Toronto Wallace Walk Towns | ?m | 4s | The Somerset Group | KFA

[Wally Wonka]

Wow, this is shady indeed, I don't remember the exact date of my appointment but I had the white out prices.

I did ask if I can credit the appliances and upgrade my self or for tier pricing discounts, nothing was offered pretty much go the "Deal with it" attitude that everybody else got.

Also, for the rain shower head, I am pretty sure they are not adding any new plumbing (so it won't "rain" from your roof top), I believe is one of the simple ones:

View attachment 39073

Those are incredibly easy to put in yourself, and i think they are charging 800+ for one and i think they go for 90 dollar.

Now though, i am making a big assumption which is that being this a new construction the height of the shower head is higher than older houses. It is best for a rainfall showerhead to be at a good height for obvious reason. (I never bothered to ask because at that point i wasn't in a good mood hahaha but if you waint a rainfall shower head ask , is like at the last page of the plumbing, and it does had a Trimming charge, which i really didn't care to read about any more hidden costs )

Is up to you


I'll check my upgrade prices when i get home and post them here, maybe if we work together on researching the law we can get this straighten out.

In addition to possible legal avenues, one would think that Torbel and In2uition would care about reputational risks (i.e. future business) given the public discussion here. Someone considering an assignment at Wallace Walk has already asked for our views on the builder in this forum. And, I think it's pretty likely that other potential buyers would also do some online searching on Torbel. I wonder if the builder would care if they recieved a poor ranking by J.D. Power and Associates (apparently a couple years ago JD Power ranked condominium builders in the GTA) or the Better Business Bureau due to their practice of charging different prices for the same product. Maybe if they were aware of this discussion it would motivate them to address this problem. Perhaps we should all get in touch with the builder to let them know that many of us (i.e. buyers whose finishing appointments were scheduled in November and after) are not happy about this and are simply looking for fair and honest treatment by them.

 

[arturino83]

In addition to possible legal avenues, one would think that Torbel and In2uition would care about reputational risks (i.e. future business) given the public discussion here. Someone considering an assignment at Wallace Walk has already asked for our views on the builder in this forum. And, I think it's pretty likely that other potential buyers would also do some online searching on Torbel. I wonder if the builder would care if they recieved a poor ranking by J.D. Power and Associates (apparently a couple years ago JD Power ranked condominium builders in the GTA) or the Better Business Bureau due to their practice of charging different prices for the same product. Maybe if they were aware of this discussion it would motivate them to address this problem. Perhaps we should all get in touch with the builder to let them know that many of us (i.e. buyers whose finishing appointments were scheduled in November and after) are not happy about this and are simply looking for fair and honest treatment by them.

I'm going to contact our lawyer for an opinion on this absurd situation. We had our appointment in November as well and got the higher prices for the appliances too. I'm also having doubts that everything was increased in price (i.e. Faucets upgrade etc). I was already quite pissed having to choose floor and not match it with stairs which i will have to stain after. The price and choice of upgrades was ridiculous. If I didn't upgrade spending more than 20k extra, I'm sure the townhouse would have been devalued by the poor quality/esthetics "standard" finishes.

I'm available to meet and talk about this issue. I can also scan our upgrades to check prices with you guys.

 

[Wally Wonka]

I'm going to contact our lawyer for an opinion on this absurd situation. We had our appointment in November as well and got the higher prices for the appliances too. I'm also having doubts that everything was increased in price (i.e. Faucets upgrade etc). I was already quite pissed having to choose floor and not match it with stairs which i will have to stain after. The price and choice of upgrades was ridiculous. If I didn't upgrade spending more than 20k extra, I'm sure the townhouse would have been devalued by the poor quality/esthetics "standard" finishes.

I'm available to meet and talk about this issue. I can also scan our upgrades to check prices with you guys.

Here are photos taken of the post-October pricing for the kitchen sink, kitchen faucet and bathroom faucets. As was done with the upgrade appliance pricing, the prices appear to be written overtop white-out which suggests that the prices may have been lower before, but someone else would have to confirm that.

