Mississauga Hurontario-Main Line 10 LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx

Raul said:
What are the chances since Brampton has had a change of heart that Main St will be added again to to this project?
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Brampton had a change of heart?

Brampton did have a change of government....is that what you mean? That new government has suggested they will revisit the Main Street route....but the new council seemed to say that was conditional on a) a tunnel through “old Brampton” and b) an extension further north from Nelson to (depending on who you listen to) Bovaird or, even, Mayfield!

Not sure many will want to wait on that mess being sorted before they get going on the bits already approved.
 
TOareaFan said:
Brampton had a change of heart?

Brampton did have a change of government....is that what you mean? That new government has suggested they will revisit the Main Street route....but the new council seemed to say that was conditional on a) a tunnel through “old Brampton” and b) an extension further north from Nelson to (depending on who you listen to) Bovaird or, even, Mayfield!

Not sure many will want to wait on that mess being sorted before they get going on the bits already approved.
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Could that construction be done slightly later and open slightly later? Kinda like a phase 2, but the construction may happen at the same time, but open later?
 
micheal_can said:
Could that construction be done slightly later and open slightly later? Kinda like a phase 2, but the construction may happen at the same time, but open later?
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If Brampton wants to add a Main Street route,, I'd imagine it will be added as a later extension. Brampton's decision will likely not delay the construction, I assume that Metrolinx will be starting construction in Mississauga first.
 
TOareaFan said:
Brampton had a change of heart?

Brampton did have a change of government....is that what you mean? That new government has suggested they will revisit the Main Street route....but the new council seemed to say that was conditional on a) a tunnel through “old Brampton” and b) an extension further north from Nelson to (depending on who you listen to) Bovaird or, even, Mayfield!

Not sure many will want to wait on that mess being sorted before they get going on the bits already approved.
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Speaking of the motion Brampton Council passed, which is stronger than "suggested", in my mind, I've relooked at the motion. As I read the motion, noted below, there were no "conditions" on Brampton Council only accepting the Main Street extension if "an extension further north" on Main is funded by the Province. They key words in the original motion tie Brampton Council's approval to the July/October 2015 recommendations to accept surface Main and the money and the 2015 Transit and Transportation Master Plan which shows LRT between Steeles and Downtown Brampton GO. For the second revision (see [2]) below, an update to the 2014 HMLRT EA is requested, which is not unusual given several LRT EAs in Toronto have required small updates.

For the tunnel option, it simply means, in my personal opinion, staff will come back and lay out the next steps for further looking at a tunnel, but it doesn't say that they won't accept Provincial or Federal funds if it's not a tunnel. Mayor Brown wasn't on Council previously so he may not be aware of the costs and logistics of a tunnel. There wasn't a lot of specifics on this topic during the municipal campaign.

I'd have to look at the video to see if one of the Councillors who voted for the original motion verbally implied they'd only accept the money if there's rapid transit on Main North or if there's a tunnel, but that language isn't in the actual motion adopted. It would also beg the question of if they theoretically put conditions on a tunnel for Main or something for Main north, why they wouldn't have also been consistent with their own motion by mentioning Queen or Kennedy (see below for what it said about those roads).

Original motion (see page 33 in the Committee of Council minutes here; and motion as amended in the Council minutes page 41 here):

Therefore be it resolved:

[1] That LRT for Main Street as originally recommended by Brampton staff be immediately restored as part of the Brampton Transit Network Plan;

[2] That LRT no longer be considered for Kennedy Road or McLaughlin Road;

[3] That staff be directed to revise the Brampton LRT Extension Study to (a) make any minor updates to the HMLRT EA, (b) use Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) as the technology for Kennedy Road and McLaughlin Road and consider extending those alignments further north and/or south, (c) study rapid transit options from the Brampton GO Station to Mayfield Road on Main Street as contemplated in the TTMP, and (d) report back on an implementation strategy for a downtown Mobility Hub;

[4] That staff also be directed to report back in expediting the Queen Street Transit Master Plan study and timeline to commence an EA in order to get the BRT project to shovel ready status in order to secure Provincial and Federal funding;

[5] That staff also be directed to consider electric buses for any BRT project;

[6] That Council communicate to Metrolinx its support for (a) more all day, two-way peak and off-peak GO train service on the Kitchener Line, (b) electrification proceeding west of the Bramalea GO Station, (c) encourage the rail optimization strategy that is currently underway be expedited including the start the EA for the freight bypass and the EAs for the "Kitchener additional track", "Heritage Road Layover", and "Georgetown to Kitchener GO" as noted on page 144 of the November 2018 GO Expansion Full Business Case, and (d) encourage more GO bus service and capacity while the above-noted EAs are conducted; and

[7] That staff be directed to immediately communicate the position of Council to the Premier's Office, the Minister of Transportation, all Brampton MPs and MPPs; and Council be directed to meet with Brampton's MPs and MPPs immediately to discuss how to collaboratively work together for a Brampton transit network.
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A referral request was made:

1. Building a Comprehensive Transit Network for all of Brampton" be referred to a transit committee of Council, creation of which is planned to be considered by City Council by way of a staff report to be listed on the December 12, 2018, City Council meeting agenda; and

2. That staff be requested to report back on the matter in January 2019.
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And it lost.

