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Brampton Transit/Zum

It's hard to argue Viva blue is not a sucess ... I don't have the patients to dig through the numbers but I'd guess they're quite a higher now then before Viva blue ... even if they increase though ... that's not good enough, the question is how much they increased by and I'm just judging it on appearance.

Every other Viva line (purple / green) on the other hand, I doubt can be called as much of a success and I'd guess the numbers would reflect that.

But I wouldn't argue they're bad choices for routes ... they make sense ... maybe some of the turns and specifics but Yonge and Hi-way 7 are the main arteries by far in York region ... where else would you put them.
 
taal said:
It's hard to argue Viva blue is not a sucess ... I don't have the patients to dig through the numbers but I'd guess they're quite a higher now then before Viva blue ... even if they increase though ... that's not good enough, the question is how much they increased by and I'm just judging it on appearance.

Every other Viva line (purple / green) on the other hand, I doubt can be called as much of a success and I'd guess the numbers would reflect that.

But I wouldn't argue they're bad choices for routes ... they make sense ... maybe some of the turns and specifics but Yonge and Hi-way 7 are the main arteries by far in York region ... where else would you put them.
Click to expand...

highway 7 actually makes no sense for an express bus route, no one lives on highway 7, and there aren't enough destinations along it either. Let's not forget that Viva purples main destination is York U, which is not located on highway 7. They would have done better to maybe team up with toronto and improve steeles bus, or improve Major Mac, or 16th, which actually have people living on them. Don't get me wrong, there are pockets of life along highway 7, but for the most part, it's a factory wasteland.

Viva green...I never really saw it as being a winner to be honest. It doesn't follow a set travel trend, makes too many turns and change of streets to become appealing to anybody other than commuters.
 
Justin10000 said:
What are you talking about?

From the YRT Website:

"
YRT/Viva and Brampton Transit partnership speeds up service

The Regional Municipality of York and the City of Brampton have partnered to offer a new integrated rapid transit service for riders travelling between Brampton and York University.

In September, Brampton's new Züm rapid transit service will operate between downtown Brampton and York University along the Queen Street corridor in Brampton and Highway 7 in York Region. York Region's Viva orange service will continue to operate along Highway 7 between Martin Grove Road and York University.
Click to expand...

That's nice but still not a joint service like the current 77.

But yes, thanks to Brampton, the VIVA Orange corridor will have higher frequencies at all times than VIVA Blue. With the introduction of the 501, Highway 7 in Vaughan will have 7.5 minute frequencies at all times. In comparison, Yonge in Richmond Hill has 15 minutes frequencies in the off peak and 8.5 minutes during peak hours.

You don't see anything wrong or strange about that?

I think it alone says a lot about the difference between YRT and BT and why joint operation had be cancelled.
 
taal said:
It's hard to argue Viva blue is not a sucess ... I don't have the patients to dig through the numbers but I'd guess they're quite a higher now then before Viva blue ... even if they increase though ... that's not good enough, the question is how much they increased by and I'm just judging it on appearance.

Every other Viva line (purple / green) on the other hand, I doubt can be called as much of a success and I'd guess the numbers would reflect that.

But I wouldn't argue they're bad choices for routes ... they make sense ... maybe some of the turns and specifics but Yonge and Hi-way 7 are the main arteries by far in York region ... where else would you put them.
Click to expand...

VIVA blue also had the benefit of taking over for the former GO Yonge bus service. The ridership base was already there so you can't really say that VIVA blue attracted new riders, it simply absorbed the former GO bus riders.
 
TOareaFan said:
Really not sure of the answer there but is it not a bit of a societal shame that the subway in Toronto closes before the bars do?
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Haha definitely. They say to take transit home from the bars, but how can you when the subway is already closed by the time last call comes around? No one wants to take the blue line buses.

Never mind if last call ever gets pushed back further than 2 am, which it should.
 
I'm not sure if I want drunk people be taking transit. Aren't the buses and trains and stations dirty enough as is? Just take the taxi or get a ride or something.

Woodbridge_Heights said:
VIVA blue also had the benefit of taking over for the former GO Yonge bus service. The ridership base was already there so you can't really say that VIVA blue attracted new riders, it simply absorbed the former GO bus riders.
Click to expand...

I think ridership still increased along Yonge after VIVA.

Before Yonge C and Newmarket B had around 12,000 boardings per weekday combined, now VIVA Blue and YRT 98/99 have around 20,000 boardings. Perhaps there are simply more transfers or something, but the numbers seems much higher than before.
 
doady said:
That's nice but still not a joint service like the current 77.
Click to expand...

In a way, it is a joint service, as Zum will be utilizing VIVA'sstops,and next bus information signs

But yes, thanks to Brampton, the VIVA Orange corridor will have higher frequencies at all times than VIVA Blue. With the introduction of the 501, Highway 7 in Vaughan will have 7.5 minute frequencies at all times. In comparison, Yonge in Richmond Hill has 15 minutes frequencies in the off peak and 8.5 minutes during peak hours.