 

[RT2013]

I'm going to contact our lawyer for an opinion on this absurd situation. We had our appointment in November as well and got the higher prices for the appliances too. I'm also having doubts that everything was increased in price (i.e. Faucets upgrade etc). I was already quite pissed having to choose floor and not match it with stairs which i will have to stain after. The price and choice of upgrades was ridiculous. If I didn't upgrade spending more than 20k extra, I'm sure the townhouse would have been devalued by the poor quality/esthetics "standard" finishes.

I'm available to meet and talk about this issue. I can also scan our upgrades to check prices with you guys.

We just had our appointment, and I was furious about the stairs. We spent 6k for the stairs upgrade and then we have to pay an additional 3k to match the floors. This is complete lack of disclosure. If we knew, why bother spending on the stair upgrade. We opted to have them vary.
I'm on the same page with everyone regarding appliances. I'm sure they assume everyone will upgrade from those 1970s appliances or else they need to go rummaging through a scrap yard.

 

[drum118]

Dec 15 & 19
Lot more up on site

The residents of this project will have to pay the full cost of any sound barrier if they want one due to the rail corridor as well having in on their property. Metrolinx will not cover the cost since this was done after the EA was done for the area.

 

[smokeychow]

They are building a row of Commercial Units along the railpath that should be as tall as the installed sound barrier (5m). The question is... when will they start construction on them.

 

[Boyles84]

Hello all, just found this forum and I am very upset about the price change on the upgrades. Is anyone interested in getting together to compare and submit a formal complaint to the builder? I know of another owner who will be angry too. Either way, I will be complaining.

 

[arturino83]

I can compare my upgrade with other buyers. However we need somebody who was in the first round of appointment to compare not only appliances which is very clear that were increased in price but all other upgrades. I very much believe faucets are also being changed.

 

[wilsonwilson]

I don't mind sharing either, but i am the high price range (the liquid paper book )

Also, have you guys noticed there are mini balcony's now instead of Juliet for the T's? (not that i am complaining about that but that's an interesting random change, wonder it is because their newer constructions up north are with the mini balcony's. (is like a copycat of Wallace).

 

[Sprinkles]

I don't mind sharing either, but i am the high price range (the liquid paper book )

Also, have you guys noticed there are mini balcony's now instead of Juliet for the T's? (not that i am complaining about that but that's an interesting random change, wonder it is because their newer constructions up north are with the mini balcony's. (is like a copycat of Wallace).

In addition to the change in juliet balconies I think there is something else to note. It looks like T3 units will not be getting two windows (1 door, 1 window) on their terrace. We were visiting the site last week and it definitely looks like there is only one opening for the sliding door to the terrace and thats it. Unless they are going to install a backless window (one that is cosmetic only) I'm pretty sure they have change this from what is depicted on the website, brochure and what we understood to be included when we bought our unit.

I'd recommend if you bought a T3, or perhaps any other terrace unit that you swing by teh site to see if you are getting what was depicted in the model/brochure/website when you bought your unit.

I'll post a picture when I get home tonight.

 

[wilsonwilson]

In addition to the change in juliet balconies I think there is something else to note. It looks like T3 units will not be getting two windows (1 door, 1 window) on their terrace. We were visiting the site last week and it definitely looks like there is only one opening for the sliding door to the terrace and thats it. Unless they are going to install a backless window (one that is cosmetic only) I'm pretty sure they have change this from what is depicted on the website, brochure and what we understood to be included when we bought our unit.

I'd recommend if you bought a T3, or perhaps any other terrace unit that you swing by teh site to see if you are getting what was depicted in the model/brochure/website when you bought your unit.

I'll post a picture when I get home tonight.

Usually with things like these the outer changes are expected (some for the worst some for the best), is in your contract were you have your floor plan, little small print.

But yeah I personally don;t like the window changes either, they aren't true floor to ceiling glass, they have sections now but is expected the artist render is always fakish. (no clue why Toronto lets builders (well some clue) get away with this stuff but is not illegal if they are upfront about it)

 

[Wally Wonka]

Usually with things like these the outer changes are expected (some for the worst some for the best), is in your contract were you have your floor plan, little small print.

