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Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

JasonParis said:
I can see Halton Radial taking a set too. But I love the idea of one in front of Scarborough City Hall.
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I don't think they will. They already have more equipment than they can handle and a large portion of it is rotting away awaiting restoration.

The TRM likely has space constraints. From what I recall during my time with the TRHA there needs to be proper weight distribution over the MTCC Parking Garage. This means they have to space out the equipment to avoid issues with load restrictions. With everything they already have, I suspect they cannot take anymore equipment.

The only logical place would be Exporail but I am not sure if they need or want it.
 
Richard White said:
I don't think they will. They already have more equipment than they can handle and a large portion of it is rotting away awaiting restoration.

The TRM likely has space constraints. From what I recall during my time with the TRHA there needs to be proper weight distribution over the MTCC Parking Garage. This means they have to space out the equipment to avoid issues with load restrictions. With everything they already have, I suspect they cannot take anymore equipment.

The only logical place would be Exporail but I am not sure if they need or want it.
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If only there was a Toronto Transport Museum…
 
Sandpit said:
If only there was a Toronto Transport Museum…
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We as a city don’t seem to value our history. Let alone transport history. I am thankful for the few pieces of equipment we do have, despite them being rarely used. New York’s preservation of transport history is legendary. And it’s not just for the appreciation of transit nerds. Their heritage trains and buses draw huge crowds of the general public.

I should also add I’m very grateful that many of my friends have taken it upon themselves to preserve vehicles. We’re lucky to have an example of an early production model bus from Ontario Bus Industries preserved and well taken care of in Ontario.
 
What exactly makes the SRT more worthy of saving than the countless other vehicles retired over the past 20+ years that weren't saved? Why the double standard?? If it weren't for the whole line shutting down and they simply replaced the old trains with newer ones, would there still be as much hype about saving them? Probably not.
Richard White said:
The only logical place would be Exporail but I am not sure if they need or want it.
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They'd probably need/want it about as much as New York's Transit Museum would need/want one.
 
81-717 said:
What exactly makes the SRT more worthy of saving than the countless other vehicles retired over the past 20+ years that weren't saved? Why the double standard?? If it weren't for the whole line shutting down and they simply replaced the old trains with newer ones, would there still be as much hype about saving them? Probably not.
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So much about them were revolutionary. For starters,the motors were the guideways.
 
81-717 said:
What exactly makes the SRT more worthy of saving than the countless other vehicles retired over the past 20+ years that weren't saved? Why the double standard?? If it weren't for the whole line shutting down and they simply replaced the old trains with newer ones, would there still be as much hype about saving them? Probably not.
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Because other vehicles from the past also had significance and should have been saved too? ICTS was developed and built in Ontario. It’s a part of the Province’s history. Arguably a proud achievement too considering it was successful enough to sell to other cities and is still being offered today.
 
I agree about preservation. A CLRV is preserved in working order at Halton County, but given the difficulty storing an ALRV, it’s not worth keeping one around. An ICTS car should be preserved, and Halton County is a perfect place for one, in permanent static display, especially as it is still in good structural condition. Given the history of transit development in the 1970s and 1980s, it’s worthy.

One problem with HCRY, mentioned above, is they need more indoor storage space not only for newly acquired equipment, but also to allow some of its existing stock to breathe as the main display barn is a bit cramped. We also saw what happened to its collection of TTC and HSR trolley buses left outside near the front entrance – there’s not much left of those.

The other problem too is that too many volunteers want to do their own thing, rather than work on a single restoration project.

I like the idea of having one SRT car left in Scarborough, perhaps as a feature of a Scarborough High Line between Midland and McCowan.
 
The concepts of preserving vs using/operating something is a matter of constant debate among historians and curators. Publicly-funded museums typically are not funded or equipped to operate artifacts, whereas the capacity of private museums or historical societies is dependent on their support base. Outside of the ROM, I'm not aware that there is a broad-mandate 'Ontario museum'.

If the technology of the day was that cutting edge, perhaps one should go to the Science and Tech Museum in Ottawa.
 
ShonTron said:
I agree about preservation. A CLRV is preserved in working order at Halton County, but given the difficulty storing an ALRV, it’s not worth keeping one around. An ICTS car should be preserved, and Halton County is a perfect place for one, in permanent static display, especially as it is still in good structural condition. Given the history of transit development in the 1970s and 1980s, it’s worthy.

One problem with HCRY, mentioned above, is they need more indoor storage space not only for newly acquired equipment, but also to allow some of its existing stock to breathe as the main display barn is a bit cramped. We also saw what happened to its collection of TTC and HSR trolley buses left outside near the front entrance – there’s not much left of those.

The other problem too is that too many volunteers want to do their own thing, rather than work on a single restoration project.

I like the idea of having one SRT car left in Scarborough, perhaps as a feature of a Scarborough High Line between Midland and McCowan.
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I profusely disagree about the ALRV. I think it is critical that they hold on to that one. There are only 2 left, and if they got rid of it, and TTC ever ended up doing what some of us have privately feared for a few years (that they were jacking up the charter rates so that they could claim no one is interested in them, and ultimately using this as an excuse to get rid of the heritage fleet), we would end up with no ALRV at all. Like them or not (many didn't), they were a significant part of the transit story. 4204 is also noteworthy for being the first and last in service, so IMO the argument for keeping it is bigger than for the TTC's 4207.

If something had to be removed from Halton to accomodate an SRT car, I would say the obvious candidate is W-31, the derelict sister car to W-30. W-30 doesn't require it to run, it would cost a pretty penny to get operational, and it doesn't represent anything that W-30 doesn't.

I will add though that this only makes sense to me as a last resort. Scrapping any PCC car, of any make, anywhere in the world, is sacrilege.
 
APTA-2048 said:
Because other vehicles from the past also had significance and should have been saved too?
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Of course they should have, but they weren't, and there never seemed to be nearly as much advocating to save them as there is now for the SRT (any suggestions of saving something would typically be met with dismissive comments like "buy one yourself" or being called a foamer for wanting X vehicle to be saved), which begs the question, why the double standard? Those who want the SRT saved aren't being told to do it themselves.
ShonTron said:
Given the history of transit development in the 1970s and 1980s, it’s worthy.
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I agree the 1970s and 1980s were probably the most interesting time in the history of (rail) transit development (not just in Toronto but in several other cities I've seen), but Toronto already lost an entire generation of subway cars from that era, and I for one don't think the SRT would be an even greater loss if it too isn't saved.
 
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