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Metrolinx: Bombardier Flexity Freedom & Alstom Citadis Spirit LRVs

W. K. Lis said:
Toronto's Transit City was to get 184 Bombardier Flexity Freedom light rail vehicles.

Does anyone know the numbers that ION, Peel's Hurontario, etc. might require of the same Flexity Freedom light rail vehicles?
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Metrolinx contracted Bombardier for 182 LRVs. 76 for Eglinton, 23 for Finch West, 35 for Sheppard East, and 48 for the SRT.

Waterloo's order of 14 cars (with an option of 14 more) is in addition to the 182 Metrolinx LRVs and 204 TTC LRVs (which is confirmed by Bombardier in the 2013 press release, where they note that the total number now ordered is 400).

The original TTC order was for 204 cars, with an option for 400 more. In 2010 TTC assigned the option for 300 of 400 of these vehicles to Metrolinx, who then ordered 182, retaining an option for another 118. Presumably the 28 Waterloo (order+option) comes the Metrolinx assignment, leaving Metrolinx with an option for an additional 90 vehicles (and TTC with an option for an additional 100 vehicles).

The question is how many vehicles they need for Hurontario. I don't see a direct number, but the EA notes that the storage facility will "accommodate up to 56
LRVs initially, and 74 over the long term."

So if they have 56 vehicles on Hurontario, they can use all 48 of the SRT cars, and will have to add at least another 8 vehicles to the order.
 
I wonder if they've started procurement of long-lead items or building the chassis yet. I assume they'll build Waterloo's trains first, then continue with the Eglinton order. Waterloo is scheduled to take delivery of the first train just over a year from now.
 
Duck said:
I wonder if they've started procurement of long-lead items or building the chassis yet. I assume they'll build Waterloo's trains first, then continue with the Eglinton order. Waterloo is scheduled to take delivery of the first train just over a year from now.
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The far more interesting question is what company will be supplying the rolling stock. Yes, Bombardier won the contract but they're in the process of selling it.

It matters because if the buyer thinks Bombardiers designs were crap, getting replacement parts more than a decade from now may be difficult.
 
rbt said:
The far more interesting question is what company will be supplying the rolling stock. Yes, Bombardier won the contract but they're in the process of selling it
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Sorry, what?
I don't recall reading anything to that effect. Could you please provide a source for that? (Even if the source is "insider info"/"baseless rumor" here on this forum)
 
Markster said:
Sorry, what?
I don't recall reading anything to that effect. Could you please provide a source for that? (Even if the source is "insider info"/"baseless rumor" here on this forum)
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I think it may be in reference to last week's rumours/speculation (denied by the company) that Bombardier was looking to either sell or spin off part of their rail division.
 
Markster said:
Sorry, what?
I don't recall reading anything to that effect. Could you please provide a source for that? (Even if the source is "insider info"/"baseless rumor" here on this forum)
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They're struggling for cash to finish their CS100/CS300 aircraft.

One of the solutions being looked is spinning off (IPO) their railway manufacturing.

The google search "bombardier selling rail" has numerous options.


http://business.financialpost.com/n...ith-ubs-citigroup-on-sale-or-ipo-of-rail-unit
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repo...ons-for-rail-business-report/article23875363/
 
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TOareaFan said:
the bolded part is a long way from "in the process of selling it."
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How do you figure? When you give bankers a stack of documentation to ask their clients how much they would pay for a department, that's pretty far down the process of selling it off.

In fact, the documentation for getting a decent valuation is probably the biggest step in an IPO. The actual IPO itself is a couple hours negotiations, signing the contract, then getting majority shareholders to approve of it (trivial in this case).

Of course, being "in the process of" doesn't mean it'll actually happen.
 
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I keep nagging @BombardierRail on Twitter to tell us what's going on or if the design has even been finalized. :) Very eager to see the trains come together. I know it sounds ridiculous, but I'm anxious to know if door chimes (both open and closed) can be selected by the customer. I've always loved the Bombardier Mk VI monorail door-open chimes and hoped there would be some kind of local competition here where I could suggest that ours have the same. :). I really hope it won't just be a loud beep or buzzer.

[video=youtube;1k8iWnXAikE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k8iWnXAikE[/video]

(I fully appreciate that in all likelihood, it'll be the same as whatever the Crosstown gets... Which will likely be exactly what the new Streetcars have - beep on open, 3-time descending chime on close.)
 
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rbt said:
How do you figure? When you give bankers a stack of documentation to ask their clients how much they would pay for a department, that's pretty far down the process of selling it off.

In fact, the documentation for getting a decent valuation is probably the biggest step in an IPO. The actual IPO itself is a couple hours negotiations, signing the contract, then getting majority shareholders to approve of it (trivial in this case).

Of course, being "in the process of" doesn't mean it'll actually happen.
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I know companies that engage I-bankers many years before they actually go public......and some who engage I-bankers and never go public .....some do it as a fact finding mission "if we did 'this' how much would it get us"? sort of exercise.
 
TOareaFan said:
I know companies that engage I-bankers many years before they actually go public......and some who engage I-bankers and never go public .....some do it as a fact finding mission "if we did 'this' how much would it get us"? sort of exercise.
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Yep. Bombardier has enough cash for at least 18 months. Our tram contract is something like 30 years long (parts component).
 
rbt said:
Yep. Bombardier has enough cash for at least 18 months. Our tram contract is something like 30 years long (parts component).
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And before the end of the 18 months cash flow changes as money starts coming in for CS jets as opposed a one way flow out for development of the CS Jet program.....how the balance shifts (ie. do sales pick up once they are in service?) is important...but their recent refinancing can see them through the current heavy development phase....just a question of what is the best value (as it relates to looking at the rail division).
 
Duck said:
I keep nagging @BombardierRail on Twitter to tell us what's going on or if the design has even been finalized. :) Very eager to see the trains come together. I know it sounds ridiculous, but I'm anxious to know if door chimes (both open and closed) can be selected by the customer. I've always loved the Bombardier Mk VI monorail door-open chimes and hoped there would be some kind of local competition here where I could suggest that ours have the same. :). I really hope it won't just be a loud beep or buzzer.

[video=youtube;1k8iWnXAikE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k8iWnXAikE[/video]

(I fully appreciate that in all likelihood, it'll be the same as whatever the Crosstown gets... Which will likely be exactly what the new Streetcars have - beep on open, 3-time descending chime on close.)
Click to expand...

The LRTs will be using the same chime that the TTC and GO uses. I can guarantee it.
 
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