But yeah I personally don;t like the window changes either, they aren't true floor to ceiling glass, they have sections now but is expected the artist render is always fakish. (no clue why Toronto lets builders (well some clue) get away with this stuff but is not illegal if they are upfront about it)

I agree that the contract allows for the builder to make certain changes, such as location and size of a window. But completely removing an entire window which is shown in the plan that signed along with the purchase agreement (especially when a unit may only have up to 5 windows in the case of a T3) would seem to be in the neighborhood of a "material" (can't recall the exact term in the contract) change which the builder shouldn't be permitted to make without some type of recourse for the buyer. Removing an entire window for other units with even fewer windows would make this change even more acute.

 

[smokeychow]

I agree that the contract allows for the builder to make certain changes, such as location and size of a window. But completely removing an entire window which is shown in the plan that signed along with the purchase agreement (especially when a unit may only have up to 5 windows in the case of a T3) would seem to be in the neighborhood of a "material" (can't recall the exact term in the contract) change which the builder shouldn't be permitted to make without some type of recourse for the buyer. Removing an entire window for other units with even fewer windows would make this change even more acute.

It's so tough to take the builder to court for this - the units have gone up substantially in value since purchase (if you are an original purchaser) so it would be tough to prove material loss on the design change for the builder to have to compensate.

If this is the case, let us know if you are successful with your grievance with the builder.

 

[Wally Wonka]

It's so tough to take the builder to court for this - the units have gone up substantially in value since purchase (if you are an original purchaser) so it would be tough to prove material loss on the design change for the builder to have to compensate.

If this is the case, let us know if you are successful with your grievance with the builder.

I haven't given much thought (or inquired with our lawyer yet) as to how to quantify the damage. But I'd like to think there would be atleast some compensation in terms of impact on the enjoyment of the property (versus just a measurement of property value). When light into a unit is at a premium (as reflected by the number of windows a given unit has), reducing that light has to mean something. The builder recognizes the "value" of light to some extent as reflected in the varying prices of the same unit depending on whether it faces south or the total number of window, for example. I'm pretty sure (?) that units (of the same type) were priced differerently where one is located in the interior of a building (no east/west windows) versus one located on a corner. Granted, the number of windows would not be the only reason for a price difference, but its more than likely that it would be one of them. After all, if the builder can make money off of a "feature", it will. So conversely, buyers should be compensated where that valueable feature is taken away.

 

[smokeychow]

I haven't given much thought (or inquired with our lawyer yet) as to how to quantify the damage. But I'd like to think there would be atleast some compensation in terms of impact on the enjoyment of the property (versus just a measurement of property value). When light into a unit is at a premium (as reflected by the number of windows a given unit has), reducing that light has to mean something. The builder recognizes the "value" of light to some extent as reflected in the varying prices of the same unit depending on whether it faces south or the total number of window, for example. I'm pretty sure (?) that units (of the same type) were priced differerently where one is located in the interior of a building (no east/west windows) versus one located on a corner. Granted, the number of windows would not be the only reason for a price difference, but its more than likely that it would be one of them. After all, if the builder can make money off of a "feature", it will. So conversely, buyers should be compensated where that valueable feature is taken away.

I found this article fairly quickly... I guess it would be up to a judge to decide if losing a window would substantially diminish your 'enjoyment' of the unit.
https://www.reminetwork.com/articles/defining-material-changes-in-new-condos/

'The Ontario Superior Court of Justice (SCJ) has said in case law that alterations that substantially change a purchaser’s anticipated use and enjoyment of a unit are material changes.

The SCJ has found a material change, for example, where a loft space in a unit could no longer be built as specified in the original plans due to permit issues.

The SCJ has also said that there is no material change where there is no loss of the purchaser’s investment value, or depreciation in income in the case of a rental/investment property. In particular, it found in one case that changes in access to underground walkways and overall building height (in terms of floors, where it was reduced from 70 to 60 floors) did not constitute material changes.'