Canada to deport U.S. army deserter

[Mot]

http://www.thestar.com/article/428269


Canada to deport U.S. army deserter
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May 21, 2008 12:36 PM
THE CANADIAN PRESS

Ottawa has decided that an American soldier who fled the army over the Iraq war will not face the risk of abuse or mistreatment if returned to the U.S.

That means Corey Glass can now be deported to the United States, where he faces possible jail time for desertion.

Glass, of Fairmount, Ind., was a sergeant in military intelligence who spent five months in Iraq.

Based on what he saw and did there, he decided the war was illegal and decided he couldn't go back.

He spent seven months in hiding before seeking asylum in Canada, which he knew had been sympathetic to Vietnam draft dodgers.

Glass, who lives in Toronto, maintains that when he signed up for the U.S. National Guard, he thought he was joining a humanitarian organization.


I admit I am biased, let him stay![/COLOR]

 

[Mot]

hmmm. no other opinions on this one????

 

[fiendishlibrarian]

"Glass, who lives in Toronto, maintains that when he signed up for the U.S. National Guard, he thought he was joining a humanitarian organization."

If for nothing else, he should be deported for being an utter moron.

 

[Hydrogen]

National Guard troops have served in Korea, Vietnam and the first Iraq war. It's hard to believe anyone could have confused them with a strictly humanitarian organization like, for example, the Red Cross.

 

[Admiral Beez]

If a Canadian soldier deserted and fled to the US, I'd expect the US to turn him over to us pronto. Conscription is gone, you should know that once you've signed up for military service, there's no going back, and no talking back or deciding not to serve. That doesn't mean that you have to willingly engage in Mai Lai type attrocities, but if the army's going to Iraq, then that's where you're going.

Sometimes whole units give up the fight, such as HMCS Uganda, which voted itself out of WW2.

 

[BuildTO]

You have to realize that these people were lied to, and the US army reserves the right to do so. A lot of the deserters have similar stories. The enlisted because many come from places where there are no other jobs (what is referred to as the "Economic Draft"), and the army appears to be the only way they can get an education and health care (and no one should need the US health care issue explained to them). They asked for desk jobs, or jobs which would not take them into combat. They were all assured this would be no problem. Corey Glass wanted to help rebuild New Orleans. All of these people joined because, misguided or not, they thought they were doing something good; they wanted to help their country, or help others. For those who went to Iraq, the stories are beyond awful. They will have to live with what they saw, and what they were ordered to do.

That these people are facing jail time and a bad conduct discharge means they face a bleak future in which no one will want to hire them once their jail time is up.

You can be smug about knowing more than they did when they enlisted; in fact, some of them do admit now to having been stupid or naive. But that does not mean they deserve to be deported to a country which continues an illegal war and turns a blind eye to torture and war crimes.

 

[BuildTO]

That doesn't mean that you have to willingly engage in Mai Lai type attrocities

Actually, it does, if those are your orders. As a soldier, you are not allowed to refuse orders. That's one of the reasons why so many have deserted.

I believe the current estimate of the number of deserters in the Iraq is up to 25,000 in the US. In Canada, we have more than a dozen who have taken their cases public, but there are many more who are underground.

 

[Brandon716]

You have to realize that these people were lied to, and the US army reserves the right to do so. A lot of the deserters have similar stories. The enlisted because many come from places where there are no other jobs (what is referred to as the "Economic Draft"), and the army appears to be the only way they can get an education and health care (and no one should need the US health care issue explained to them). They asked for desk jobs, or jobs which would not take them into combat. They were all assured this would be no problem. Corey Glass wanted to help rebuild New Orleans. All of these people joined because, misguided or not, they thought they were doing something good; they wanted to help their country, or help others. For those who went to Iraq, the stories are beyond awful. They will have to live with what they saw, and what they were ordered to do.

That these people are facing jail time and a bad conduct discharge means they face a bleak future in which no one will want to hire them once their jail time is up.

You can be smug about knowing more than they did when they enlisted; in fact, some of them do admit now to having been stupid or naive. But that does not mean they deserve to be deported to a country which continues an illegal war and turns a blind eye to torture and war crimes.

Kim, you would be either amused and disgusted, or maybe just simply outraged if I took you to the local high schools where I grew up and the lengths the US military branches use to get people to sign up.

I'm rather lucky because my father is a civil engineer, my mother a secretary both with solid state jobs and never had to deal with the same types of economic uncertainty many people I grew up around had to endure. Even still, they were very hard on me by calling incessantly when I was between 17-20 years of age.

The recruiters approach every transaction as a business decision, as if its a way to start a real career. They emphasize how many people go through the military to become scientists, doctors, etc. They use it as a stepping stone, many times posing that you can work behind desks in non-combat jobs. They regularly emphasize that the majority of military jobs are non-combat service like office work, but fail to explain most of those jobs are usually contracted out and aren't even really military.

The lengths these people use to lure young, naive, ill-educated, poor, money-needy kids into a servitude they have no choice in is a disgusting industry IMO.

 

[BuildTO]

Last night I bought this book. The synopsis alone gives you some idea of the issues:

The Deserter's Tale
The Story of an Ordinary Soldier Who Walked Away from the War in Iraq
Joshua Key as told to Lawrence Hill


In this first-ever memoir from a young US soldier who participated for eight months in the war in Iraq and then fled to Canada, Joshua Key offers a vivid and damning indictment of how the war is being waged.

