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Exhibition Place

Northern Light

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Rather unimaginative meh that bends to the dictates of all the limitations around it.

AoD

I tend to agree.

Though I'm not sure this is the spot I would want to pour money into at the expense of a plethora of other more worthy projects.

Still, I think if I were looking at it, I'd be inclined to ask; "Is there any portion of this site which might be able to sustain year-round vibrancy? If so what and how?

I think I might be looking just south of Dufferin as one key area connecting to much of the King/Dufferin, and west Liberty Village areas; and I might wonder about giving the St. Lawrence Market a proper western twin.

I think might also be inclined to consider something akin to a Farmer's Market focused on other Ontario product with an eye to innovators, playing into the whole history of the Exhibition but not in a carny-way, but one that could alternate
providing a cheap route to consumers for local innovators with also having 1 or 2 days per week of linking innovators to venture capital or B2B links.

I think I'd also be inclined to commission at least one grand exhibition hall. Something forward-looking rather than historical.

Finally, I really do think there is a role for an urban mid-way; but the CNE's is too short a season to offer higher-caliber rides.

I'm not thinking Wonderland, though one-awesome rollercoaster, fully lit up at night as a skyline feature/landmark does have some appeal; but I'm more thinking of shifting Centerville over here, given its problems w/flooding, it would be a more accessible location, and support an extended season of Victoria Day weekend to Thanksgiving.
 

Northern Light

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Or...........we could just turn 1/2 the place into the world's largest Nude Beach...............and rename it Exhibitionist Place! ?

Tunnel Lakeshore, cascading beach with tiers down to the water's edge........
 

Johnny Au

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I tend to agree.

Though I'm not sure this is the spot I would want to pour money into at the expense of a plethora of other more worthy projects.

Still, I think if I were looking at it, I'd be inclined to ask; "Is there any portion of this site which might be able to sustain year-round vibrancy? If so what and how?

I think I might be looking just south of Dufferin as one key area connecting to much of the King/Dufferin, and west Liberty Village areas; and I might wonder about giving the St. Lawrence Market a proper western twin.

I think might also be inclined to consider something akin to a Farmer's Market focused on other Ontario product with an eye to innovators, playing into the whole history of the Exhibition but not in a carny-way, but one that could alternate
providing a cheap route to consumers for local innovators with also having 1 or 2 days per week of linking innovators to venture capital or B2B links.

I think I'd also be inclined to commission at least one grand exhibition hall. Something forward-looking rather than historical.

Finally, I really do think there is a role for an urban mid-way; but the CNE's is too short a season to offer higher-caliber rides.

I'm not thinking Wonderland, though one-awesome rollercoaster, fully lit up at night as a skyline feature/landmark does have some appeal; but I'm more thinking of shifting Centerville over here, given its problems w/flooding, it would be a more accessible location, and support an extended season of Victoria Day weekend to Thanksgiving.
It would be a great opportunity for RMC (best known for Steel Vengeance in Cedar Point in Sandusky, OH) to construct a signature hybrid roller coaster in Exhibition Place (if Wonderland doesn't get one).
 

MetroMan

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View attachment 235663

Rather unimaginative meh that bends to the dictates of all the limitations around it.

AoD

This is just space allocation. The actual design and detailed planning is yet to come. I'm pleasantly surprised with the size of the land bridge, which has essentially become a full park over Lake Shore that will presumably run in a tunnel.
 

Sub_Human

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I'm not sure the future role of the Exhibtion grounds midway/theme park based...
Would it still be the CNE if it was moved out of Exhibition Place to another part of the city?
For all the events at Exhibition Place like the CNE that require vast expanses of open ground or pavement, do they absolutely need to be on the waterfront? I suppose the air show and water skiing show during the CNE do, but not much else.
The soon-to-be-developed Downsview Airport site is an enormous area of flat open empty land. As part of an arrangement to allow for its rezoning, could a large part of it be acquired by the city to become the "new" Exhibition Place?
 
