daveto
Active Member
Toronto has a structural deficit currently at approx $400m on a $9b total budget. The LTT represents $160m of revenue.
I think the chances of Ford abolishing that tax are slim to none.
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Baby, we got a bubble!?
- Thread starter simuls
- Start date
Toronto has a structural deficit currently at approx $400m on a $9b total budget. The LTT represents $160m of revenue.
I think the chances of Ford abolishing that tax are slim to none.
interested
Senior Member
Don't underestimate the actions of politicians. He may well cut other programs, end up revenue neutral to abolish the tax.
The other thing is McGinty is not popular now and has to go to the polls so that allows Ford to put pressure on McGinty ( who seems to bend with whatever way the wind blows ) so maybe Ford will get some provincial money just to keep Toronto on side for the next provincial election.
This turns my gut because the correct decision should be the "correct decision" whatever that is. Not the politically expedient solution which unfortunately we seem to get all the time. It's not just us, it seems to be politics everywhere.
EXgeMMy
Active Member
I work in the media and have had constant contact with Rob ford over the last few months as you can imagine.
This is what I've heard over the election run
- LTT brings in 200mil a year for the City of Toronto
- Ford recently started back peddling on eliminating LTT saying it had to go through the province. This is not true, city council can eliminate it. From the media perspective we've heard internal rumblings from the McGuinty camp that there might be a change coming for the LTT hence why Ford has been changing his dates. This is just rumours for us.
From a home buyer perspective City LTT on a 500K home in Toronto - about $5800 in tax. When real estate agents cry bloody murder and blame the LTT for the reason housing has slow I find this ridiculous.
Also throughout the campaign Ford said the city LTT would cost new homebuyers an extra $20-30K. Also ridiculous but that falls on the home buyers, they need to do their research and not take everything they hear verbatim.
This is what I've heard over the election run
- LTT brings in 200mil a year for the City of Toronto
- Ford recently started back peddling on eliminating LTT saying it had to go through the province. This is not true, city council can eliminate it. From the media perspective we've heard internal rumblings from the McGuinty camp that there might be a change coming for the LTT hence why Ford has been changing his dates. This is just rumours for us.
From a home buyer perspective City LTT on a 500K home in Toronto - about $5800 in tax. When real estate agents cry bloody murder and blame the LTT for the reason housing has slow I find this ridiculous.
Also throughout the campaign Ford said the city LTT would cost new homebuyers an extra $20-30K. Also ridiculous but that falls on the home buyers, they need to do their research and not take everything they hear verbatim.
simuls
Senior Member
Also, the LTT is quite ingenious as a revenue tool. Instead of having to find that $200million by raising everyone's property tax rate higher, it's separate and only hits you when you purchase - which would be on average, maybe once every 10 years. Ford would be an idiot to scrap it. He's backpeddling on this, on streetcars and he'll backpeddle on all his promises (except cutting councilors office budgets and maybe some attrition non-hires) because somebody will do the math and realize it just can't be done.
BrianPersaud
Active Member
agreed, lets hope he can really find those savings he was talking about. Real issue is that city wages are high and productivity is low......If he can get those savings in increased productivity and attirition of city staff that would be fantastic. He'd have to hire talented people which generally avoid the public sector because of all the red tape preventing making this happen
daveto
Active Member
The biggest problem in Toronto's structural budget deficit is the police force. It has gone from 10.6% of the gross budget in 2004 to 13.8% in 2010. (at $950m). A return to the 10.6% would eliminate more than 50% of our current $400m annual shortfall.
I'm always astonished that this doesn't get more media and political play.
Some people will credit the Toronto police with some sort of war on crime over the past 10 years which merits these pay raises (they were at only 9.6% of the gross budget in 1999). But crime had decreased in most jurisdictions in North America over the past 10 years, and most police forces are making the same they were 10 years ago.
Simply put, our police force is the most bloated part of our municipal public service.
I'm always astonished that this doesn't get more media and political play.
Some people will credit the Toronto police with some sort of war on crime over the past 10 years which merits these pay raises (they were at only 9.6% of the gross budget in 1999). But crime had decreased in most jurisdictions in North America over the past 10 years, and most police forces are making the same they were 10 years ago.
Simply put, our police force is the most bloated part of our municipal public service.
EXgeMMy
Active Member
Ford plans on hiring 100 new police officers.
I think we're getting off topic here.
I think we're getting off topic here.
klb86
Active Member
note to self....Don't bring up Ford on this forum...the liberals come out from the wood work from all over.
Sorry for bringing up his name lol.
Back to bubble talk please
Sorry for bringing up his name lol.
Back to bubble talk please
urbandreamer
recession proof
What bubble? Tableaux is practically sold out, Studio is selling well, and you can buy a condo in Mimico and get $2000 in free upgrades.
I'm so thrilled!
Why not throw in a lifetime supply of Tim Hortons coffee and donuts?
I'm so thrilled!
Why not throw in a lifetime supply of Tim Hortons coffee and donuts?
interested
Senior Member
UD, if you are being serious, then maybe you are right. I don't know. I am not too sure these days with some of your posts. The trouble with bubbles is they are not usually apparent until they burst. Have you ever blown up a balloon that was on the verge of bursting and yet you keep putting a bit more air and get away with it until finally......poof. And notice how fast it deflates.
Investor sentiment can change on a dime as you are aware. I remember in 1989 February, the real estate market just stopped. It did the same thing in 2008 Sept. Almost overnight and on a dime. Please understand. I have always said and still maintain that it will correct but I believe by about 15%. I am not calling for a big burst and I don't believe we will follow the US model. However, just because people keep buying and bidding up prices, doesn't mean that they may not be catching the tail end of the wave.
Or maybe they will be proven right and it will just go up further. Personally, I stand to benefit more from the latter scenario. I just don't think that is what will play out.
urbandreamer
recession proof
^Seriously?
OTOH, developers are lowering prices and giving out more freebies. What does that tell you?
It tells me that @$1.88 per bag, apples at No Frills are selling faster than the $3.99 per bag apples (same product) at Metro.
OTOH, developers are lowering prices and giving out more freebies. What does that tell you?
It tells me that @$1.88 per bag, apples at No Frills are selling faster than the $3.99 per bag apples (same product) at Metro.
interested
Senior Member
Sorry UD.
I am just not following. Maybe it is late and past my bedtime.
What does OTOH mean?
I assume if you are saying developers are lowering prices and seriously believe it, I guess the comment about Tableau and Studio selling well was not true.
I can tell you one thing and I am in the camp believing prices will drop: Shangrila this week increased prices 8% on average.
Maybe we are seeing differences in various price ranges or alternatively we are seeing schisms forming within the markets with some selling well and others not?
I am just not following. Maybe it is late and past my bedtime.
What does OTOH mean?
I assume if you are saying developers are lowering prices and seriously believe it, I guess the comment about Tableau and Studio selling well was not true.
I can tell you one thing and I am in the camp believing prices will drop: Shangrila this week increased prices 8% on average.
Maybe we are seeing differences in various price ranges or alternatively we are seeing schisms forming within the markets with some selling well and others not?
hodgkinsken
Active Member
OTOH = On the other hand
daveto
Active Member
Or maybe UD's average of 7 posts daily for the past three years demonstrates that most of what he writes is just babble.
simuls
Senior Member
Edge condos on Queen West is selling at $450/ft and I've been getting a lot of email lately from developers with incentives. I try to keep all my original price sheets, so I'll see if I can't post something on the differences.