Toronto Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport | ?m | ?s | Ports Toronto | Arup

If anyone tries to bulldoze down the island airport, I'll be sitting there in my rocking chair with shotgun in hand. Long live Porter! :D
 
There is an interview with CEO Deleuce on the reportonbusiness site. It is quite good.

They'll be operating 12 planes in 1 year and 20 in 18 months. Next destination to be announced in the next couple of weeks.
 
Bigchew said:
There is an interview with CEO Deleuce on the reportonbusiness site. It is quite good.

They'll be operating 12 planes in 1 year and 20 in 18 months. Next destination to be announced in the next couple of weeks.
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I hope it is Chicago....that would be great to be able to leave the office and be in Chicago a couple of hours later. Maybe they could run "alternative waterfront visions" junkets!
 
I happened to come across the airport noise complaint forms that were filled out by waterfront residents for the month of July. The complaints are absolutely ridiculous for the most part. People who live right next to the airport complain about basic airport noise! As people on this board would say, don't move beside an airport if you don't like airport noise! I mean they make a choice to live beside an airport and then they expect that the airport should be shut down now because they have decided that they don't like the noise. Anyhow, when I get a better feel for how many of these residents think, I can completely understand the views of the pro-Porter people.

How about these two recent complaints I've heard from people living on the harbourfront:

1) "I don't like it when the boats sound their horn as they are departing." I actually know of one case where a resident actually complained about it. Boats have do this for safety reasons.

2) "I don't like the look of the boats that are parked in the harbour." This is my favourite one!

With crazy complaints like this, again, I am leaning towards agreeing with the pro-Porter folks.
 
Bigchew said:
I happened to come across the airport noise complaint forms that were filled out by waterfront residents for the month of July. The complaints are absolutely ridiculous for the most part. People who live right next to the airport complain about basic airport noise! As people on this board would say, don't move beside an airport if you don't like airport noise! I mean they make a choice to live beside an airport and then they expect that the airport should be shut down now because they have decided that they don't like the noise. Anyhow, when I get a better feel for how many of these residents think, I can completely understand the views of the pro-Porter people.

How about these two recent complaints I've heard from people living on the harbourfront:

1) "I don't like it when the boats sound their horn as they are departing." I actually know of one case where a resident actually complained about it. Boats have do this for safety reasons.

2) "I don't like the look of the boats that are parked in the harbour." This is my favourite one!

With crazy complaints like this, again, I am leaning towards agreeing with the pro-Porter folks.
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Anybody who has airside interaction with the island airport will also have some really good stories....ie residents who complain about noise on landing approaches (engine at idle) but don't call in on the departure routes (engine at 100%).....that's how you know they don't really care about the noise....
 
I guess since we've been telling passengers this, there's no reason why I can't confirm with you guys that chicago Midway is the next destination. Should start by November or so. Boston looks to be after that in early 09 and then it all depends on when Porter gets planes. The crazy thing is there's barely space for the people/planes now, so you're going to see a huge amount of infrastructure built in the next 2 or 3 years on the island (Shovels were supposed to go in the ground a while ago actually).

As for noise complaints, we don't get (m)any other than what has been filed with the port authority. I actually find that the small single engine planes that land and take off from the water to be the loudest (I live on the water at QQ and Spadina) and I rarely hear a Porter plane. On start-up they're loud, I don't deny this, and I get to hear them from 5 feet away when they push back from the gate. Unfortunately, planes have to start up in order to take off. Also, Porter does care, and actually over the last week I've seen the maintenance folk take a couple planes that they were doing engine tests on out to the furthest point away on the airport from any residential.
 
Some good discussion in the past few days. I've been saying for years that TCCA can coexist for years now. If you search waaaay back in the UT archives you'll find me being a pariah, battling the rest of the forum. Things have certainly changed.

The aircraft noise is worse in Georgetown, ON than it is on a boat on Toronto Harbour.

I'd like to see some changes to help minimize the issues that people have with the airport. This is my plan. With such a move, you could pass a regulation restricting the use of other approaches that take planes closer to populated areas.

jn_12 said:
I guess since we've been telling passengers this, there's no reason why I can't confirm with you guys that chicago Midway is the next destination. Should start by November or so. Boston looks to be after that in early 09 and then it all depends on when Porter gets planes.
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But Midway doesn't have customs and immigration facilities. How do that plan to deal with this? How long until TCCA requests a US customs preclearance facility?
 
Not sure to be honest. I'm just a lowly customer service rep, so I really have no clue how the logistics will work.

Pre-clearance for the states won't happen until the new terminal is built. I think they have to wait until they have enough traffic to warrant setting up shop.
 
Toronto to Boston Logan? (BOS)

I would be ecstatic if this happens.

