TTC: Other Items (catch all)

[andrewpmk]

Orthodox Christmas is on January.

That retailer is being selfish, unless it paid the TTC handsomely.

The whole issue of excessive numbers of road closures in Toronto has got out of control. Every single weekend between March and November (and sometimes on weekdays in rush hour) there are events closing roads all over the place and almost all of these events detour TTC bus and streetcar service and/or GO bus service. It is time that John Tory and city council limit special events that close roads to a few times per year, ban marathons, expressway closures and similar events, and that strict measures be taken to minimize disruption (for example, banning them from closing main roads like DVP/Gardiner/Lake Shore and streetcar routes and banning them at the same time as subway construction closures).

I will not be shopping at Hudson's Bay this Christmas, attending TIFF or otherwise supporting the sponsors of these closures.

 

[crs1026]

I had a miserable ride home on the 501 yesterday in the rain - slow traffic (mostly single occupant vehicles that didn't clear the lane for streetcars, for one reason or another). It drove home to me what a low priority expediting streetcar movement on this line has on the City's list of how to speed travel across downtown.
We need streetcars to have sole use of those lanes, all the time. Anyone suggesting that we should divert around 'events' should not be working for the City any longer.
I wonder if riders need to get more activist about these things. What coverage would a single file line of people dressed in red and white, walking back and forth down Queen during this event, ringing bells (trolley chimes, you see) get from the media ?
Just spitballing.
- Paul

 

[amnesiajune]

This diversion is garbage. So is making 'movie street' or 'movie village' or whatever the hell it is on King during TIFF. Closing transit lines for anything but maintenance is a terrible practice that is not going to produce more transit riders, or give existing ones more confidence.

Welcome to a big city. Road closures for major events are a thing that happens when you live in one.

 

[TransitBart]

None of us should be silly. Some of these comments are silly. My comment was made to be productive.

A major event like Christmas should ideally be cancelled... (or at least moved to February).

I love Christmas. I like Mariah Carey's "All I Want for Christmas". I remember fondly going to Queen Street to see the Simpson's windows at the corner of Yonge. The windows were animatronic until Simpson's was bought by HBC. It's where I caught my first views of PCC cars running in 'trains' on Queen using the connectors.

Welcome to a big city. Road closures for major events are a thing that happens when you live in one.

This is not a 'normal' big city. It is one operating one step from a 'force majeure' on transit. There will likely be the better part of a decade before getting around gets any easier. Prioritizing the movement of people and goods should be important to decision makers. Christmas, various marathons, Taste of the Danforth, Corso D'Italia and Nuit Blanche amongst others are great community events. However; many of these happen on weekends. Not many at the tail end of a weekday rush hour.

This comes on the heel of the news that the Spadina to Shaw diversion of the 501 is going to continue for another eight weeks. Same line affected.

This is a poor decision which is unlikely to create more transit ridership, satisfied riders or get anyone home any earlier tonight.

 

[PinkLucy]

The Queen streetcar will be on diversion tomorrow, during rush hour, so that a retailer could do a Christmas window reveal 2 months before Christmas.

Mariah Carey is reportedly get $1 million for that gig http://www.blogto.com/music/2016/11/mariah_carey_getting_1_million_for_free_toronto_concert/

 

[andrewpmk]

None of us should be silly. Some of these comments are silly. My comment was made to be productive.



I love Christmas. I like Mariah Carey's "All I Want for Christmas". I remember fondly going to Queen Street to see the Simpson's windows at the corner of Yonge. The windows were animatronic until Simpson's was bought by HBC. It's where I caught my first views of PCC cars running in 'trains' on Queen using the connectors.



This is not a 'normal' big city. It is one operating one step from a 'force majeure' on transit. There will likely be the better part of a decade before getting around gets any easier. Prioritizing the movement of people and goods should be important to decision makers. Christmas, various marathons, Taste of the Danforth, Corso D'Italia and Nuit Blanche amongst others are great community events. However; many of these happen on weekends. Not many at the tail end of a weekday rush hour.

This comes on the heel of the news that the Spadina to Shaw diversion of the 501 is going to continue for another eight weeks. Same line affected.

This is a poor decision which is unlikely to create more transit ridership, satisfied riders or get anyone home any earlier tonight.

