Platform 27
Active Member
^What you just described is the very definition of "not competing": One service for one market segment, another service for a second.
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TheTigerMaster
Superstar
Fair enough
Well that same businessperson I described earlier would very likely prefer to pay $3 for a 53 minute trip than $33 for a 41 minute trip from his hotel.
TOareaFan
Superstar
I think the UPX's primary target is the business traveller....what is news to me from your post is that they are staying at Bloor-Yonge? I always thought that the typical business traveller/visitor to Toronto is staying at the hotels down nearer the financial core...ie the ones that are an easy walk from Union. If that is the case, both the cost (which we don't know yet but expect to be in the low/mid $20 range) and the time (which we expect to be in the 25 minute range) are quite different from your post.
TFC
Active Member
The UPX issue has almost turned into an "us vs. them" issue, whereby all of us "normal folk" hate on the big bad rich business guys that'll be able to afford the UPX fares lol. Just a comedic observation. (Note: I understand the greater issue at hand )
)TOareaFan
Superstar
The UPX issue has almost turned into an "us vs. them" issue, whereby all of us "normal folk" hate on the big bad rich business guys that'll be able to afford the UPX fares lol. Just a comedic observation. (Note: I understand the greater issue at hand
I think you are right....but I just don't see the need to twist facts or create bizarre senarios to support one position or the other.
andrewpmk
Senior Member
Obviously the UPX fares need to be lowered. Unfortunately, if you lowered the fares to a reasonable level ($2.65) then you would find that the trains are full of airport workers and Weston residents, and you would need longer trains. Not designing the UPX to be compatible with existing 12-car GO rolling stock was a poor decision.
TOareaFan
Superstar
If we are going to deem $2.65 as the reasonable fair for a direct, 18 hour a day, 15 minute frequency, "luxury" service to the airport then we really need to do something about that GO fare to across from the airport (Malton GO) of $6.35
innsertnamehere
Superstar
The UPX issue has almost turned into an "us vs. them" issue, whereby all of us "normal folk" hate on the big bad rich business guys that'll be able to afford the UPX fares lol. Just a comedic observation. (Note: I understand the greater issue at hand
... despite nobody knowing the fare yet. It could be anywhere from $10-$30, nobody really knows. People should complain once they release the fare price.
The service was never designed to be a regular GO service, it was designed to be a premium service airport shuttle, which is very common worldwide. it is for airport passengers, who are generally willing to spend $15 to get to the airport, considering they are about to hop on a $200-$2000 flight to somewhere on the planet. people need to realize that it isn't designed to be a regular old GO train service, it is something else that absolutely has a market for it. its silly to expect the service that will be provided to ever drop below $10.
The LRT to the airport isn't the same sort of service, the UPX will get you downtown in half the time as the LRT, and you won't have to spend an hour sitting on cramped TTC trains, but rather you get a nice comfortable leather seat with free wifi for 25 minutes. very few people who will pay the $10-$30 for the UPX will switch to the LRT once (if) it opens.
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denfromoakvillemilton
Senior Member
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We're talking about downgrading a premium service for the airport because the the bums at the MOT decided not to build the Eglinton line in full.
sixrings
Senior Member
Im happy with downgrading the UPX to a western DRL... Businesses arent going to stop doing business because their is no air port rail link. But congestion is a nightmare in the city and this would help at least the western side of the city.... Put a tolled/HOV lane on the gardiner and 427 and the suits can taxi it to pearson with no trouble.
Suits sounds like im bitter at people with money who should be able to afford to drive... I guess im more frustrated that this has great potential to be a transit miracle for next to nothing for our western half of the city and instead of thousands of people using it we will have maybe hundreds. Toronto is in a grid lock crisis and it needs as much transit available to as many people as possible.
Suits sounds like im bitter at people with money who should be able to afford to drive... I guess im more frustrated that this has great potential to be a transit miracle for next to nothing for our western half of the city and instead of thousands of people using it we will have maybe hundreds. Toronto is in a grid lock crisis and it needs as much transit available to as many people as possible.
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TFC
Active Member
I think this is pretty bang on.
We'll have to wait and see whether the UPX will turn out as predicted, both in terms of ridership and the removal of car trips between downtown and YYZ.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
a train with 15 minute service can''t act as a DRL.. or really anything that operates on mixed rail like the UPX does. people seem to be under the impression that the UPX is simply a subway but with fancier seats and all you have to do is switch out the seats to make it a proper DRL. You are looking at several billion minimum to convert it, just years after spending half a billion to open it. you would essentially have to replace almost every single piece of infrastructure that was built for it if you want to change it to a a TTC subway service..
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sixrings
Senior Member
they can run more frequent trains if they converted it.... once every 5 mins would do..... And I wouldnt be so frustrated IF Eglinton was getting a full line to the airport. give me a complete Eglinton line and I wont be so upset.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
^ 5 minute frequencies aren't even possible as the UPX has to cross over tracks at union to get to its stop, and having it cross over every 2.5 minutes would screw over the Barrie, Milton, and Kitchener GO services.
sixrings
Senior Member
Are we saying there is no possible work around that we could throw money at to fix it? Again wheres my eglinton to the airport line?