Waterfront Transit Reset Phase 1 Study

[Admiral Beez]

20 years ago I had a motorcycle and remember all along the lake here were just empty dusty parking lots that I'd ride around in. Here's some pictures of my bike in those lots back in 2006.

Nice. Here's mine. 1969 Triumph T100S. Just look at how undeveloped the waterfront is here.

 

[Leo_Chan]

If we implement in stages we COULD see an east-west extension in use while work is still going on with the tunnel and the loop.

Watch the Yonge Street portal and wye only start construction after the entire surface portion is complete and no service for years on near completed infrastructure.

 

[Amare]

Another thing that some are forgetting here is that the Bay Teamway (both the west and east) will have to be hacked up as part of this project.

So let's enjoy the east side of the Bay teamway while it's in it's current nice state.

 

[dougtoronto]

I wonder, does Waterfront Toronto have any experience delivering rapid transit? Were they the ones in charge of the QQW revamp? Will be curious to examine how the provision of transit by Metrolinx vs TTC vs Waterfront Toronto works our for the city.

 

[TRONto]

The best governance and impact on Toronto these past couple decades has been Waterfront Toronto. I have more confidence in them then any other organization here.

 

[christiesplits]

The best governance and impact on Toronto these past couple decades has been Waterfront Toronto. I have more confidence in them then any other organization here.

I agree. They've had some misses - the mediocre Waterfront Innovation Centre comes to mind - but by in large they are a well-run organization that I would entrust with building transit over MLX or TTC in a heartbeat.

 

[drum118]

I wonder, does Waterfront Toronto have any experience delivering rapid transit? Were they the ones in charge of the QQW revamp? Will be curious to examine how the provision of transit by Metrolinx vs TTC vs Waterfront Toronto works our for the city.

Yes.
They play a role in building QQW with TTC help as well Cherry St

They already have the design done for QQE other than the embankment that is held up by ML.

The wye connection is held up some what unit the new alignment for the Gardiner gets built at Cherry St

 

[ssiguy2]

Again, what is the timeline for this project both start date and completion?

 

[DSCToronto]

Another thing that some are forgetting here is that the Bay Teamway (both the west and east) will have to be hacked up as part of this project.

So let's enjoy the east side of the Bay teamway while it's in it's current nice state.

Why? the streetcar loop iand the tunnel are below ground. They MAY do cut & cover on Bay Street itself but I assume they will work underground once they are below the rail berm.

 

[drum118]

Again, what is the timeline for this project both start date and completion?

How can you ask that question when funds only surface days ago and not all design work is done?? You cannot drop a dime and say this is the timeframe.

Will it be done in Phases and opening as they are completed or once everything is done?? We know Cherry St extension cannot happen until all of OL is fully completed there to build the tunnel and what year will that Be??

Going by last projected dates, you are looking at 2031-35. I stand behind my recommendations of 2019 that the east-west line open as soon as it can and leave it to TTC to get the tunnel and loop done ASP to get back into service.

Will the city revisit the plan for Bay St and do both things at the same time??

 

[IRT_BMT_IND]

This thread only highlights what a boneheaded decision it was not to expand the loop in the 2010s when the waterfront streetcars were disrupted for years and the subway station was already being reconstructed (even if it only one half was actually finished and put into service for the 510 and 509, with the other half having the structure roughed in, but without tracks or station finishes). And it wouldn't have been overkill, the current loop can barely handle the existing traffic in the summers and the 510/509 can't layover properly since they share one track.

 

[lastcommodore]

Why? the streetcar loop iand the tunnel are below ground. They MAY do cut & cover on Bay Street itself but I assume they will work underground once they are below the rail berm.

the video by city of toronot shows it will be cut and cover and done in several stages, rather than a cover and cut

I do not know for sure if the teamways will be temporarily put out of service.

 

[drum118]

This thread only highlights what a boneheaded decision it was not to expand the loop in the 2010s when the waterfront streetcars were disrupted for years and the subway station was already being reconstructed (even if it only one half was actually finished and put into service for the 510 and 509, with the other half having the structure roughed in, but without tracks or station finishes). And it wouldn't have been overkill, the current loop can barely handle the existing traffic in the summers and the 510/509 can't layover properly since they share one track.

It is not that straight forward as you stated to put some platforms into service and work around crews working on the other areas unless you have construction been done overnight and weekends. How long will that take doing it is a small widow for construction?

The loop is only part of the work that has to be done. Both tunnels need rebuilding to bring them up to today fire code standards that will see the base lower along with other work. We know the east side of the loop is mostly ready to expand it, but no one knows what is behind the west side area until it is open along with any surprises that may change the design or rework the design, QQ station has to be rebuilt with more than one elevator per side opposite to TTC thinking.

You are looking at a minimum of 3-5 years to do Bay St and the loop

 

[ARG1]

Question about that $3B, is that before or after they gutted the plans for Queens Quay Station? I recall it was a year ago (maybe 2) that the designers decided to cut the plan to expand the platforms at QQ to handle 2 Flexities as a cost saving measure, so I'm curious if this new funding includes the expansion or not.

 

[Amare]

Why? the streetcar loop iand the tunnel are below ground. They MAY do cut & cover on Bay Street itself but I assume they will work underground once they are below the rail berm.

They'll have to get under it to expand the streetcar platforms somehow. One way or another, they will have to hack it up (the degree to which is TBD).