Streety McCarface
Senior Member
Yet he almost did while running for mayor last election and bidding for mayor this year.
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2018 Provincial Election Transit Promises
- Thread starter innsertnamehere
- Start date
Yet he almost did while running for mayor last election and bidding for mayor this year.
Rainforest
Senior Member
No powerful challenger emerged to date. At the municipal level, an incumbent usually has a big advantage.
Whether Tory will have enough ammunition to wrestle with Ford the premier, and push the latter towards funding the city's goals, is another matter. Unless the actual voting results differ dramatically from the current polls, PCs are heading towards a clear majority, and will be able to basically ignore any municipal opposition for much of the next 4 years.
It remains to be seen whether the Ford's persona is enough of a game changer to reverse the polls. Sometimes, the voters just want a change, and are willing to elect a mascot as long is it comes from the opposition party.
hw621
Senior Member
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
This is basically a repeat of what we saw in the last election. The PCs reached their peak support numbers, but then they started scaring the crap out of everybody, and now support looks to be coalescing around the Liberals to keep the PCs out of power. What makes this interesting is that this has happened well before the start of the campaign, rather than midway through it.
Assuming this poll is correct, the Liberals have a clear path to victory. 33% of respondents say they support the NDP or Green, but a significant portion of them will ultimately vote Liberal to deny the PCs a victory. The Liberals are only 7 percentage points behind the PCs, so NDP/Green supporters switching support to Liberal will likely be enough for them to win. Further, just 3.5% of voters switching support from PC to Liberal would put the Liberals in the lead. Considering that the campaign hasn't even begun yet (so a lot of people likely are not paying attention), the Liberals should have a fairly easy job flipping a large enough number of voters from PC to Liberal.
The Liberals need to focus on not doing any dumb shit between now and election day (she can't have a repeat of her "old white people" comment). If I were Wynne, I wouldn't even bother personally attacking Ford on his more unsavoury traits. Directly attacking Ford puts her at risk of energizing Ford Nation. Rather, she should focus on Ford's policy deficiencies. Ford's own words and actions are doing more than enough to bring his character in question for most voters.
The PCs, meanwhile, need to focus on not scaring NDP, Green and moderate PC supporters into supporting the Liberals to deny the PCs a victory. The cat might be out of the bag on that one though. It's one thing if people are fleeing from your party because of a simple policy disagreement that can be walked back. It's a completely different thing when they're fleeing because of the fundamental character of the leader.
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Adjei
Senior Member
Good news. As long as they don't have a majority they can do less damage.
syn
Senior Member
That's how she won last time, if I recall. Stayed on message (a positive one) and won.
I'm sure there's quite a bit of nonsense to come from Ford and the PCs - perhaps some homophobic comments?
steveintoronto
Superstar
He's peaked. He has nowhere to go but down, and his mouth guarantees that. Now he's won the 'talent contest', everyone's expecting him to dance. He can't even trip with style, let alone get rhythm.
hw621
Senior Member
Ontarians do not have faith in any of the parties or their leaders. We might just get a minority government to test things out.
nfitz
Superstar
Either the NDP or the Liberals would have to play along to allow the PCs to form a minority government. To do so, would be political suicide. Liberal supporters wouldn't kill their party if they supported an NDP minority. And NDP supporters wouldn't kill their party if they supported a Liberal minority.
It's hard to see how Wynne doesn't form at least a minority government out of this election.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
If neither wouldn’t kill their party for cooperating with the other, what’s the problem?
In fact, what’s the point of the two above sentences at all?
crs1026
Superstar
^I'm not calling this one on the basis of this week's polls. Pollsters all said Hillary Clinton would win, right up to the day of the election. And then.....
I do agree that neither the Liberals nor the NDP would be willing to form a minority government with the PC's, so either the PC's take a majority or we have a minority Liberal-NDP government.
Nobody votes for minority government. It happens when people vote for their party, and there is so little consensus that no party wins a majority. Minority governments work well in theory but don't last long and don't produce much in practice. Hoping for a minority government is like hoping that there is room in the lifeboats when the ship hits an iceberg. It's a good what-if discussion, but not an outcome to hope for. Nor is it one to work towards.
