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Adam Vaughan's Stealth Mission Against Island Airport (truth about sidewalks)

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^That's probably the only issue with the Transitway: the scheduling. It's tough to serve the airport in Ottawa because there are big fluctuations in terms of how busy it is. Beyond that, as far as bus service goes, it is quite convenient as it takes you right downtown.

The Oh-Train: oi!
 
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I don't see what the opposition to the City Centre Airport is >: . They don't want airplanes down there? They're there! They don't don't noise pollution? Why the **** live next to multi-lane rail and highway system running 24/7 then!?! They don't want pollution period? Yeah good luck with that :rolleyes ! They don't want a surface link? Bathurst's literally 100m if even from the airport! They don't want to affect the Islanders? Hello, the Islanders live clearly on the other side!

See, all dumb reasons to stall the inevitable. Heck why not run the 511 down there if you don't want cars on the Islands but seriously, stop acting like foolish econuts :evil .
 
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I don't see what the opposition to the City Centre Airport is

For me it is quite obvious. The City of Toronto and Federal Government hand a pretty substantial portion of your property/income taxes over to it to keep it running either through direct payments or by not charging for taxes that are normally collected from government agencies.

It is pretty much the only medium to large government subsidized airport in Canada. The vast majority of the others break even or receive help from a nearby international airport.

As a commercial venture, it is (and always has been) a failure. As the venture of a for-profit government crown corporation, it is a failure.

Keep the flight school and roll it into GTAA if you want but the Port Authority has no business running an airport.
 
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As a commercial venture, it is (and always has been) a failure. As the venture of a for-profit government crown corporation, it is a failure.

:rollin ! How can it be successful when it doesn't have a direct link to the city? A Bathurst St. bridge, even one exclusively for LRT vehicles only would vastly improve connectivity hence revenues. While Pearson would remain the main commercial airport, this one would be heavily used by private corporate jets, so in the end less traffic does equal >success financially.
 
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Do you really think by just saving 5 mins without having to take a ferry would really add that many people???

The problem with the airport is not how it is run at the moment. People just know there are ideas of growing the airport eventually bringing in jets. Once you start the ball rolling, who is there to stop it?
 
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This isn't about what can be done to make the airport successful. I mean, if you built a Pearson right next to downtown, it would be successful, but at what cost to the city? The point here is whether the social/environmental/aesthetic cost to the city justifies the commercial and logistic benefits of having an airport by the waterfront.
 
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How can it be successful when it doesn't have a direct link to the city?

If a direct link was a requirement then it should have been done in the 1983 agreements were put into place.

It's been over 20 years since the airports modern capabilities were defined and it still does not benefit the city. Time to take the land and turn it into something useful. Heck, a cluster of wind mills with parkland below may well be both profitable and useful.
 
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I don't see what the opposition to the City Centre Airport is.

People don't like the smell of jet fuel you get anywhere near a major airport. They don't want the noise. Toronto Island is an escape from the hustle and bustle of the city. Walking around the island it is hard to believe you are in the city.

They don't don't noise pollution? Why the **** live next to multi-lane rail and highway system running 24/7 then!?!

If you get a condo on Queens Quay facing the water, especially in one of those terraced units, you don't hear the noise of the freeway at all.

They don't want pollution period? Yeah good luck with that :rolleyes !

I will give you that it is one of the more absurd arguments since it logically makes no sense that driving further to an airport in the suburbs would somehow result in less pollution unless the aircraft at Pearson are much more efficient and can make up the efficiency difference of travelling to the airport which I don't believe is the case.

They don't want to affect the Islanders? Hello, the Islanders live clearly on the other side!

Airplanes pass over close to those areas.

stop acting like foolish econuts

There is nothing Eco about it. A plane flying from Pearson is no different than a plane flying from the Harbourfront. The argument is whether it makes sense to have an airport where you are spending money for harbourfront outdoor cafes, an urban beach, continuous waterfront bike paths, etc. People turning into the airport are going to conflict with all the cyclists, rollerbladers, and joggers that travel along the waterfront trail. There are loads of cyclists riding down Queens Quay in the summer and that will only increase as more of the waterfront projects are completed. Large sections of the harbour are blocked from use due to the risk of tall masts interfering with approaching aircraft. In the summer they block use of flights to the north due to boats going through the channel. Would the bridge to the airport constantly open and close to allow passing ships or force them to go another direction? After spending a load of money building a lift bridge or tunnel to a small airport which will never be able to handle much traffic because there is no room for expansion and interfering with waterfront recreation the question becomes why? Why not spend that same money on building the rail link from Union to Pearson where there are far more flights?
 
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Ah, I can see socialwoe sounding off against those anti-Spadina Expressway flibbertygibbets back around 1970...
 
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The problem with the airport is not how it is run at the moment. People just know there are ideas of growing the airport eventually bringing in jets. Once you start the ball rolling, who is there to stop it?

