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Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

The show was nothing special. They didn't go into enough detail in my opinion. And I don't think they focused enough on the real problem - too much politics in transit. But I suppose it was good for the layman to get a brief overview of the issue.

Some interesting moments:
Global was building excitement to the big and cheap solution to our transit woes that was thought up by a U of T professor. Silly me expected that the idea would be something new and visionary. Something never proposed before. What was it?... Using the rail corridors for the DRL. I've only heard that a million times. :rolleyes:

At the end of the report, Leslie Roberts mentioned that Global invited Karen Stintz and Glen Murray to join a transit panel. Murrays response was that he'll never be on the same panel with Karen Stintz. That really sums up what transit planning has come to in this city.
 
TheTigerMaster said:
The show was nothing special. They didn't go into enough detail in my opinion. And I don't think they focused enough on the real problem - too much politics in transit. But I suppose it was good for the layman to get a brief overview of the issue.

Some interesting moments:
Global was building excitement to the big and cheap solution to our transit woes that was thought up by a U of T professor. Silly me expected that the idea would be something new and visionary. Something never proposed before. What was it?... Using the rail corridors for the DRL. I've only heard that a million times. :rolleyes:

At the end of the report, Leslie Roberts mentioned that Global invited Karen Stintz and Glen Murray to join a transit panel. Murrays response was that he'll never be on the same panel with Karen Stintz. That really sums up what transit planning has come to in this city.
Click to expand...

Heard there is going to be a big announcement today about transit. What's the latest?
 
TTC report could kill subway plan

http://nowtoronto.com/news/story.cfm?content=194431

.....

On Wednesday morning, TTC chair Karen Stintz told reporters at Queen’s Park that at its September 24 25 board meeting, the commission will debate a report highlighting cost issues and “serious technical flaws” with Transportation Minister Glen Murray’s preferred subway option.

- “When the TTC tables its report and outlines in detail the technical flaws and the financial shortfalls of this plan, I think it will become obvious to my colleagues, to Queen’s Park, and to all parties, that there’s only one feasible plan,” Stintz said.
Instead of Murray’s proposal, the TTC chair is backing the four-stop extension of the Bloor-Danforth line council voted for in July. It would go all the way to Sheppard, where it would link up with a planned LRT line.

- TTC spokesperson Brad Ross would not reveal details of the report that will go before the board next week. He said it’s still being worked on by the transit authority’s expansion department and won’t be released until Monday at the earliest. But it’s likely to depict Murray’s proposed alignment as highly problematic and potentially costly.


.....
 
..."I think it will become obvious to my colleagues, to Queen’s Park, and to all parties, that there’s only one feasible plan"

How naive of me to think she meant the LRT plan. Nope, she's talking about the unfunded subway pipedream.
 
So what does Stinz do when the Feds don't come up with 600 million? Already the province's contribution will be about $400 million short.
 
Adjei said:
So what does Stinz do when the Feds don't come up with 600 million? Already the province's contribution will be about $400 million short.
Click to expand...
Who the hell knows anymore? It's pretty clear the city's current support plan will revert to the LRT at the end of the month and I would argue there's a slim chance of council endorsing Murray's current alignment. Yet, the province keeps saying it wants to go it alone (while still expecting the city to pay sunk costs no less) but there's legal ramifications because of the signed master agreement.
 
datamouse said:
Who the hell knows anymore? It's pretty clear the city's current support plan will revert to the LRT at the end of the month and I would argue there's a slim chance of council endorsing Murray's current alignment. Yet, the province keeps saying it wants to go it alone (while still expecting the city to pay sunk costs no less) but there's legal ramifications because of the signed master agreement.
Click to expand...

At this point I'm not even sure if the province is bluffing about going it alone. Initially I thought they were bluffing, but they seem dead serious. But this may all be part of their brilliant plan to "scare" Council back onto the right plan. Any opinions?

And remember that Toronto is just a creature of the province. Ontario can do anything it likes to this city with a stroke of a pen. They could certainly make Toronto pay the sunk costs if they wanted to, but that would certainly be an extreme and ill advised action.
 
TheTigerMaster said:
At the end of the report, Leslie Roberts mentioned that Global invited Karen Stintz and Glen Murray to join a transit panel. Murrays response was that he'll never be on the same panel with Karen Stintz. That really sums up what transit planning has come to in this city.
Click to expand...

There must be some real political calculus going on here. Toronto is no longer the Liberal safehaven it used to be, and this kind of arrogance isn't a constructive way to keep it red. I'm guessing they are hoping that their "tough stance" on Toronto will appeal to rural voters, while the fact that he supports a subway makes him look good to ignorant Toronto voters.

Personally at this point I will take Murray's plan over Stintz's. Both have their pros and cons, but Murray's plan at least has the money to go ahead.

OOC, while the last thing we need is yet another transit plan, has the city or province ever hired a planning consultant or group to here what certified experts have to say about how to proceed? Let the planners do the planning, and let the politicians help give their constituents a voice as to ensure that it meets their needs.
 
The LRT is the best plan, but I prefer Murray's subway, but it just needs a connection to Sheppard, even if it cuts up to it directly east of STC.
 
OOC, while the last thing we need is yet another transit plan, has the city or province ever hired a planning consultant or group to here what certified experts have to say about how to proceed?
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Does Metrolinx count? Before Murray hijacked them they were fully in support of the LRT plan.
 
This whole Scarborough subway fiasco reminds of of when Ontario forced the TTC to use ICTS on the SRT rather than the ALRVs against the advice of the Commission and experts. Apparently Ontario wanted to use the SRT as the poster child for the "success" of ICTS technology. If we had stuck to the ALRVs we wouldnt be in this mess. Poor Scarborough seems like a magnet for bad transit planning.
 
The ICTS would have been better as an Etobicoke RT starting where the first phase would be Kipling to the Airport, and they probably would have kept it as RT.
 
Murray is tweeting today that they will get more stations for the same money:

@glen4ont said:
@moore_oliver 3 stations between SCT and Kennedy now likely same # but not final. Mtl has very different technology. Rubber wheels etc
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Keep in mind this is the same Glen Murray that last week tweeted to me that "many" GO lines have all day two way train service. ;)
 
Different technology? So if I'm underatanding correctly that means is that this subway extension will probably be incompatible with the rest of our heavy rail network

Edit: ignore that. He was talking about the Montreal Metro.
 
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