Montreal.

 

[marathe]

EDIT: marathe, if you're looking for a target for that it'd be Sanguenay or Quebec, not Montreal.

Son of a. Yeah, you're 100% right. Montreal was the only city that I could think of. Well done.

 

[kettal]

I don't get it. There's a cop within every square metre of the city, yet no cops are here on Yonge street arresting these idiots?

http://watch.ctv.ca/news/latest/the-mayhem/#clip318869

 

[khris]

So I just saw Chief Bill Blair on CTV. A reported asked him why the Black Bloc weren't just snatched and arrested right when they were violently destroying things, and his answer was "it's so easy to be an armchair quarterback." Wow, what a way to avoid the answer.