Toronto has far more of these road closures than any other city I can think of. Only in Toronto do we shut down really busy roads like Gardiner, DVP and Lake Shore for no reason. Also the fact that Toronto has a streetcar system makes the issue of road closures a lot worse since streetcar lines constantly get shut down for no reason. Furthermore almost all of the road closures on weekends happen at the same time that portions of the subway are closed for construction, which should never be allowed.

It is time that Tory/city council crack down on road closures and impose some sort of quota on the number of events that are allowed to close major roads, somewhere around 5-10 times a year. Only events that attract very large crowds (1000000+ say) would be allowed, so really big events like Santa Claus Parade and Pride Parade would be safe but only a very small number of those events would be allowed.

 

[PinkLucy]

The roads aren't shut down for no reason. There is always a reason. Just because you don't like the reason doesn't make it wrong.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

The roads aren't shut down for no reason. There is always a reason. Just because you don't like the reason doesn't make it wrong.

I do think this instance is a bad call though - this isn't the TIFF, nor is this an event of such public significance. Just because it is a public space really shouldn't be interpreted as a free-for-all - you are shutting out part of the public who actually uses the route afterall. Also this isn't an after-hour, weekend request - it's happening right during the weekday rush. Standards for closing a transit corridor at that time should be particularly high.

AoD

 

[andrewpmk]

My response was anything but silly. Remembrance day is next week. The Queen streetcar will again be diverted for a few hours. Do veterans need "your" approval to attend a memorial in "their" city? Will the crowd again spill into the street and block traffic in the core? Yes. Will it be an inconvenience for some? Yes. Should it be banned by city council too?

Toronto has always had a tradition of celebrating, mourning and protesting in their public spaces. Whether you like it or not, roads and sidewalks are part of our public space. That's not going to change, no matter what restrictions some might wish to impose. This city is about more than simply getting back and forth to work. Some of us actually live our life in this city...

There isn't any real reason that the Remembrance Day ceremony can't be moved somewhere else, except for politics of course. Though part of the problem is that November 11 is on a weekday most years. If Remembrance Day were a statutory holiday then closing roads for Remembrance Day would be less of an issue.

Toronto has far more of these road closures than any other city that I am aware of, and they cause far more disruption. While cancelling the biggest events is not going to happen, Toronto needs to stop allowing such a ridiculous number of minor events, stop allowing anything that causes extreme disruption (like marathons, closing highways and closing Lake Shore), stop closing roads when the subway is shut down for construction and ban road closures on weekdays except holidays. Making Remembrance Day a statutory holiday would solve the latter problem. There is no reason that 90% of these events can't be moved to parks or minor side streets except for politics.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

There isn't any real reason that the Remembrance Day ceremony can't be moved somewhere else, except for politics of course. Though part of the problem is that November 11 is on a weekday most years. If Remembrance Day were a statutory holiday then closing roads for Remembrance Day would be less of an issue.

Toronto has far more of these road closures than any other city that I am aware of, and they cause far more disruption. While cancelling the biggest events is not going to happen, Toronto needs to stop allowing such a ridiculous number of minor events, stop allowing anything that causes extreme disruption (like marathons, closing highways and closing Lake Shore), stop closing roads when the subway is shut down for construction and ban road closures on weekdays except holidays. Making Remembrance Day a statutory holiday would solve the latter problem. There is no reason that 90% of these events can't be moved to parks or minor side streets except for politics.

Sorry, Remembrance Day is borderline sacred for good reason - you don't move it anywhere, least of which away from the centres of political power. We can afford to be inconvenienced in remembrance of their ultimate inconvenience.

AoD

 

[PinkLucy]

I do think this instance is a bad call though - this isn't the TIFF, nor is this an event of such public significance. Just because it is a public space really shouldn't be interpreted as a free-for-all - you are shutting out part of the public who actually uses the route afterall. Also this isn't an after-hour, weekend request - it's happening right during the weekday rush. Standards for closing a transit corridor at that time should be particularly high.

AoD

I do agree on this particular instance but it was a blanket call to stop any road closures unless they involved 100,000+ people (which many of them do). And this closure is also for a commercial venture (advertising for The Bay/Saks) whereas Ride for Heart, for example, is a huge fundraiser.

