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Do you support Canada's involvment in Afghanistan?

"many others that are of greater strategic and emotional importance to many Canadians"

Which regions do you have in mind?

Just to clarify, I didn't mean that even more attention should be lavished upon Afghanistan itself, but on the fact that we have troops there.
 
I do not accept that Bush Jr. was simply trying to finish his Dad's business. I think the USA simply fell into a war essentially by mistake and poor governance, not conspiracy.

The younger Bush did say in the months leading up to the war that one of the reasons he had for going to war was to avenge the assassination atempt by Saddam Hussein on his father when the elder Bush visited Kuwait in the 1990s. It was by far his best justification to commit violence in Iraq. Couple that with the younger Bush's administration had made attacking Iraq a priority from the very begining of his presidency, even before September 11th, when it reaped a political bonanza to invade Iraq. Bush and his cabal had been working for this for more than 2 years before it invaded Iraq. IMO, it's way more than poor governance. It is malfeasance.

What are Canadians in Afghanistan for? To help rebuild the country? To curtail the heroin trade? To prop up the Karzai government? 95% of Afghanistan is in the control of warlords. Karzai is effectively the mayor of Kabul, and not much else. Opium cultivation flourishes now that the Taliban's drug enforcement regime has been removed. The country is being rebuilt... slowly. I'm not sure how many Afghanis are to benefit from Kabul's first 5-star hotel and other grandiose projects that are out-of-reach for the budgets of the ordinary Afghani citizen. I support Canadian involvement in Afghanistan, but not enthusiatically, because I don't see it as very effective.
 
I'm a little late but here's my two cents:

I have no problem with the Americans going into Afghanistan and removing the Taliban from power. However this is an American issue and I am not too happy with Canada sending about 2,500 combat troops. I would support Canada sending peacekeepers until the country, if ever, stabilizes but I just don't feel we should be responsible for cleaning up Regan's mess.
 
I see Afghanistan and Iraq as very similar. It's about oil, yes, but about more than oil. It's about power and control, and also about the imperialist attempt to remove anti-capitalist leaders from power and install puppet leaders sympathetic to and cooperative with the American administration. If 9/11 hadn't stirred up anti-muslim sentiment, there would have been a much better chance that Venezuela would already have been invaded and Chavez removed.

Removing the taliban was just another excuse, like all the different excuses used for the invasion of Iraq. Hillier believes in this cause, hence his comments about Canada going into Afghanistan to "kill scumbags", without elaborating on exactly who a scumbag is and how our soldiers are supposed to know.

Iraq is a mess simply because soldiers from countries such as the US and UK have gone in and killed people, claiming they are all "insurgents". From the Iraqis' point of view, the soldiers have come in and killed innocent men, women, and children. This comes directly from the mouths of American soldiers who have returned from Iraq and told of being ordered to fire indiscriminately on civilian vehicles and public areas - on the basis that anyone on the street can be considered guilty.

When people in Iraq (those who live there, those who have spoken to their relatives here, and those who have been there to visit) all have stories of innocent relatives, neighbours, and friends being killed by the occupying forces, then it becomes clear why the troops are unwelcome. If these troops were really in Iraq (and Afghanistan) to help, then we shouldn't be hearing these types of stories. The early claims of soldiers being welcomed with open arms and flowers are overwhelmingly untrue. All the people of Iraq and Afghanistan want is for the troops to get out. And as long as they remain, they will be unwelcome, they will be opposed, and the strife will continue. No good can come of it.

Afghanistan was a different story. But if the troops are there to help, as is so often claimed, then why is the majority of the population still without running water and electricity? What happened to the infrastructure rebuilding? The mainstream media picks up on one example of a rebuilding project, and that is all we get to see. No wonder that the minority of the North American population which bothers to read these stories has a distorted view. CNN and Fox News are well known for presenting a biased view, but sadly, our own, trusted media are little better. The papers in the last few days have been trumpeting front page stories about what is supposedly going on in Afghanistan, but not the details I am mentioning here.

What is happening in Afghanistan and Iraq is privatization of resources and services. Why do you think Paul Martin was so eager to get assurance from Bush that despite Canada refusing to send troops to Iraq, Canadian companies would be allowed to help "rebuild"? How much sense does it make to anyone that MCI would rebuild Iraq's cell phone infrastructure to North American standards (so that Iraqi cell phones don't work anywhere else in the middle east or Europe)? How much sense does it make to deliver the first cell phones to pizza restaurants (instead of doctors and hospitals) so that soldiers can order their dinner? Does anyone care about the Afghans and Iraqis?