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DSC

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Would it still be the CNE if was moved out of Exhibition Place to another part of the city?
For all the events at Exhibition Place like the CNE that require vast expanses of open ground or pavement, do they absolutely need to be on the waterfront? I suppose the air show and water skiing show during the CNE do, but not much else.
The soon-to-be-developed Downsview Airport is an enormous area of flat open empty land. As part of an arrangement to allow for its rezoning, could a large part of it be acquired by the city to become the "new" Exhibition Place?
The CNE is an event not a location so it could certainly be moved but it needs to be well served by transit (which it generally is now).
 

Sub_Human

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W. K. Lis

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Exhibition Place used to be called Exhibition Park. It became "Place" because so much of the surface was given over to automobile parking instead of grass.

It became worse when they moved the streetcar Exhibition Loop from the south side of the Coliseum and Horse Palace over to the north side, under the Gardiner Expressway.
 

AlvinofDiaspar

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The Exhibition Place Master Plan (Phase 1) is available at: http://app.toronto.ca/tmmis/viewAgendaItemHistory.do?item=2020.EP11.23 Two parts.

If only they had followed through with that:

1592682620205.png

(from https://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2019/pb/bgrd/backgroundfile-130200.pdf'; low-res version available in report)

The rest of the report is a tedious read of yawns, "been there done that", etc. Like:

3.3.4.2 Complement Built Form with Programming and Open Space, reinstating the historical, balanced relationship between building and landscape •Ensure that proposed new buildings and structures will be compatible in scale with the monumental buildings and landscapes of the site. New architectural additions and landscape interventions will continue to promote design excellence with contextually appropriate and harmonious character, materiality and colour, encouraging active frontages and avoiding blank walls where feasible; (p. 122)

X hotel, I am looking at you. /s Did they just figured these things out after all these years? I am not sure where the "continue to" came from - or maybe their sense of "excellence" require a reevaluation.

AoD
 

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W. K. Lis

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The western side of Exhibition Place was the original Canadian National Exhibition (Toronto Industrial Exhibition), with the Dufferin Gates as the main entrance or gates. The eastern half was the Stanley Barracks Garrison (as in Garrison Creek) or the New Fort York, and the military reserve. The end of the New Fort and the Military Reserve began in 1903 and not really finishing until after World War II in 1946, when it was used as a demobilization centre for returning troops. Lousy historical remembrance today as a parking lot.

See link.

1931...
 

W. K. Lis

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Fort York's fate debated in 1958 as Gardiner Expressway goes up
Toronto's Fort York, which dates to the 18th century, may have to move to make way for a motorway.

Similar fate faced Old Fort York, just as New Fort York had made way for a parking lot for Exhibition Place.

See https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/877056579943/.


1958 Globe: Invade Old Fort—Proposed alignment of Gardiner Expressway

From link.

Looming large among Toronto’s myths are the tales of two expressways into the heart of the City: the Gardiner’s brush with Fort York, and the southward extension of the Allan Expressway, a.k.a. “Stop Spadina.” It is possible to see them linked not only in their sponsors’ determination to deliver progress at any cost, but also by the earnest opposition of those who fought them with such success.

The Gardiner Expressway was among the first major public works taken on by the Municipality of Metropolitan Toronto following its founding in 1954. Typical perhaps of the brash style of Frederick G. Gardiner, Metro's chairman for whom it was named, the road was under construction at its western end before its route had been worked out in detail through the heart of the city. Even then, some aspects as they became known excited immediate opposition and necessitated tactical retreats by the politicians in charge. One was the idea unveiled in early 1958 to place piers for the roadway and a connecting ramp from Bathurst Street within the ramparts of Fort York. The solution to this—bending the expressway a bit and eliminating the on-ramp—seems to have done little to increase the officials’ respect for Fort York. This was seen in a truly appalling 1959 scheme to extend Highway 400 to connect with the Gardiner, in interchanges that would have sterilized upwards of 30 acres of land west and south of the fort. It foreshadowed "Stop Spadina" a decade later.

The story of the Battle of Fort York in 1958-59 and its champions is found here.


Invade Old Fort—Proposed alignment of Gardiner Expressway at Old Fort York
The Globe and Mail, January 24, 1958 p4
Image courtesy The Globe and Mail via Toronto Public Library



Map Shows How Expressway Misses Fort, Toronto Star, January 2, 1959, p25. By Ed Parker.
Image courtesy The Toronto Star via Toronto Public Library
 
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