 

[crs1026]

My response was anything but silly. Remembrance day is next week. The Queen streetcar will again be diverted for a few hours. Do veterans need "your" approval to attend a memorial in "their" city? Will the crowd again spill into the street and block traffic in the core? Yes. Will it be an inconvenience for some? Yes. Should it be banned by city council too?

Banned? No. Crowd control and barriers to keep people off the street car tracks? Yes. Scheduled to not happen at rush hour? Yes.

Toronto has always had a tradition of celebrating, mourning and protesting in their public spaces. Whether you like it or not, roads and sidewalks are part of our public space. That's not going to change, no matter what restrictions some might wish to impose. This city is about more than simply getting back and forth to work. Some of us actually live our life in this city...

There will always be events that justify closures downtown - Ride for Life, Santa Claus Parade, whatever. Protest is good. But leaving this wide open to any group or cause creates chaos. Just as protecting nature doesn't equate to people keeping a hundred stray (and unspeyed) cats in their house. This particular event was not for a "cause" or for "democracy", it was for a profitable company's promotional needs. It was at rush hour. That's not acceptable.

- Paul

 

[andrewpmk]

Some of these events (like the marathons, the triathlon and the "Ride for Heart" event) cause so much disruption that there are massive traffic jams and it is practically impossible to get around. Also I strongly suspect that the negative effect on the economy caused by getting millions of people stuck in traffic and forcing people to avoid going into downtown Toronto vastly exceeds the amount of money raised by charity by these events. Only a small percentage of the Heart and Stroke Foundation's revenue comes from the annual closure of DVP and Gardiner. Most of it comes from lottery sales. There have got to be better ways to finance these charities. Even if taxpayer money were used to fund these charities instead it would only be a tiny percentage of government budgets.

The worst road closures in Toronto make the traffic jams caused by the George Washington Bridge lane closure scandal look good in comparison.

As for Remembrance Day, the only politically feasible solution is to make November 11 a statutory holiday. For all other road closures the solution is to only allow very large events that attract 500,000-1,000,000 people or more (100,000 is far too low a threshold given the tendency for organizers to exaggerate attendance). It is possible that closures of very minor roads with low traffic volumes would be allowed for smaller events but closures of any main road or any road with a bus or streetcar route should be allowed very rarely. The vast majority of events that close roads in Toronto, including all of the most disruptive events, attract far fewer than that.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

The worst road closures in Toronto make the traffic jams caused by the George Washington Bridge lane closure scandal look good in comparison

Yes, one is closing lanes on a bridge to intentionally punish a political opponent on the first day of school - resulting in (breaking news) the conviction of key staffers involved - the other is closing a highway to raise funds on a weekend, at the risk of annoying drivers whom the decision maker had to respond to. Good comparison there. Just how did the former look better (nevermind comparable at all, but hey since you brought it up)

As for Remembrance Day, the only politically feasible solution is to make November 11 a statutory holiday.

Hardly anyone make such a fuzz over any traffic delays over Remembrance Day - and even fewer to such an extent that it is a problem that requires a new statutory holiday as a solution. Nobody with a political bone in their body would call for it because of supposed inconvenience (much less acknowledging that it is inconvenient, in the context of the gravity and significance of the day).

AoD

 

[Skeezix]

Only in Toronto do we shut down really busy roads like Gardiner, DVP and Lake Shore for no reason. Also the fact that Toronto has a streetcar system makes the issue of road closures a lot worse since streetcar lines constantly get shut down for no reason.

As a city, we need to stop closing highways, streets and streetcar lines down for no reason! The Mayor needs to do something about these whimsical closings.

I do think this instance is a bad call though - this isn't the TIFF, nor is this an event of such public significance. Just because it is a public space really shouldn't be interpreted as a free-for-all - you are shutting out part of the public who actually uses the route afterall. Also this isn't an after-hour, weekend request - it's happening right during the weekday rush. Standards for closing a transit corridor at that time should be particularly high.

Agreed. Hudson's Bay should unveil its windows on the weekend, not weekday rush hour. Mariah Carey or not.

There isn't any real reason that the Remembrance Day ceremony can't be moved somewhere else, except for politics of course.

Did you seriously just say that?? That the ceremony is at the cenotaph at Old City Hall because of "politics"?