What to do with the Island Airport then? From a transit perspective I thought revitalization of the airport could be a selling point for the DRL. A stop at Bathurst/Front (Fort York) linked to an automated tube shuttle running every 5 mins round trip could vastly improve density around the Bathurst/Queens Quay area and improve infrastructure on the islands. More importantly the dependence on $6 ferry rides from QQFD would deminish as tourists could now have direct access.

The point here is whether the social/environmental/aesthetic cost to the city justifies the commercial and logistic benefits of having an airport by the waterfront.

I think building the bridge helps all those entities. Social- better accessibilty to/from Toronto Islands. Environmentally- less greenhouse emissions from ferry boats, good for health to joke over to the Islands instead. Aesthetically- revitalizes the run-down Bathurst waterfront and Island Airport.

In the summer they block use of flights to the north due to boats going through the channel. Would the bridge to the airport constantly open and close to allow passing ships or force them to go another direction?

The link doesn't have to be a bridge necessarily, certainly not one for vehicular traffic. A suspension bridge for pedestrians a la the foot of Ronchesvalles could work in connecting the island to Torontonians for free. Had the DRL been built an underwater tube could deliver passengers without affecting boat travel above.

Ah, I can see socialwoe sounding off against those anti-Spadina Expressway flibbertygibbets back around 1970...

I don't know about an expressway but I'd sure use a Spadina subway south of Bloor more frequently than I use the University line. My biases for the Skydome, Queen West, Chinatown, Kensington and U ot T are very strong apparently.
 
Globe: The truth about sidewalks (Bathurst St./Island Airport)

The truth about sidewalks

JOHN BARBER

Only a genius of the stature of Charles Dickens could have done justice to the extraordinary meeting senior city officials convened Monday to speak the truth about sidewalks, as they monolithically conceived it, to recalcitrant Councillor Adam Vaughan. So I'm glad I wasn't invited, unlike the surprise "legal adviser" Mr. Vaughan sprang on the unwitting 'crats - in itself a comic moment of irresistible appeal to those who can imagine such minds at work and see it through their pallid masks.

So, a simple roll call will have to do: In order to dissuade the councillor from building a $160,000 sidewalk along the west side of Bathurst Street south of Queen's Quay West, the bureaucracy assembled six of its heaviest hitters with a combined annual salary of more than $950,000. It was a command performance, they being the commanders, its purpose to "brief" Mr. Vaughan on their strenuous objections to his preferred design for the block-long strip of concrete.

Finding him armed with a legal adviser and ready answers for every objection, they next sounded the alarm at community council, in the form of a sternly worded report recommending against the rookie's folly. One can only imagine what they felt when Mr. Vaughan's colleagues brushed them off without a word of debate or a single query, voting unanimously to endorse his latest offensive against the noisome island airport.

The bureaucrats' plan for the sidewalk, drawn up by the Toronto Port Authority, the airport operator, is designed to ensure the safety of vehicles getting to and from the airport ferry. Mr. Vaughan's plan, which the bureaucrats are now required to build, is designed to ensure the safety of local pedestrians at the direct expense of vehicles getting to and from the ferry.

Given the paltry flow of traffic down there, the Vaughan plan will do little to disrupt airport operations. The grandiose queuing lanes it eliminates, to be replaced with parking stalls beside the sidewalk, have never once served the function for which they were intended - way back when some people thought Porter Airlines was a smart bet. The real victory is internal: a timely whack upside the heads of senior bureaucrats who, left to their own devices, would continue to serve the interests of an institution that local politicians, driven by actual constituents, are determined to suppress.

The message is simple, according to Mr. Vaughan: "If you're going to fight an airport, fight it." If the facility is unsafe, let the port authority, not the city, fix it. "They've got ample land to make it safe."

The port authoritarians could sue, according to the bureaucrats. "Let them," Mr. Vaughan replies. They could build a new road on an easement straight through Little Norway Park. "Let them," he repeats, salivating at the prospect.

"It's time to stand up to them for a change," Mr. Vaughan says, "and we're going to."

The first round, which took place yesterday when community council voted for the new sidewalk, was "the most fun I've had at city hall since being elected," according to fellow rookie Gord Perks.

Others are less zealous, if only because the airport appears to be dying of its own accord, unaffected by anything the city may or may not do to help or hinder it.

Many industry observers, including one respected analyst on the record and others off, are predicting the imminent death of Porter Airlines as promoter Robert Deluce continues to paper the town with free tickets to Ottawa - and offers new flights to Northern Ontario in favour of the promised U.S. destinations.

When that happens, there will be a whole lot more fresh concrete to rip up along the waterfront.
 
Porter can't operate to the US because Air Canada, Continental and US Airways have objected to their application.
 
LaGuardia wouldn't work because there is no U.S. customs there....without U.S. pre-clearance at YTZ, they could only serve Newark (or JFK)..
 

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