Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

[Coolibop]

Is it? I thought they told you it was paused for maintenance. Did they tell you something else as well?

If one was driving to Montreal, and the car fell to pieces, you would be paused for maintenance.

I inquired specifically about the rumors being stopped: 'Work is currently paused for planned maintenance' [emphasis added].

Note I don't often take anything they respond with too seriously as it typically has little information... Again, I'm suprised that they are purposefully misinforming.

 

[nfitz]

Again, I'm suprised that they are purposefully misinforming.

Surprised?

Though I don't think what they are saying is false. It's highly misleading and redirecting though. But that's 100% Metrolinx.

 

[evandyk]

I think that to a PR person, "paused for maintenance" covers the situation where there's a major failure and no work can be done until it's fixed. If it was small and expected, you would say "routine maintenance".

 

[max]

I inquired specifically about the rumors being stopped: 'Work is currently paused for planned maintenance' [emphasis added]

Once they found out it broke, they made a plan to fix it!

 

[Aplus23]

They just reconstructed the back parking lot of the community centre Don Montgomery CRC next to Kennedy station for the anticipation of the closing of the front parking lot starting in January for like 7yrs or whatever the case may be

 

[crs1026]

You are driving the car to the dealer to get scheduled maintenance, but it breaks down en route. So now you are doing your planned maintenance..... on the side of the road.
Nobody heard about an intervention shaft until the TBM suddenly stopped. I'd guess this is not part of the plan.

- Paul

 

[TOtramz]

I think that to a PR person, "paused for maintenance" covers the situation where there's a major failure and no work can be done until it's fixed. If it was small and expected, you would say "routine maintenance".

Yes that is quite the understatement....

Let's hope it doesn't take 6 months to ship a cutting-head all the way from Germany

 

[evandyk]

You are driving the car to the dealer to get scheduled maintenance, but it breaks down en route. So now you are doing your planned maintenance..... on the side of the road.
Nobody heard about an intervention shaft until the TBM suddenly stopped. I'd guess this is not part of the plan.

- Paul

Was not part of last week's plan, you mean. But their email was not about last week's plan!

(I work with Corporate PR people a lot, I know how it works...)

 

[smallspy]

I inquired specifically about the rumors being stopped: 'Work is currently paused for planned maintenance' [emphasis added].

Note I don't often take anything they respond with too seriously as it typically has little information... Again, I'm suprised that they are purposefully misinforming.

First off, I should note that my insider network at Metrolinx does not cover the SSE yet.

Second, my comments were made as a suspicion. An educated guess based on people that I know of in the tunnelling industry, elsewhere in construction and Metrolinx's own previously published schedules.

And I guess, herein lies the problem. Metrolinx publishes an early schedule, then tries to wipe it from the internet once something goes sideways. The earliest version of it stated that the TBM was supposed to go more-or-less non-stop to a point just south of Lawrence along McCowan. There, a shaft was going to have been dug in advance to allow access to it, presumably to the cutterhead. This is a pretty standard thing to do for large diameter TBMs, and was entirely expected as it was a reasonable thing to do.

To have it stop well before that point to expose any part of the TBM is exceedingly unusual, and points to a bigger issue that can not be repaired while it is buried and underground.

Now, in the defense of the Comms staff at Metrolinx, I don't think that it's fair to describe their answer to you as a lie. They are only giving out the answers that they are being given from above. And in fairness, it may be "planned" in the sense that they came up with a plan in the past month to effect whatever repairs are necessary to the TBM.

Dan

 

[Coolibop]

Now, in the defense of the Comms staff at Metrolinx, I don't think that it's fair to describe their answer to you as a lie.

Well it was given context of a reputable member .

It wasn't planned.

something major has happened

That does not jive with:

Work is currently paused for planned maintenance

So, if it was indeed planned then my points above are moot...

I would have expected something along the lines of:

challenges or difficulties working towards... while mitigating via...

Their perversion of wordsmithing is really something in this instance. Can't take the heat from possible questions about revealing some truth? Then you deserve all the criticism (above)...

Public money projects should not spend on defending the egos of its leaders or whomever is steering the ship.

They are only giving out the answers that they are being given from above.

Even if the premier himself responded, the point is they are they are going out of their way (with our money) to obscure and show they are some infallible organization that can do no wrong.

And in fairness, it may be "planned" in the sense that they came up with a plan in the past month to effect whatever repairs are necessary to the TBM.

