kEiThZ
Superstar
Weird to have express service and 30 min frequencies. The trains would have to pass each other. All to save 30-40 mins? Doesn't make sense.
But we're a decade out from seeing a real schedule so whatever.
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Alto - High Speed Rail (Toronto-Quebec City)
- Thread starter innsertnamehere
- Start date
Weird to have express service and 30 min frequencies. The trains would have to pass each other. All to save 30-40 mins? Doesn't make sense.
But we're a decade out from seeing a real schedule so whatever.
chrisw
Active Member
Who's to say the express service will be able to save more than 30 mins?
legoswmonkey
New Member
With total control over the design of (most of) the trackage I think it's reasonable to expect some third passing tracks especially near Peterborough and Trois-Rivieres stations.
crs1026
Superstar
In the context of Alto, I don't read "express" to mean "non-stop", any more than I would consider a conventional VIA corridor train that adds a stop at only Belleville to be a "local" train. Lots of creative ways to schedule such that speed and separation are maintained and midpoints get some service. Too early to say much, I suspect that even the Alto team is only speaking in broad terms just yet.
- Paul
- Paul
ComptoirGeneral
Active Member
Not really? Out of the 46 Porter departures from YTZ tomorrow morning, 17 of them are to YUL, YOW, or YQB, equalling about 36%. While that number sounds significant, there is also every reason to believe that Porter and AC will increase the number of transborder flights now that US pre-clearance is mere weeks from opening.
Not to mention all of the smaller communities that rely on YTZ for flights in and out, many of which are not serviced by AC or YYZ.
I can definitely see a future where someone travelling from communities like YAM or YQT will fly AC to YTZ then connect to ALTO onwards.
micheal_can
Senior Member
Both of those airports have flights to Pearson. How easy is it to get from the Island to Union vs YYZ to Union? And YQT also flies to Ottawa direct.
chrisw
Active Member
There's a free shuttle to union, while the UP costs $9.25.
McGillicuddy
New Member
Is it not slightly premature to be guessing about the last-mile and transfer arrangements that traveller might be making on an as-yet-unplanned service 40 years from now?
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kEiThZ
Superstar
Every single destination that YTZ serves in the US can or is currently being served from YYZ. Accommodating the passengers moved by 78 seat Q400s is easy. Make those YYZ flights on larger aircraft. 321s instead of 320s. Some of the touristy destinations can go back to widebody service.
This probably won't help air fares to those destinations. But it absolutely helps the city develop the waterfront. And that's a decent tradeoff that wasn't worthwhile before HSR put a lid on airfare to Ottawa and Montreal.
And in the future? The can get on Alto at the Pearson Airport station.
ear2ear
New Member
Anecdotal, but as a downtown/east end resident and frequent flyer, I'll still take the UP-YYZ over flying out of YTZ any day (but admittedly the YTZ routes rarely serve my needs).
roger1818
Senior Member
I agree. While as others pointed out, the flights to destinations other than YOW and YUL could be moved to YYZ, there would still be demand for flights out of YTZ, as not much really changes with the creation of Alto for those other destinations, and the benefits of having using a smaller airport and arriving downtown still exist. If anything, the existence of Alto could be an opportunity for Porter to add more flights to other destinations from YTZ and focus even more on O-D travel (and use YYZ for those who want to connect).
I excluded YCB as only 1 of those flights is to it, which isn't surprising as there really is little reason for people in Quebec to want to visit Toronto. Besides, with an estimated travel time on Alto of 4.5 hours, flying would likely still be competitive. Flying might even be competitive on price to YCB, as Alto would rather fill the seat with 2 (or maybe 3) bums, so wouldn't want to give much of a discount for end-to-end travel compared to the sum of the legs.
roger1818
Senior Member
Someone over on SSP suggested that Alto Open Houses could be a clue as to the planned route, so I decided to draw a Google My Map of the Open House locations and then connect the dots. This obviously isn't the exact routes as many of the open houses will be in the closest town, where they could find a meeting place, and I don't think there will necessarily be a station near every open house, but it does make for an interesting map.
generalcanada
Senior Member
wait yea why are they doing "open houses" on the entire corridor. thought they were just doing the ott-mtl corridor.
kEiThZ
Superstar
When a third of passengers are Ottawa and Montreal, it's debatable how many of those other flights could be profitable without transfer passengers.
And those flights are all on 78 seater Q400s anyway. So it's not like a ton of passengers that can't be accommodated simply by up gauging out of Pearson to those same destinations or swapping some YOW and YUL slots out of YYZ for new destinations. Lots of options in a post HSR world.
But also the airport exists to benefit the city. Not the other way around. And it's really debatable whether the best value of that land is an airport in an era when we have HSR and much better connectivity to Pearson itself in the GTA.
roger1818
Senior Member
They are building the whole thing, but are starting construction of Ottawa-Montreal leg first. I gather the next leg will start 2 years later (well before they finish the first leg).