smallspy
Senior Member
You don't swipe tokens.
Well, unless you are attempting to steal them.
Dan
Toronto, Ont.
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TTC: Fare system loopholes
- Thread starter ksun
- Start date
You don't swipe tokens.
Well, unless you are attempting to steal them.
Dan
Toronto, Ont.
nfitz
Superstar
It's a Metrocard. Unlimited travel. So when it doesn't work, you just show it to the attendant, who I've never had them question it (normally because either the card has stopped working, the machine isn't working properly, or on the rare occasion, I've entered twice in a couple of minutes).
the lemur
Senior Member
I guess it would be an issue if the TTC actually issued passes with stored value or a set number of rides on them, instead of validity based on calendar dates.
ShonTron
Moderator
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TTC Bylaw #1 (which covers such things as petty fare evasion) is not a criminal law - it's prosecuted pretty much as a provincial offense. It's not criminal per se, just like driving through a red light or having an open container of alcohol in public.
Counterfitting TTC tokens and selling them en masse - that's a criminal act.
nfitz
Superstar
That's what PRESTO is. In there wouldn't be an extra charge, as (at least on other systems) it treats all taps within X hours as simply transfers.
Though PRESTO on TTC currently would likely use an extra charge. Still, if you take a transfer, and go explain the situation to the station attendant, and reappear 2 minutes later, I suspect you'd likely be fine. I've had no problems in similar situations in other cities where I don't speak the language, and have tapped in the wrong place, or had to enter, quickly exit, and then re-enter ... despite the communication all being hand signals.
It likely wouldn't be prosecuted as a criminal act. But unlike driving through a red light, or drinking in public, fraud is a criminal act, and it's covered by the Criminal Code of Canada. I agree though, prosecution would likely be by Bylaw rather than under the Criminal Code.
Let's not try and whitewash those stealing rides by forgetting it is a criminal act, even if prosecutions under the Criminal Code of Canada are rare.
epcjay
New Member
I do have a few loopholes for Presto in general.
1. Tap on a YRT Bus or station before tapping on a YRT express bus. Bingo 50 cents saved.
2. If you work at York Mills Station, and need to go Markham, one would take TTC to finch, then YRT/Viva. Nope, catch a go bus to finch station, then tap on a YRT Bus - Go Fare + 75c. Money saved!
3. Take a go bus, and return within the 3 hours on the same route (I think it was), one fare only deducted!
4. I haven't done this one in a while but, there one thing you can do when to jack up your ride count with exhibition station. I can't remember what it was though.
1. Tap on a YRT Bus or station before tapping on a YRT express bus. Bingo 50 cents saved.
2. If you work at York Mills Station, and need to go Markham, one would take TTC to finch, then YRT/Viva. Nope, catch a go bus to finch station, then tap on a YRT Bus - Go Fare + 75c. Money saved!
3. Take a go bus, and return within the 3 hours on the same route (I think it was), one fare only deducted!
4. I haven't done this one in a while but, there one thing you can do when to jack up your ride count with exhibition station. I can't remember what it was though.
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LNahid2000
Senior Member
Haha I figured out this one by accident when taking a GO Train to Whitby to buy a bike. Seems to be a flaw in the Presto system, but it actually deducts two fares minus a base fare so you save about $5.
nfitz
Superstar
Not sure it's a flaw per se. If you go to GO's fare calculator, and enter the fare from point A to point A with a transfer at point B, this matches what Presto charges for return GO trips, when you start your return legs before 3 hours after your initial tap.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
Damn it Mod, stop countering his blanket statements with true and logic.
The truth is, near everyone's a bigot and fare evasion is a criminal act
TheKingEast
Senior Member
I've used a few loopholes myself. Like going into a store while waiting for a streetcar and using the transfer. If that's a criminal offense then....
nfitz
Superstar
I don't think that's an offence. I've also broken the rules by walking from one transfer point to another (because it was quicker than waiting for the connecting vehicle ... for example from Dundas/Broadview to Gerrard/Broadview when changing from a 504 Broadview to a 506 Main Street). I really don't see how that's an offence. Though the current transfer rules are absolutely bizarre, and need to be simplified ... this was driven home to me the one day when I had to stop at the bank to get some $ to buy more tokens ... which required me to get off the bus next to the subway station, requiring me to pay again when I walked into the subway entrance next to the bank.I've used a few loopholes myself. Like going into a store while waiting for a streetcar and using the transfer. If that's a criminal offense then....
Hmm, I might have overthought Lemur's example. I'm not sure why he'd grab the second transfer, when the first one was still fine. I'm thinking of stuff like where you take a second transfer, and give it to a friend at a later transfer point, who hasn't actually paid, and is joining you.
Electrify
Senior Member
Ironic that the long distance commuter system GO offers timed transfers, while the local short distance TTC system does not, eh?
nfitz
Superstar
The TTC does offer time-based transfers ... but only for the 512 streetcar - http://www.ttc.ca/Fares_and_passes/Fare_information/Transfers/Time_based_transfers.jsp
the lemur
Senior Member
Because the first transfer would not be accepted beyond the second transfer point. For example: get on at Bathurst, travel to Spadina, get transfer marked Spadina, take streetcar to transfer point. I'm pretty sure a streetcar operator would balk at a Bathurst transfer offered by a passenger coming off the Spadina car.
nfitz
Superstar
No they wouldn't. I can't think of any reason why a Bathurst station transfer would be refused on any of the routes that the Spadina streetcar intersects (assuming it wasn't a very old transfer).
Why would you think they would reject it? I've done far stranger things, to make the quickest journey between point A and point B, without any complaint.
If you go to the TTC Trip Planner, it will even tell you to do this for some trips. For example, Bathurst Station to College and Major if you tell it you don't want to walk more than 250 metres. The second option (for the current time) is to take the subway to Spadina, the 510 to College, and a 506 to College/Major, with 2 transfers. So it's certainly a valid TTC trip with 2 transfers!