Or does anyone really care about democracy? This is another claim made by Bush - that Americans are bringing democracy to other countries and other parts of the world. Yet what the US has done time and time again is to remove presidents and prime ministers of other countries - some democratically elected with large majorities - and install puppet leaders. This is what we have seen in Haiti most recently, and also what we know the US is dying to do in Venezuela. The US is panicking as they see their domination and influence slipping - as more and more countries in Latin America elect leftist governments (Bolivia, anyone?). Put the case of Haiti together with your arguments over Iraq, along with the history of countries such as Chile, and it's hard to defend what is happening in Afghanistan.

One further note: just as Bush guaranteed that, by invading Iraq, the US will be a target of terrorism for many years to come, so Canada becomes a terrorism target, not only for our actions of sending more troops and stepping up our aggression, but for Hillier's comments that we are going into Afghanistan to kill, and that our military are not "peacekeepers". What good can come of that?

March 18 is the third anniversary of the invasion of Iraq. Last year and the year before, a lot of people were very eager to join the protests over the occupation of Iraq, but adding the argument over withdrawing troops from Afghanistan confused a lot of people and in the end kept some from joining in. This year, more and more people are finally starting to "get" it, which is exactly why Harper is doing his best PR and trying to make the occupation look noble and necessary. Last report I saw had 62% of Canadians opposed to Canadian troops in Afghanistan.

I will reiterate: what good can occupying troops do in a country where they are, with good justification, hated and resented?

For those who care about what is happening, come out next Saturday (March 18 ) and join the protests. I will be out and hope to see you there. I will be in Mississauga for their protest first (10:30 AM, public square at Hurontario & Dundas, South East Corner) and then downtown for the big protest at 1:00 pm (across from the US Consulate, 360 University Ave.). (Note: This is a non-violent protest.)
 
^March 18th is my birthday, ironically.

The problem that Americans don't understand in South America, for example, is that the leftist governments are helping the very poor in those nations. They aren't the most sympathetic to US dominance for a reason. The US demands their natural resources with little payback except among the elites controlling the oil trade.

Why the US cannot learn to live with nations that want to control their own resources and own destiny is beyond me. The world isn't an economic playground for the USA to go doing as it wishes. While the USA preaches freedom, its practicing imperialism.

What makes me sad is that Canada is acting more like the US these days. I still admire Canada as there's more general good going on than bad, but I certainly don't agree with the Harper government.
 
From CBC:

Canadian soldiers fatally shoot taxi drive
Last Updated Wed, 15 Mar 2006 07:49:46 EST
CBC News

Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan fatally shot a taxi driver who came within less than a metre of their patrol, military officials said on Wednesday.

Lt.-Col. Derek Basinger, chief of staff for Task Force Afghanistan.
The shooting happened late Tuesday local time, about four kilometres from the Canadian base in the southern Afghan city of Kandahar, said Capt. Julie Roberge.

Afghan police have launched an investigation.

The man, identified as Nasrat Ghali and believed to be in his mid-40s, was driving a three-wheeled motorized taxi known locally as a rickshaw. Canadian troops fired warning shots at him after he drove through an Afghan police checkpoint, coming within less than one metre from the Canadian vehicle, said Lt.-Col. Derek Basinger, chief of staff for Task Force Afghanistan..

"Our rules do not allow any Afghans to come within a certain distance," Basinger said.

The taxi driver was treated by the Canadians at the scene, but later died in hospital.

There were no passengers in the vehicle at the time of the shooting.

Radio broadcasts warn locals not to drive too close to military patrols because of the threat of suicide attacks.

Basinger said Canadian troops have fired at roughly 10 Afghan vehicles in the past month.

Two Canadian soldiers were killed when their armoured vehicle crashed into a taxi on the outskirts of Kandahar on March 2. Cpl. Paul Davis and Master Cpl. Timothy Wilson died in the incident, which injured five other soldiers.

One day later, five more Canadians were injured when a suicide bomber drove a small truck into their convoy near Kandahar.

More than 2,200 Canadian soldiers are stationed in and around Kandahar as part of a multinational brigade under the command of Canadian Brig.-Gen David Fraser.

Copyright © CBC 2006
_________________________________________________

Depending on how this plays out, these sort of thing could have a long term impact on how Canadians are perceived by the general population.

AoD
 
Afghanistan was a different story. But if the troops are there to help, as is so often claimed, then why is the majority of the population still without running water and electricity? What happened to the infrastructure rebuilding?

Because the infrastructure is f*cking obliterated from decades of war. The troops are there to provide security and stability, and are not there to build power plants or hang electrical wire. The country is not secure from ethnic, religious or factional violence; it is broke; has no oil whatsoever; no financial assets; a generation with virtually no education; lacks a significant population with contemporary technical education; has no integrated industry to speak of, has suffered from drought for years and cannot yet safely support a population of foreign workers to even begin addressing these and so many other problems.

On this count, it is extremely different from Iraq.
 
thank the talibastards.

Talibanbeating.jpg
 

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