King of Kensington
Senior Member
So if you're priced out of Baby Point, why would you opt for Riverdale as an "affordable" (sic.) alternative, if High Park is right there?
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Is the west side of Toronto more prominent than the east side?
- Thread starter denfromoakvillemilton
- Start date
So if you're priced out of Baby Point, why would you opt for Riverdale as an "affordable" (sic.) alternative, if High Park is right there?
freshcutgrass
Senior Member
Isn't Rosedale in the East end?
Rosedale is neither...it's midtown....where the real cheesecake is.
freshcutgrass
Senior Member
????????
King of Kensington
Senior Member
No, no, no! North Toronto is now our "midtown." I have no idea what Bloor to St. Clair is supposed to be now.
More seriously, I don't know why we still have no problem sticking to the west end and east end of Old Toronto, but midtown gets "shifted" to North Toronto and North Toronto apparently to North York. When people say east end, they generally mean something like Riverdale or the Beaches, not Scarborough. When they say west end, they mean Parkdale or the Junction, not Etobicoke.
Anyway Rosedale is not in the "east end" and has never been referred to as such.
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freshcutgrass
Senior Member
AFAIC, the former boroughs have never entered into this conversation. Historically (or at least the 20th century), the gentry always lived in houses and never apartments, and in the central city (Bathurst to Bayview), north of Bloor. You know the old saying....the rich travel north-south and poor travel east-west.
WislaHD
Superstar
The 'new' Midtown and North Toronto are the same thing. I guess Deer Park, Moore Park and St. Clair can be considered the southern part of a broader understanding of Midtown seeing as they are in the St. Paul's riding. Summerhill and Rosedale are kind of caught in between.
North York City Centre is now "uptown" I guess, with North York being the rest of the former borough. Where does this leave the real uptown at Bloor-Yonge? Hell if I know. I've begun calling the whole area "Yorkville" (if not "Bloor-Yonge") for simplicity sake.
Truth is, I've seen shops with the name "Uptown" and "Midtown" both at Bloor-Yonge and Eglinton-Yonge. Likewise, I've seen "Uptown" store names in North York. All that this proves is that these names are not set in stone like in other cities.
Depends on your perspective. Speaking to a lot of commuters from the 905 at school, they consider Parkdale and Riverdale alike as "downtown". Scarborough and Etobicoke may as well be the east and west end to them.
If you ask me, their perspective is wrong.
But it goes back to how these names are really not set in stone in the first place.
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King of Kensington
Senior Member
Moore Park is in the same riding as Rosedale, not St. Paul's.
What about the basically suburban North Toronto neighborhoods in Eglinton-Lawrence and Don Valley West like Lawrence Park and Lytton Park? Surely these aren't "Midtown" as well. Have they been "shifted" to North York?
Not that the downtown and midtown have to be contiguous. Maybe Yonge-Eg is a midtown or secondary CBD? But what to call the rest then?
King of Kensington
Senior Member
Depends on your perspective. Speaking to a lot of commuters from the 905 at school, they consider Parkdale and Riverdale alike as "downtown". Scarborough and Etobicoke may as well be the east and west end to them.
If you ask me, their perspective is wrong.
I love how you can travel 7 or 8 km from the CBD to the Beaches or Bloor West Village and still be "right downtown."
WislaHD
Superstar
I don't know. I was canvassing in these areas during the election. I don't think Lytton and Lawrence Park are so far gone (still largely streetcar suburbs) but areas like Bedford Park and Lytton Park west of Avenue Road are so suburban they may as well be in some other place like North York.
I think that the historic boundaries and terms don't hold up to 21st century Toronto. Maybe we should be rethinking the way we determine Toronto regions. One of those ways might be a Midtown CBD at Yonge-Eglinton. If Yonge-Eglinton CBD is a thing, doesn't that make NYCC one too?
Hell, with the way Yonge-Finch and in the future, Yonge-Steeles is set to develop, we might have to consider Yonge Street as the world's longest, thinnest downtown.
King of Kensington
Senior Member
Well, this discussion inspired the first post on my blog. Thanks everyone!
http://southofbloorstreet.blogspot.ca/2015/09/why-east-end-developed-later-than-west.html
http://southofbloorstreet.blogspot.ca/2015/09/why-east-end-developed-later-than-west.html
King of Kensington
Senior Member
Another difference between the west and east historically is that the west was more multicultural working class and the east was almost entirely working class anglos. This was certainly the pattern from about 1910-1970. I guess it started to break down with Greek immigrants moved to the Danforth area (not sure what attracted them there in particular) and the emergence of the second Chinatown in the late 1970s or so. This pattern has of course totally broken down, as Scarborough became very multicultural in the 1980s.
ksun
Senior Member
One street doesn't make a "downtown". Yonge st also has many stretches that are devoid of a real urban vibe. Check out Yonge between Lawrence and Sheppard (1/3 of Yonge st in Toronto) before calling it anything "downtown".
Even at Yonge a Sheppard, the layout of the street is more suburban than urban. There are very few retail on the street and the lack of pedestrian life is quite obvious. A few highrise condos don't make an area downtown. Yonge's vibrancy pretty much died a few blocks north of Eglinton, and with significant gaps between St Clair and Davisville. Queen is probably more urban than Yonge in general.
King of Kensington
Senior Member
Agree with this. Yonge-Sheppard is way too far away and even between Bloor and Eglinton there's too many gaps.
King of Kensington
Senior Member
Returning to the thread topic, Antonia Zerbisias (an east ender) notes the following differences: the east end was developed more with the car in mind (wider streets) and that there was more detached working class housing.
smably
Senior Member
Toronto Life has a piece on how almost all the buzzed-about restaurants are west of Yonge: http://torontolife.com/food/restaurants-dish/toronto-more-restaurants-west-east-end/
Of course, as many of the comments point out, opening a restaurant in the east end also means you'll probably be ignored by TL and the like, who seem to think Toronto ends at the Don.
Of course, as many of the comments point out, opening a restaurant in the east end also means you'll probably be ignored by TL and the like, who seem to think Toronto ends at the Don.