A tunnel amendment was made, and some wordsmithing:

[1] To add the words "route" after the word "LRT", and "be prioritized" after the word "recommended" in the first paragraph, to read as follows:
"That LRT route for Main Street as originally recommended be prioritized by Brampton staff, and be immediately restored as part of the Brampton Transit Network Plan;"; and,

[2] To remove the word "minor" after the word "any" and add the words "including study and consideration of an underground tunneling option" after the words "HMLRT EA" in part (a) of the third paragraph, to read as follows:

"That staff be directed to revise the Brampton LRT Extension Study to (a) make any updates to the HMLRT EA, including study and consideration of an underground tunneling option (b) use Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) as the technology for Kennedy Road and McLaughlin Road and consider extending those alignments further north and/or south, (c) study rapid transit options from the Brampton GO Station to Mayfield Road on Main Street as contemplated in the TTMP, and (d) report back on an implementation strategy for a downtown Mobility Hub;"
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And it passed.
 
micheal_can said:
Could that construction be done slightly later and open slightly later? Kinda like a phase 2, but the construction may happen at the same time, but open later?
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I am sure it can....but it impacts cost...how much, I don't know but surely building a terminus station at Steeles and then extending it further must come with some cost....no? The alternative is to wait and I am not sure how long you wait until the whole tunnel is studied and the new mayor gets his hands around the cost.

Look (before this gets to far) I am not expressing opposition to extending it to DT Brampton....but I was merely responding to someone wondering if now it could be done.....I think they will go ahead and build it to Steeles.....then when it is nearly done, if Brampton is onside and "nearly done" happens to line up with the next election they will boldly promise that in their second term they will deliver LRT to DT Brampton.
 
Allandale25 said:
Speaking of the motion Brampton Council passed, which is stronger than "suggested", in my mind, I've relooked at the motion. As I read the motion, noted below, there were no "conditions" on Brampton Council only accepting the Main Street extension if "an extension further north" on Main is funded by the Province. They key words in the original motion tie Brampton Council's approval to the July/October 2015 recommendations to accept surface Main and the money and the 2015 Transit and Transportation Master Plan which shows LRT between Steeles and Downtown Brampton GO. For the second revision (see [2]) below, an update to the 2014 HMLRT EA is requested, which is not unusual given several LRT EAs in Toronto have required small updates.

For the tunnel option, it simply means, in my personal opinion, staff will come back and lay out the next steps for further looking at a tunnel, but it doesn't say that they won't accept Provincial or Federal funds if it's not a tunnel. Mayor Brown wasn't on Council previously so he may not be aware of the costs and logistics of a tunnel. There wasn't a lot of specifics on this topic during the municipal campaign.

I'd have to look at the video to see if one of the Councillors who voted for the original motion verbally implied they'd only accept the money if there's rapid transit on Main North or if there's a tunnel, but that language isn't in the actual motion adopted. It would also beg the question of if they theoretically put conditions on a tunnel for Main or something for Main north, why they wouldn't have also been consistent with their own motion by mentioning Queen or Kennedy (see below for what it said about those roads).

Original motion (see page 33 in the Committee of Council minutes here; and motion as amended in the Council minutes page 41 here):



A referral request was made:



And it lost.

A tunnel amendment was made, and some wordsmithing:



And it passed.
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Is there any timeline as to when staff will report back on this motion?
 
Here it is.

177660
 
Does this mean that there will not be any direct access from the Cooksville LRT stop and the GO station above? Will people wanting to connect between LRT and GO train have to cross Hurontario to do so?
 
Anastasia said:
Does this mean that there will not be any direct access from the Cooksville LRT stop and the GO station above? Will people wanting to connect between LRT and GO train have to cross Hurontario to do so?
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Never mind, I looked at the available renderings from the Urban Toronto database file, and it appears that a crossing of Hurontario was always planned at the Cooksville Station (with crosswalks provided at either end of the LRT platform). I guess I just imagined a direct connection with the planned pedestrian bridge from the LRT platform.

I think the removal of the City Centre Loop makes the route more efficient. The idea of switching trains to go from one end of the line to the other never made sense to me.
 
I updated this the map. Note: this is not a Metrolinx map. I edited the official one. We'll have to wait for the official revised map to come out.

177677
 
^ Embedded example: think of the ROW for Spadina, on what the Crosstown will have on its surface portion on the east side.
Fixated: think of the exposed portion of the Queen streetcar on Queensway, except in the Hurontario LRT's case they will probably use a base layer of concrete. You also see this on the crossover portions on the Waterloo Region LRT near the terminal stations. Picture in UT here.

That's my non-expert understanding.
 
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