Toronto Rogers Centre Renovations | ?m | ?s | Toronto Blue Jays | Populous

T.E.C.II said:
Nobody is saying the Blue Jays can't draw fans. They obviously can. But they made the playoffs in 2015 and 2016, so naturally attendance would be high, particularly as it had been over 20 years since they had a playoff appearance, and that would have carried over into the 2017 season (in which they would have finished behind the Yankees in terms of AL attendance). In the years since (pre covid), attendance then dropped. While we're never the outright worst draw, on some nights, the attendance is noticeably sparse.

This is all besides the point, however. The issue is, the stadium is in serious need of upgrading to stay current. Some of these upgrades might be cost prohibitive. The general opinion seems to be from Rogers that the stadium upgrades are expensive to the point of almost being what they would spend on a new stadium.
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yeah and I'm not sure which part they're not getting about players not liking it either. Nor do people from other cities want to come here to see our stadium. Some will come here to watch their team play, but they don't come to say "I have to check out the Rogers Centre". People do say that about many other stadiums. They basically travel to check out the stadium, not just to see their team.
 
wopchop said:
Why not?
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Because as I said, the MLB has standards for their stadiums. The Rogers Centre is a cookie cutter 1980s stadium that was designed to be used for a variety of purposes including concerts, football and monster trucks.

Now that same stadium is outdated, the roof needs substantial upkeep, there is no ability to put real grass in without major work and the amenities are outdated. The sightlines are horrible at times, the outfield is massive and many players simply do not like playing at Rogers Centre.

There are very few stadiums built in the 1980s that still exist and for good reason. I can see MLB "suggesting" that a new stadium is needed.
 
sixrings said:
And what exactly happens if said suggestion is ignored?
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The MLB gives the team an ultimatum like they did in Oakland when the lease expired.

Honestly, the MLB has alot of sway when it comes to where the teams play. If the stadium is not up to standards as put forth by the league they can make life difficult for the team up to and including forced sales (that is what happened in Oakland).

There is a need for modern media facilities, player facilities, etc etc. The stadium may be able to last 100 years but the facilities therein do not.

Just because you have a stadium does not mean you can play there. There is a reason they had to upgrade Sahlen Field in Buffalo.
 
Richard White said:
The MLB gives the team an ultimatum like they did in Oakland when the lease expired.

Honestly, the MLB has alot of sway when it comes to where the teams play. If the stadium is not up to standards as put forth by the league they can make life difficult for the team up to and including forced sales (that is what happened in Oakland).

There is a need for modern media facilities, player facilities, etc etc. The stadium may be able to last 100 years but the facilities therein do not.

Just because you have a stadium does not mean you can play there. There is a reason they had to upgrade Sahlen Field in Buffalo.
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yeah I'm really not sure what they're not getting about this. Maybe they're not huge baseball fans....I'm not sure, and quite frankly, I'm not sure why they care if the stadium is being built on private money.
 
sixrings said:
And what exactly happens if said suggestion is ignored?
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Free agents would continue to refuse to sign in Toronto, star players previously under team control decide to opt out as they would prefer to play in ballparks with the latest amenities (not to mention real grass which makes zero sense to install at the dome from a feasibility standpoint), and in addition to being the only Canadian team (in a province where players are heavily taxed and a lot of players don't want to be in Canada), the Blue Jays organization understands that this is a business, and in order to be competitive, they have to catch up with the times - it worked when the dome first opened to the amazement of a lot of players, but that is in the rear view mirror.

The dome is a fine building on an engineering standpoint. Woo. Doesn't mean it works for baseball in 2021 (yet alone the mid 90s). Any retrofit would still require such significant investments that it makes more sense to start fresh. We know grass won't work because of drainage and lack of natural sunlight on non game days, and blowing out the outfield onto the street would be quite challenging when there's an 11,000 ton roof above it.

Basically it restricts the organization's potential from being competitive on the field.

I highly recommend the book "Ballpark - Baseball in the American City" by Paul Goldenberg. An excellent read on how ballparks were - parks in the midst of a city's urban fabric, with the ballparks' dimensions being a result of the land constraints they dealt with.
 
If we are to replace Rogers Centre, we could end up with a stadium just as soulless as the current one.

A lot of the newer MLB ball parks with retractable roofs don't exactly exude old-time baseball:

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Source

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Source
 
christiesplits said:
If we are to replace Rogers Centre, we could end up with a stadium just as soulless as the current one.

A lot of the newer MLB ball parks with retractable roofs don't exactly exude old-time baseball:
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Shapiro and those behind the scenes have been adamant in a ballpark that would reconnect with the City, with a much more intimate feel. Seeing the work Shapiro and his team have done in Cleveland gives me confidence for Toronto.

Remember that Texas is built out in the burbs, Miami isn't exactly downtown, and while Phoenix is in downtown, the team has explored options for a newer, intimate ballpark with a retractable roof, though this is probably years away.
 