Logan hopes to land Canadian carrier

Logan International Airport officials hope that Porter Airlines will start nonstop flights to Toronto City Centre Airport next spring, giving travelers quicker access to the Canadian city’s downtown.

Toronto is the third largest international market for Logan after London and Paris, with some 325 passengers flying the route daily from the Boston airport. But current flights via Air Canada and American Eagle land at Toronto Pearson International Airport in Mississauga, Canada’s busiest airport, located about 17 miles from downtown Toronto.
 
CDL.TO said:
Thanks.

Currently Midway's only international destination is Cancun, which I mistakenly thought had border preclearance. Using Midway rather than O'Hare should further increase the attractiveness of Porter.
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Your welcome.

What is amazing is that there is no preclearance in Mexico. See http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/toolbox/contacts/preclear_locations.xml. Lots in Canada and a couple in the Caribbean, and two in Ireland. I didn't realize that Americans went to Ireland so much. You would think that there would be some in Europe (London, Paris, Frankfurt).

GD
 
From this month's ROB Magazine:
http://www.reportonbusiness.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080825.rmwells/BNStory/specialROBmagazine/home

Porterize me
Not many expected Bob Deluce's airline to last, let alone thrive. Eat your heart out, Air Canada

August 28, 2008 at 5:11 PM EDT

"Let's just pop in here for a moment," says Bob Deluce, as if he were issuing an invitation to stop at some boîte for a beer or a bite to eat.

"Here," in Deluce's world, is the cabin of a Q400 turboprop. In a matter of days, Deluce will exercise an option to purchase two more of Bombardier's $26-million Qs, which will take the fleet of his company, Porter Airlines Inc., to 14. In a matter of weeks, just as summer draws to a close, he will announce the latest Porter destination: Chicago. "A downtown-to-downtown total value proposition," Deluce says of the flights from Toronto's City Centre Airport that will take off this autumn to Chicago's Midway Airport. "Fifteen minutes to the financial district." Or a steak at Gibsons.

We settle in to the cabin's soft grey leather seats. "Generous legroom," says the captain of the company, though he points out that extended legroom isn't of enormous concern for a man of his bantam build. "But if the seat moves, I'm not wearing the food."

Nice.

Back in Porter's departure lounge—sleekly minimalist in Porter's signature palette of muted taupes and greys—Britain's consul general, Nicholas Armour, is waiting to board a flight to Ottawa. "If you want to, say that one, two, three, four...10 of us are travelling up from the British consulate today," he says as Deluce does a handshake flypast through Porter's entire operation. "Don't tell David Miller."

It's a joke, of course. Toronto's mayor fought hard to keep Porter and its cheeky raccoon mascot, Mr. Porter, out of the Toronto island airport. Miller feared excessive noise and waterfront ruination. It was a valiant fight. He lost. The raccoon won, as raccoons tend to do in Toronto.
So Bob Deluce won the battle. But what about the war, as in, the maelstrom in the airline industry?

Here's a number: In early June, the International Air Transport Association predicted a punishing $6.1-billion (U.S.) loss this year for the global airline industry. A month later, the IATA forewarned that its projection was very likely low. "I've heard numbers right up to $10 billion," says Deluce of the effects of through-the-roof fuel costs and financially strapped consumers that have led to grounded aircraft and massive layoffs.

In this environment, Porter may be sitting pretty—we can't know precisely. Porter is a private company. Deluce says he hasn't yet burned through the initial $125.7 million in start-up capital provided by four private investors: EdgeStone Capital Partners, Borealis Infrastructure, GE Asset Management and Dancap Private Equity Inc. "I can tell you that last June"—he means June, 2007—"was the first profitable month for Porter," Deluce says of the 8% net income margin the company recorded. "I can tell you that in June, 2008, we've done appreciably better than June, 2007."

Liquidity for the investors? Deluce says he's under no pressure to deliver any such thing, which must be a relief, given that the prospective IPO market for airlines is, um, non-existent.

On the surface at least, Deluce appears to possess a surfeit of patience. His manner is low-key, and he sounds a little like Jimmy Stewart in a vowel-swallowing, down-home kind of way. But there's nothing aw-shucks about the man in the pinstriped suit who has drawn such private investors as Bay Street money manager Ira Gluskin and who has fought innumerable legal battles with Air Canada over his island-airport operations. The launch of Porter two years ago was executed with precision. There was the marketing campaign, with Mr. Porter imbuing the airline with a wily personality from the get-go; there were the delightfully retro attendants' uniforms designed by Pink Tartan. There's complimentary wine, complimentary beer, an in-flight magazine, re: porter, that is distinctively chic; and a newly launched frequent-flier program, VIPorter. The Porter sensibility is so ingrained, so effectively branded—everything is "Porterized" around the offices—that just the other day, one passenger was heard remarking to another, "Well, why don't you Porter it?"