Joshua Key is a husband and father from a conservative background who enlisted in the army to lift his family out of poverty. A year later, President George W. Bush ordered the invasion of Iraq and Key was sent to Ramadi. The war he found there was not the campaign against terrorists and "evildoers" he had been told to expect. Key saw Iraqi civilians beaten, maimed, and shot for little or no provocation. He witnessed the killing of a seven-year-old girl who was scrounging leftover army rations, and watched while the dead bodies of Iraqis provided sport for US soldiers. When Key was sent home on leave he knew he could not return to the war. He went underground, finally seeking asylum in Canada. His case is now before the Canadian courts.

In clear-eyed, compelling prose crafted with the help of award-winning Canadian novelist and journalist Lawrence Hill, The Deserter's Tale tells the story of a man who went into the war believing unquestioningly in his government and who was transformed into a person who ethically, morally, and physically could no longer serve his country.

 

[BuildTO]

Brandon! I was just telling somebody your story last night! I remembered you saying the recruiters wouldn't stop bothering you in high school.

 

[Brandon716]

Surprised you remember my story that well! But its certainly true.

Its not just the poor youth that fall for it, really its anyone with a big heart and wants to help who is given a falsified story from any recruiter. I can easily see New Orleans or other national tragedies being used by these people as causes to sign people up.

Think of you being 16 or 18, yearning for independence to be away from mom and dad, even if they have economic certainty. All of a sudden you are approached from a recruiter who talks about it as a job, a career path. Get a guaranteed job with guaranteed income (especially in these uncertain times), get guaranteed health benefit (which in the US is always an uncertainty even if you have insurance half the time).

Its a dream come true, and a dream that really isn't reality. They usually shortchange the lower rank soldiers, give them a pittance of benefits, and they require a lot out of them that they never signed up for.

Tragedy in many, many ways!

 

[Observer Walt]

Sorry, I have little sympathy. During Vietnam, when a draft was in effect, good principled people objected and came to Canada, with many of them thinking at the time that they would never be able to return home. I could respect those people. I don't have the same respect at all for those who volunteer, knowing very well what the military is all about (in spite of this guy's ridiculous claim that he didn't know).

It's OK to take the medical coverage, educational opportunities, etc., but the flip side of that coin is that when you are told to go to war, you go. If you don't know that, right from Day One, then you are, as fiendish says, a moron.

 

[BuildTO]

I just watched the press conference for Corey Glass on Youtube. He was told the only way he would be in combat were if there were foreign troops occupying the US!

 

[Hydrogen]

You have to realize that these people were lied to, and the US army reserves the right to do so. A lot of the deserters have similar stories. The enlisted because many come from places where there are no other jobs (what is referred to as the "Economic Draft"), and the army appears to be the only way they can get an education and health care (and no one should need the US health care issue explained to them). They asked for desk jobs, or jobs which would not take them into combat. They were all assured this would be no problem. Corey Glass wanted to help rebuild New Orleans. All of these people joined because, misguided or not, they thought they were doing something good; they wanted to help their country, or help others. For those who went to Iraq, the stories are beyond awful. They will have to live with what they saw, and what they were ordered to do.

That these people are facing jail time and a bad conduct discharge means they face a bleak future in which no one will want to hire them once their jail time is up.

You can be smug about knowing more than they did when they enlisted; in fact, some of them do admit now to having been stupid or naive. But that does not mean they deserve to be deported to a country which continues an illegal war and turns a blind eye to torture and war crimes.

I would have to agree with the sentiment that if one joins an explicitly military organization - one that has a history of participating in conflicts on foreign soil - then one should not be surprised if they are required to serve in such a conflict when it arises. It has nothing to do with being smug.

If people join the military to get an education or health care, they do it as a bargain with the understanding that what they are joining is an explicitly military organization. If they did not understand this they only have themselves to blame. These people are adults and have a responsibility to inform themselves properly. That responsibility belongs to them as they are the individuals making the choice.

I am quite certain that there was more than one option available for a person who wanted to work at rebuilding New Orleans. In fact, I don't think the National Guard plays a direct role in that reconstruction. It is a touch naive to use this desire as an excuse to neglect or reject the duties that they were knowingly accepting.

These individuals wanted to believe that they could be selective about how they could help their country while in the military. But the military is simply the wrong organization in which to expect that you can choose what you will or will not do in the event that a civilian government pursues military action.

That being said, I have no quibble with their personal act of conscience; that too is a intimately personal decision, and should be an informed decision. But there is a price to be paid for actions based on conscience in such circumstances, because there are other individuals and other lives involved, and here too, these particular individuals who have chosen to desert their accepted responsibilities will have to put up with the consequences of having made that decision.

 

[BuildTO]

During Vietnam, when a draft was in effect, good principled people objected and came to Canada

... which is exactly what is happening now.

I don't have the same respect at all for those who volunteer, knowing very well what the military is all about (in spite of this guy's ridiculous claim that he didn't know)

Clearly you didn't read the posts above, or you simply have a closed mind and are not willing to actually learn what the war resisters campaign is all about. Why is Corey's claim "ridiculous", as you say? I've hear him speak twice in two days about his situation. What do you know about him that I don't?

These men and women volunteered to defend their country. They have been horrified to find themselves forced into a war of aggression.

Canada has a long and proud history, internationally, as a peace-loving and peacekeeping nation. We sheltered slaves and Vietnam draft dodgers. Now, under Stephen Harper, we are about to play Bush's pawn and refuse to shelter conscientious objectors to a war that the international community has deemed illegal.

Why are we, as Canadians, ok with this? Is this how we want to be seen around the world? Is this the new image we want for ourselves?