ESPN ranks Toronto as worst city in North America for pro sports

[old boy]

The record is clear - Toronto sporting franchises haven't made the playoff season very often for several years. ESPN awarded the dunce's hat to the right city as far as winning is concerned. But, Toronto area fans do get to see the widest spectrum of major league sports, albeit that NFL football is still " played " in Buffalo. The lack of hometown success has become chronic in this city, but these teams have a big enough market area to sustain their operations, apparently. Maybe, it boils down to a faceless corporate ownership that is fiscally content with the mediocrity. Maybe this city needs a " face ", a personality with deep pockets who really wants to win. With winning franchises in Toronto, the city would be at the very top ESPN-type surveys.

 

[jn_12]

I don't think there's anything wrong with supporting a losing team. No one would admonish Cubs, (and up until recently) Giants, Red Sox or White Sox fans for cheering for teams that have gone decades (and in the case of the cubs, a century) without winning. That's admirable. Furthermore, look at teams in the various European soccer leagues where typically only a select few (4 in England, 2 or 3 in Spain, 3 or 4 in Italy, 2 in Scotland...) have any chance at winning the league's championship every season, yet the teams without a chance are still strongly supported.

Not only that, but you can't say that the Raptors or the Leafs don't want to win. Both spend to the cap (sure, you could argue the Raptors can go over the cap, but it's certainly not an indication that they aren't trying), both have the most sought after/prominent GMs in the league, both invest in scouting in areas where other teams don't usually scout, and so on. In the case of the Blue Jays, they were driven by a poor ideology (Moneyball tactics) and the poor management that stemmed from that ideology over the last decade. This mindset has seemingly been fixed as they now have perhaps the brightest young mind in baseball as their GM.

This idea that Toronto teams aren't trying to win and are content with mediocrity is an unfounded joke.

 

[TOareaFan]

I don't think there's anything wrong with supporting a losing team. No one would admonish Cubs, (and up until recently) Giants, Red Sox or White Sox fans for cheering for teams that have gone decades (and in the case of the cubs, a century) without winning. That's admirable. Furthermore, look at teams in the various European soccer leagues where typically only a select few (4 in England, 2 or 3 in Spain, 3 or 4 in Italy, 2 in Scotland...) have any chance at winning the league's championship every season, yet the teams without a chance are still strongly supported.

Not only that, but you can't say that the Raptors or the Leafs don't want to win. Both spend to the cap (sure, you could argue the Raptors can go over the cap, but it's certainly not an indication that they aren't trying), both have the most sought after/prominent GMs in the league, both invest in scouting in areas where other teams don't usually scout, and so on. In the case of the Blue Jays, they were driven by a poor ideology (Moneyball tactics) and the poor management that stemmed from that ideology over the last decade. This mindset has seemingly been fixed as they now have perhaps the brightest young mind in baseball as their GM.

This idea that Toronto teams aren't trying to win and are content with mediocrity is an unfounded joke.

I would agree with all of that with minor exception that the teams outside the top 2 in Scotland are strongly supported.......last season the other teams' average attendances ranged from 2,900 to 14,200 and it is something like 5 years since any team outside the top 2 averaged over 15k per game. It is not like they are all small town teams (although some are).....two of them play in the capital city of Edinburgh (not much smaller than Glasgow) and one of the teams, Aberdeen, plays in the largest city in Britain that only has one senior professional team in town. I think the Scottish League is the poster child for those who believe that long terms of "no hope" eventually affects attendance.....not matter how passionate the core fans are.

 

[jn_12]

I would agree with all of that with minor exception that the teams outside the top 2 in Scotland are strongly supported.......last season the other teams' average attendances ranged from 2,900 to 14,200 and it is something like 5 years since any team outside the top 2 averaged over 15k per game. It is not like they are all small town teams (although some are).....two of them play in the capital city of Edinburgh (not much smaller than Glasgow) and one of the teams, Aberdeen, plays in the largest city in Britain that only has one senior professional team in town. I think the Scottish League is the poster child for those who believe that long terms of "no hope" eventually affects attendance.....not matter how passionate the core fans are.

Well, Hearts averages around 15k in a stadium that fits 17k. That's not horrible. Hibs is around 10-12k in a 20k stadium and the same goes for Aberdeen, which you're right isn't stellar, but not abysmal. Celtic and Rangers are obviously in a different world, but at the same time I don't think attendance is necessarily the only marker of fandom. Otherwise you'd have to say that Lazio and Roma aren't supported well because they fill less than half of the Stadio Olimpico, and I don't think anyone would say that even if they're not of the stature of Juventus (who actually draws significantly less fans to matches than both of the clubs), Inter or AC Milan.

I don't think Scotland's issue is the "no hope" scenario. I think there's more to it than just that. Economics, the weird league structure, too many very small towns in the league (I mean, Gretna was promoted to the SPL before succumbing to bankruptcy and it was a town of 2000 people), and increased access to the EPL and the Champions League all play a part. If Kilmarnock all of a sudden was competing for a championship then ya I'm sure people would come out, but I don't think it's the lack of championships that is keeping people away.

 

[TOareaFan]

If Kilmarnock all of a sudden was competing for a championship then ya I'm sure people would come out, but I don't think it's the lack of championships that is keeping people away.

Is that a heads I win tales you lose statement. "It is not lack of winning that keeps their attendance low but if they start winning their attendance will go up!"....your craftiness makes me jealous.

 

[MisterF]

Not only that, but you can't say that the Raptors or the Leafs don't want to win. Both spend to the cap (sure, you could argue the Raptors can go over the cap, but it's certainly not an indication that they aren't trying), both have the most sought after/prominent GMs in the league, both invest in scouting in areas where other teams don't usually scout, and so on. In the case of the Blue Jays, they were driven by a poor ideology (Moneyball tactics) and the poor management that stemmed from that ideology over the last decade. This mindset has seemingly been fixed as they now have perhaps the brightest young mind in baseball as their GM.

This idea that Toronto teams aren't trying to win and are content with mediocrity is an unfounded joke.

Exactly. In the case of the Leafs, before there was a salary cap they were one of the biggest spending teams in hockey. And they had consistently good teams because of it. The idea that an owner doesn't want to win because they're so rich makes no sense. Teams make way more money in the playoffs than the regular season, saying "we're content with mediocrity" is essentially turning down free money. And nobody who's rich enought to own a big league sports team would do that.

 

[GenerationW]

I agree that these teams all want to win. They just don't know how to go about it as well as some other teams.

As for ESPN, why does anyone care what they think?

 

[Towered]

How are the FC doing? I'm guessing as lousy as the others.