Wynne does not deserve to win this election on the basis of performance and platform. Doug does not deserve to win this election on the basis of past behaviour and lack of tangible platform. That leaves us voters in a very tight spot. The Liberals have declared a platform that has obvious flaws (ie fiscal recklessness, and for some, too much tax-and-spend nanny state paternalism). The PC's haven't declared a platform, but just sound angry.
I predict that Doug will cling to angry and say next to nothing of substance. Some will like that, some won't. Wynne has said all she needs to say, and will keep saying it. Some will like that, some won't. I expect that election day will arrive with things not much clearer than they are today. The outcome will be what it is, but all the pollster technology in the world won't help predict it.
- Paul
I do agree that neither the Liberals nor the NDP would be willing to form a minority government with the PC's, so either the PC's take a majority or we have a minority Liberal-NDP government.
Nobody votes for minority government. It happens when people vote for their party, and there is so little consensus that no party wins a majority. Minority governments work well in theory but don't last long and don't produce much in practice. Hoping for a minority government is like hoping that there is room in the lifeboats when the ship hits an iceberg. It's a good what-if discussion, but not an outcome to hope for. Nor is it one to work towards.
Wynne does not deserve to win this election on the basis of performance and platform. Doug does not deserve to win this election on the basis of past behaviour and lack of tangible platform. That leaves us voters in a very tight spot. The Liberals have declared a platform that has obvious flaws (ie fiscal recklessness, and for some, too much tax-and-spend nanny state paternalism). The PC's haven't declared a platform, but just sound angry.
I predict that Doug will cling to angry and say next to nothing of substance. Some will like that, some won't. Wynne has said all she needs to say, and will keep saying it. Some will like that, some won't. I expect that election day will arrive with things not much clearer than they are today. The outcome will be what it is, but all the pollster technology in the world won't help predict it.
- Paul
Rainforest
Senior Member
Technically, neither party needs to form a coalition with PCs in order to let them form a minority government. They can just abstain during the budget vote, and any other matter-of-confidence vote. That happened many times before, and allowed the party that won plurality but not majority to govern for some time.
Typically, such governments do not last for the full 4 years; an early election happens 2 or 3 years into the cycle.
syn
Senior Member
In this situation, Doug is Ontario's Hillary.
Hopkins123
Senior Member
The arrogance and self-righteousness of Liberal supporters will be their own downfall.
ssiguy2
Senior Member
^ Of course it will but the question is not if but when. The Tories have shot themselves in the foot again and in the last 10 years seem to be doing everything in their power to NOT get elected. Running for councillor in a little riding and running for Premier are too very different things. Ford's "ah, shucks" conservatism may play well at the local McDonald's in Etobicoke but won't help him in a debate where he has to answer real questions and isn't in control of the media. He will have to have to provide real, clear, and well articulated answers to a residence of every part of the province from different ages, races, incomes, geographies, etc unlike his monolithic little riding in Etobicoke.
Specifically on the transit file he is going to have to provide policies and fundings that go beyond "subways, subway's subways". He has already landed in hot water on the issue. He has stated he wants underground transit for Toronto but then what of RER, will he then tell those needed 416 & 905 voters that RER is off because it's not underground? How is he going to pay for all this underground transit and how will he reconcile it with him wanting to get rid of government waste? What other services is he willing to cut to build underground?. Why will LRT be OK for Hamilton but not for Miss/Brampton? Will he kick in more money so London can get the downtown tunnel or conversely pull funds from it's BRT because in his view buses are worse than LRTs? Will Ottawa get it's West LRT also underground?
Talking in simple platitudes at the suburban home-town Timmy's is one thing, explaining coherent policies to 14 million Ontarians in a televised debate is quite another.
Specifically on the transit file he is going to have to provide policies and fundings that go beyond "subways, subway's subways". He has already landed in hot water on the issue. He has stated he wants underground transit for Toronto but then what of RER, will he then tell those needed 416 & 905 voters that RER is off because it's not underground? How is he going to pay for all this underground transit and how will he reconcile it with him wanting to get rid of government waste? What other services is he willing to cut to build underground?. Why will LRT be OK for Hamilton but not for Miss/Brampton? Will he kick in more money so London can get the downtown tunnel or conversely pull funds from it's BRT because in his view buses are worse than LRTs? Will Ottawa get it's West LRT also underground?
Talking in simple platitudes at the suburban home-town Timmy's is one thing, explaining coherent policies to 14 million Ontarians in a televised debate is quite another.