C-mac said:
Those are all still superior to the Rogers Centre, and those are probably the worst 3 of the new stadiums, so that tells you how crap the Rogers Centre is.
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RC isn't perfect but considering all the upgrades that have occurred over the last 10 years and those that are ongoing, I wouldn't consider Globe Life, Marlins Park or Chase Field as superior. I honestly wouldn't. Globe Life is MLB's newest venue but it's been trashed by fans and critics alike as a dumpy, Costco ballpark. Add in its suburban location and complete lack of vibrancy then no, it is not superior. Oh, this place also uses artificial turf.

www.ksat.com

Texas Rangers’ new stadium is complete, but Twitter users aren’t pleased

Globe Life Field is officially ready to house the Texas Rangers, but many fans are taking to Twitter, claiming they are unhappy with the final results.
www.ksat.com www.ksat.com

Marlins Park or whatever it's called now is a soulless boondoggle. Oh and guess who just converted their grass playing surface to turf? The Marlins!

Chase Field is equally as large and empty as Rogers is and its amenities harken back to the 90's. A hot tub in CF? Oh goodness gracious, what a superior ballpark! FYI, Chase Field also abandoned real grass and replaced it with (drumroll please) AstroTurf!

G.L.17 said:
Shapiro and those behind the scenes have been adamant in a ballpark that would reconnect with the City, with a much more intimate feel. Seeing the work Shapiro and his team have done in Cleveland gives me confidence for Toronto.

Remember that Texas is built out in the burbs, Miami isn't exactly downtown, and while Phoenix is in downtown, the team has explored options for a newer, intimate ballpark with a retractable roof, though this is probably years away.
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A happy medium between extensive retrofitting and full on demolition is probably best. I've read the hotel was tacked on last minute to original construction plans and added like $100MM to the overall cost. Time to remove it and whichever land developer wants to get involved in the project can create a new hotel to house the existing Marriott. I'm hopeful an extensive retrofit can do the job similar to what was done with BC Place in Vancouver. That place was a heck of a lot more sterile and depressing than the Dome, I can tell you that much.
 
G.L.17 said:
Shapiro and those behind the scenes have been adamant in a ballpark that would reconnect with the City, with a much more intimate feel. Seeing the work Shapiro and his team have done in Cleveland gives me confidence for Toronto.

Remember that Texas is built out in the burbs, Miami isn't exactly downtown, and while Phoenix is in downtown, the team has explored options for a newer, intimate ballpark with a retractable roof, though this is probably years away.
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Why would a city like Phoenix, that has no winter and virtually no rain, need a retractable roof?
 
Translude15 said:
RC isn't perfect but considering all the upgrades that have occurred over the last 10 years and those that are ongoing, I wouldn't consider Globe Life, Marlins Park or Chase Field as superior. I honestly wouldn't. Globe Life is MLB's newest venue but it's been trashed by fans and critics alike as a dumpy, Costco ballpark. Add in its suburban location and complete lack of vibrancy then no, it is not superior. Oh, this place also uses artificial turf.

www.ksat.com

Texas Rangers’ new stadium is complete, but Twitter users aren’t pleased

Globe Life Field is officially ready to house the Texas Rangers, but many fans are taking to Twitter, claiming they are unhappy with the final results.
www.ksat.com www.ksat.com

Marlins Park or whatever it's called now is a soulless boondoggle. Oh and guess who just converted their grass playing surface to turf? The Marlins!

Chase Field is equally as large and empty as Rogers is and its amenities harken back to the 90's. A hot tub in CF? Oh goodness gracious, what a superior ballpark! FYI, Chase Field also abandoned real grass and replaced it with (drumroll please) AstroTurf!



A happy medium between extensive retrofitting and full on demolition is probably best. I've read the hotel was tacked on last minute to original construction plans and added like $100MM to the overall cost. Time to remove it and whichever land developer wants to get involved in the project can create a new hotel to house the existing Marriott. I'm hopeful an extensive retrofit can do the job similar to what was done with BC Place in Vancouver. That place was a heck of a lot more sterile and depressing than the Dome, I can tell you that much.
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yes, I am perfectly aware of all those things you mentioned about those ball parks, but they still rank higher then RC. I actually can't believe how bad Texas and Miami botched their new stadiums. All Texas had to do was put a roof over the old stadium as it was much nicer, but they wanted air conditioning...lol.


I'm okay with a retrofit if it can be done properly. Bottom line, is the RC needs work, and its just a matter of what is more cost efficient as well as ensuring it's done right.
 
I've posted Safeco Field in this thread before, but it's probably my favorite of the roofed stadiums. When open, the stadium doesn't feel quite like the bowl RC feels like.

MarinersCardinals-08339-1.jpg


MInute Maid Park is also similar. Having the side like that really opens up the stadium.

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Biggest issue is, where would you put it? Honestly, I'm thinking the Portlands would be a poor spot, due to where the batter's box needs to be orientated. The fans would be facing away from the downtown core.
 
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