"We took that as something positive," says Deluce. "The fact that they were making a verb out of Porter was probably good."

More substantively, Deluce made the right call on his regional fleet, having been one of the first in the industry to go big on the Q400, placing an initial order for 10 planes, with an option to purchase 10 more. The Q400 has suddenly proved to be the darling of the industry. Two years ago, Deluce was talking up the fast-climb capability of the 70-seat aircraft, emphasizing its nimbleness on the island airport's shorter airstrips. Then there was the "Q" factor—"Q" for quiet. ("Have you noticed any taking off?" asks Deluce, seated now in his office by the runway. "We're sitting about as close as anyone could to the runway out here.")

These days, fuel efficiency is the buzzword. The Q400 is generally acknowledged to burn some 30% to 40% less fuel than other short-haul aircraft. "The way to profits these days is via Q400 turboProfits," is Bombardier's rallying cry. This summer, Horizon Air of Seattle became the latest airline to announce a fast-track phase-out of its older turboprops in favour of the more fuel-efficient Q400s. Bombardier has been marketing the aircraft as the greener way to fly, something that Porter itself would be wise to capitalize upon. Mr. Porter in a green pillbox hat! How cute!

In his initial plan, Bob Deluce envisioned 17 destinations. Porter is up to seven: Halifax, Montreal, Newark, Ottawa, Quebec City, Toronto and now Chicago. (The airline also offered a ski run to Mont-Tremblant this past winter.) Frequent travellers, like the British consul general, are pleased thus far. "It has to be said that travelling on an intimate airline, as it were, without any fuss and bother, is very agreeable," says Armour. And that little business of having to take a 60-second ferry ride to the island airport: not a bother? "Oooh no," he says. "It's an added excitement."
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I'd still rather have a bridge, to each his own I guess.
 
The buzz around work the past two days was the Zoom closure. The first reason was the amazing interline agreement we had with them (we could fly on zoom for 100 bucks each way). The second being questions of how stable the airline industry is and how Porter stands to make a profit while buying new planes and building stages 2 and 3 of the terminal. Even though the planes are filling up well, its quite a bit of rapid growth and expansion and its hard (for me) not to be skeptical. At work most people feel like Porter is invincible. Any talk about the instability of the industry is followed by things like "oh but we're more fuel efficient!" as though that's the solution to the entire problem. There's obviously some other behind the scenes stuff going on and that's been well documented by the people who don't want Porter/TCCA there. Is that enough though to make this entirely worth it?

I'm leaving Porter sometime in the near future because I'll be focusing on my Masters degree in urban planning. Things at Zoom appeared pretty peachy to the staff for quite awhile, and this summer they added Rome and had a large marketing campaign, so of course everyone equates growth/market visibility with success. While regional carriers obviously differ, it makes me wonder what the future of Porter is? My concern is mostly for the friends I've made that have plans on staying and growing with the company. The growth is exciting but growing by 700% in a year is intense.

Considering Zoom and the plethora of other airlines that have gone under, what do you guys think?
 
jn_12 said:
Considering Zoom and the plethora of other airlines that have gone under, what do you guys think?
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I wouldn't worry too much. Long haul is an altogether different beast. There is no option to use to save fuel in anyway, other than buying newer and larger aircraft (767 to 777). So fuel costs can significantly impact operations. And you have a limited number of airfields that you can operate from (runway length, customs services, higher onboard service, longer turnarounds, crew day limitations, etc).

Porter has an extremely fuel efficient fleet. Whatever the impact of fuel prices on the aviation industry, it will be disproportionately lighter on Porter, and harsher on mainlines flying narrowbody jets and regional jets. Short haul allows for quick turn-arounds and relatively higher impact crew days....ie crews undertake 2-3 round trips a day instead of just 1 trip to the destination. There is also no need for higher onboard service....in-flight entertainment for example, add significant weight to the aircraft, and requires resources to program. Porter has just one magazine to keeps the folks entertained. And its quality lounge also cures boredom, making most customers forget about the lack of IFE.

Aside for the fuel cost issue, is the credit issue. Zoom's aircraft were ceased by weary bankers. Porter being privately financed has bought its aircraft outright. It doesn't have to worry about antsy bankers. If costs really do get that high, Porter will just defer aircraft deliveries or shut down unprofitable routes and ground those aircraft.

Porter's business case is sound. It is targeting niche markets that are poorly served by the mainlines. And it has kept its operating costs extremely low....(common fleet, new fuel efficient turboprops, single dedicated terminal, etc.). These are advantages that will only accentuate the difference between Porter and its mainline competitors in any downturn.
 
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