That is beyond quite the stretch for 'planned maintenance' which carries the meaning that it is regular/normal work.

 

[smallspy]

That does not jive with:

So, if it was indeed planned then my points above are moot...

I'm not a fan of the marketing wank and spin either, but it's not a completely untrue statement.

A lie? No. Completely and totally accurate? No. But it does fit somewhere in between them.

Their perversion of wordsmithing is really something in this instance. Can't take the heat from possible questions about revealing some truth? Then you deserve all the criticism (above)...

No arguments from me. They are one of the most opaque organizations that any of us will deal with on a regular basis.

Public money projects should not spend on defending the egos of its leaders or whomever is steering the ship.

Agreed.

Even if the premier himself responded, the point is they are they are going out of their way (with our money) to obscure and show they are some infallible organization that can do no wrong.

To you and I (and the rest of us here), completely and totally correct.

But to the layperson who doesn't follow these projects like we do? They don't care about the nitty-gritty details, and an answer like this is more than adequate for the level of interest that they may have.

That is beyond quite the stretch for 'planned maintenance' which carries the meaning that it is regular/normal work.

To you, that may be the case.

But on its face, "planned maintenance" indicates that there was a plan to do that work there and then. It doesn't say anything about when and where the plan was created.

Dan

 

[crs1026]

The more telling question would be to ask ML, is the overall progress of the TBM within the planned timeframe and contingency, or has the maintenance plan tcd now causing a change to the planned end date for tunnelling?

ML may be able to wordsmith the events and work tasks..... but either the thing is going to proceed within plan, or it isn't. And that detail should certainly be divulged as soon as the schedule no longer is valid.

- Paul

 

[Coolibop]

The more telling question would be to ask ML, is the overall progress of the TBM within the planned timeframe and contingency, or has the maintenance plan tcd now causing a change to the planned end date for tunnelling?

ML may be able to wordsmith the events and work tasks..... but either the thing is going to proceed within plan, or it isn't. And that detail should certainly be divulged as soon as the schedule no longer is valid.

- Paul

I'm pretty sure that was specifically what was asked and they did not even address it lol...I don't think we'll get a straight answer on that either... Which I assume means they aren't on track.

Similarly, when I inquired about the return of LSE express trains a few months before the deadline they said they were still on track (for August '24). No surprise.... now there is no deadline to track just like other projects. Here's the closest they got:

Our initial tunneling phase has focused on fine-tuning and baselining operations for the largest TBM ever used for a transit project in Canada.

As Dan mentioned above, they make the plan, then scrub it from the public realm to save face.

 

[crs1026]

^This is as good a place and time as any to repeat my question as to how ML can produce an annual report and MD&A bearing an auditor's stamp, when it has undisclosed project deficiencies so large that they must be material to ML's finances and health as an organization.

One would think that even one month's financing charges on a delayed project that costs in the billions ought to be enough to create a line item in their financials.

I'm sure that those with a much better knowledge of such matters and law will be able to set me straight - but as a less informed layman, I would wonder whether the auditor is open to being sued or professionally sanctioned for allowing that level of non-disclosure on statements that are supposed to be the truth, and the whole truth. And while ML is public sector, most governments require their agencies to mirror or come close to the truthfulness of publicly traded companies whose public-facing statements are heavily regulated. But maybe I'm a dinosaur from the Enron - Sarbanes-Oxley days.

- Paul

 

[micheal_can]

^This is as good a place and time as any to repeat my question as to how ML can produce an annual report and MD&A bearing an auditor's stamp, when it has undisclosed project deficiencies so large that they must be material to ML's finances and health as an organization.

One would think that even one month's financing charges on a delayed project that costs in the billions ought to be enough to create a line item in their financials.

I'm sure that those with a much better knowledge of such matters and law will be able to set me straight - but as a less informed layman, I would wonder whether the auditor is open to being sued or professionally sanctioned for allowing that level of non-disclosure on statements that are supposed to be the truth, and the whole truth. And while ML is public sector, most governments require their agencies to mirror or come close to the truthfulness of publicly traded companies whose public-facing statements are heavily regulated. But maybe I'm a dinosaur from the Enron - Sarbanes-Oxley days.

- Paul

If I am understanding what you are asking, Are you speaking of things like a difference in rock that was not planned for,so they need to do something different? If that is what you mean, I feel that is something that is planned for within the amount bid for. If it goes beyond that, they likely are still fine . Ever hear a project come under budget and early? It is these issues that cause that to not be a normal thing.