You don't see anything wrong or strange about that?

I think it alone says a lot about the difference between YRT and BT and why joint operation had be cancelled.
Click to expand...

It does not say anything about the difference between YRT, and BT. What I see is 2 limited stop routes that happen to run on the same route alignment, and both agencies agreeing to stagger the times to allow a higher frequencies to a large trip generator. Leaving BT aside,YRT is still providing better service on Yonge, than Hwy 7. You have Viva Blue, Viva Blue-A, 99, 98, compared to just the VIVA orange, and 77 on Hwy 7.

The only concern I have is YRT dropping the frequency of the 77 to 20 minutes peak.
 
doady said:
I'm not sure if I want drunk people be taking transit. Aren't the buses and trains and stations dirty enough as is? Just take the taxi or get a ride or something.



I think ridership still increased along Yonge after VIVA.

Before Yonge C and Newmarket B had around 12,000 boardings per weekday combined, now VIVA Blue and YRT 98/99 have around 20,000 boardings. Perhaps there are simply more transfers or something, but the numbers seems much higher than before.
Click to expand...

Are you taking into account all of York region's numbers prior as well? i.e. 12,000 is for GO alone? What was YRTs?
 
doady said:
But yes, thanks to Brampton, the VIVA Orange corridor will have higher frequencies at all times than VIVA Blue. With the introduction of the 501, Highway 7 in Vaughan will have 7.5 minute frequencies at all times. In comparison, Yonge in Richmond Hill has 15 minutes frequencies in the off peak and 8.5 minutes during peak hours.

You don't see anything wrong or strange about that?
Click to expand...

Why yes, I do see something wrong and strange about your that!

8.5 minutes Viva blue service at peak hours?!

I took the liberty of checking today's Viva Blue Schedule, and here is the 5:00 hour, leaving Finch Station northbound.

5:06p Blue to Newmarket GO Terminal
5:10p Blue to Bernard Terminal
5:13p Blue to Newmarket GO Terminal
5:17p Blue to Bernard Terminal
5:23p Blue A to Newmarket GO Terminal Bypassing Richmond Hill Centre Terminal
5:25p Blue to Bernard Terminal
5:28p Blue to Newmarket GO Terminal
5:32p Blue to Bernard Terminal
5:36p Blue to Newmarket GO Terminal
5:40p Blue to Bernard Terminal
5:43p Blue to Newmarket GO Termina
5:47p Blue to Bernard Terminal
5:53p Blue A to Newmarket GO Terminal Bypassing Richmond Hill Centre Terminal
5:55p Blue to Bernard Terminal
5:58p Blue to Newmarket GO Terminal

So, Between Bernard and Finch:
15 Viva buses per hour, or an average frequency of every 4 minutes.
If you include route 99, it becomes 20 buses per hour, or a bus every 3 minutes.

Between Bernard and Newmarket:
8 Viva buses per hour,or an average frequency of every 7.5 minutes.
If you include route 98, it becomes 9 buses per hour, or a bus every 6.7 minutes.

I do agree that there is no need for 7.5 minute service on Hwy 7 though.
 
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I was surprised that my parents who rarely use public transit had heard about Zum. They assumed it would connect with a subway station and were disappointed when I told them that it only went to York University (which is good for me since I'll be going there next month). Zum really should connect with Downsview station.
 
I guess the question is: does Brampton do what it can now or wait until they can do a "perfect" job. I'm not going to speculate on why it doesn't go to downsview, but it does represent a huge service improvement over the current 77, especially on weekends. The connection to downsview would depart from York U within a few minutes of arriving at almost all times of the day anyway. Is this a shortcoming? Sure. Does it make it a failure and the planners at BT incompetent (a phrase which loves to get thrown around)? Not in my opinion.

Either way, some people would argue that taking the 101 to the 192 at the Airport is a faster way of getting downtown anyway.
 
RedRocket191 said:
I guess the question is: does Brampton do what it can now or wait until they can do a "perfect" job. I'm not going to speculate on why it doesn't go to downsview, but it does represent a huge service improvement over the current 77, especially on weekends. The connection to downsview would depart from York U within a few minutes of arriving at almost all times of the day anyway. Is this a shortcoming? Sure. Does it make it a failure and the planners at BT incompetent (a phrase which loves to get thrown around)? Not in my opinion.

Either way, some people would argue that taking the 101 to the 192 at the Airport is a faster way of getting downtown anyway.
Click to expand...

People are saying planners at BT are incompetent? I grew up in Brampton, and I can honestly say BT has improved immensely. BT still has problems with connecting routes, but the planners are not incompetent.

I do not think it's a huge service improvement over the 77. There is still a large number of riders who want to travel east of Jane St. 20 minute peak service is terrible.
 
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