VIA Rail

[Urban Sky]

??? The same as it is on railways that still have it. Some places call it a cafe.

I'm surprised you've never seen it before elsewhere!

I‘ve seen „Café“, „Bistro“, „Restaurant“, „Snack Corner“, „Buffet Cars“, „Parlour Cars“ and „Lounge Cars“ as references to passenger rail cars with food service, but never „canteen“. Maybe I was just unlucky, but Googling the term didn‘t yield any results for me.

In any case, on-train food facilities are on a retreat everywhere in the world and have already been completely abolished in Japan, because of the low net-revenues-per-square-foot they offer compared with just offering more seats.

I assume you refer to whatever VIA offered before switching to at-the-seat service, but weren’t these called „buffet cars“ and abolished like in the early 1990s?

 

[nfitz]

I‘ve seen „Café“, „Bistro“, „Restaurant“, „Snack Corner“, „Buffet Cars“, „Parlour Cars“ and „Lounge Cars“ as references to passenger rail cars with food service, but never „canteen“. Maybe I was just unlucky, but Googling the term didn‘t yield any results for me.

I've never quite got a buffet car - as there's never a buffet there, that I've seen!

I'm not, of course, referring to the car, but the hole in the wall where they sold food. The car was generally called the "bar car" on VIA corridor services by the clientele; sometimes "club car". They may have called the hole in the wall something like "the snack counter" - branding was minimal.

Though elsewhere, the canteen (or cafe ... pretty sure they don't pronounce it café in English English) is just on a passenger car, taking relatively little space.

I'm not surprised that service is being degraded elsewhere as well.

 

[Bordercollie]

I've never quite got a buffet car - as there's never a buffet there, that I've seen!

I'm not, of course, referring to the car, but the hole in the wall where they sold food. The car was generally called the "bar car" on VIA corridor services by the clientele; sometimes "club car". They may have called the hole in the wall something like "the snack counter" - branding was minimal.

Though elsewhere, the canteen (or cafe ... pretty sure they don't pronounce it café in English English) is just on a passenger car, taking relatively little space.

I'm not surprised that service is being degraded elsewhere as well.

Amtrak brought them back for some trains. I hear the food is not bad....

But I'm sure they could offer simple sandwiches either cold or hot. I'm sure they would be able to partner with local restaurants and have smoked meat for trains to and from Montreal. Or a poutine (just stick everything in the oven to heat) type of thing, I don't expect to have them make real fries on the train.

Air Canada might be faster but the service is garbage. You need to give people a reason other than travel time to take the train.

 

[nfitz]

Air Canada might be faster but the service is garbage. You need to give people a reason other than travel time to take the train.

I was on Air Canada a couple of weeks ago, and they were a lot faster to bring me a sandwich than VIA (I was dying - I'd expected that you'd actually be able to buy food at Vancouver after you passed through security - but it was all closed, despite the airport being busy).

I'd been avoiding Air Canada for decades, for poor service. TBH, my last couple of pandemic round-trips with them have been great.

 

[kEiThZ]

In any case, on-train food facilities are on a retreat everywhere in the world and have already been completely abolished in Japan, because of the low net-revenues-per-square-foot they offer compared with just offering more seats.

Isn't Japan kind of a special case here? I presume most Japanese pax aren't spending > 3 hrs on a train. Also, the volume of pax they have allows for train stations to have proper meal services, allowing for their iconic Ekiban sales (largely sold to intercity pax).

 

[trebello]

I‘ve seen „Café“, „Bistro“, „Restaurant“, „Snack Corner“, „Buffet Cars“, „Parlour Cars“ and „Lounge Cars“ as references to passenger rail cars with food service, but never „canteen“. Maybe I was just unlucky, but Googling the term didn‘t yield any results for me.

In any case, on-train food facilities are on a retreat everywhere in the world and have already been completely abolished in Japan, because of the low net-revenues-per-square-foot they offer compared with just offering more seats.

I assume you refer to whatever VIA offered before switching to at-the-seat service, but weren’t these called „buffet cars“ and abolished like in the early 1990s?

A VIA staff member refered to the bar/lounge/dome car as a "canteen" when I was on the Candian (in economy) a few years ago and I was confused by what he meant (he had to clarify that he meant the snack car and not the restaurant car). I will say that the food offered in the "canteen" is suprisngly good. Not the fancy restraunt meals served further down the train, but hot food such as omletes and burgers were actually really good and a lot less expensive than what you'd get at the restaurant. They also don't seem to offer economy customers restuarant reservations anymore unless you specifically ask (I think they now want the resturant space used mainly for the sleeper passengers). It was around this time that they started offering better hot food options in the canteen. I'm not sure if the dome cars further down the train offer hot food options, as restuarant food is included for sleeper passengers.

 

[lead82]

The one point that everyone is missing in the discussion on choosing rail vs flying is that VIA rail in the corridor is almost never on time recently. The on time status is atrocious. Just checking todays Toronto - Montreal status and all the trains are delayed by 40-60mins. That makes a 5hr journey 6hrs. That is very slow and unless there is better service in economy or better wifi, the trip is not enjoyable or time competitive. Most would rather be on a plane. Even with delays, if flying within the corridor and avoiding YYZ, the train is not an option for business travel - being late for meetings and not enough frequency of trips.

The one thing that VIA should consider is making the experience at the status better. One is to simplify boarding at end stations. Why can’t I just board the train in Toronto and instead have to line up for a boarding check? In Europe they don’t check tickets before the train unless it’s a special train. Most checks are only done on the train. The other is better food options in economy. It’s atrocious. The airlines offer better paid options for continental flights. Certainly VIA can do better than cheese and crackers for 6hr journeys.

 

[lenaitch]

The one point that everyone is missing in the discussion on choosing rail vs flying is that VIA rail in the corridor is almost never on time recently. The on time status is atrocious. Just checking todays Toronto - Montreal status and all the trains are delayed by 40-60mins. That makes a 5hr journey 6hrs. That is very slow and unless there is better service in economy or better wifi, the trip is not enjoyable or time competitive. Most would rather be on a plane. Even with delays, if flying within the corridor and avoiding YYZ, the train is not an option for business travel - being late for meetings and not enough frequency of trips.

The one thing that VIA should consider is making the experience at the status better. One is to simplify boarding at end stations. Why can’t I just board the train in Toronto and instead have to line up for a boarding check? In Europe they don’t check tickets before the train unless it’s a special train. Most checks are only done on the train. The other is better food options in economy. It’s atrocious. The airlines offer better paid options for continental flights. Certainly VIA can do better than cheese and crackers for 6hr journeys.

Certainly not defending VIA, but I don't think Air Canada's on time performance has been all that stellar either. I did a quick scan of AC Toronto to Montreal flights for today and, of 20 posted, 9 were late and one was cancelled outright. Air Canada flights leading into and out of their main hubs, if they still exist at all, are invariably delayed or cancelled. Late for a meeting? Our daughter was a day late for a conference and only got there at all because she drove to our house and I drove her to Pearson. A colleague had five flights cancelled in a row.

 

[kEiThZ]

Certainly not defending VIA, but I don't think Air Canada's on time performance has been all that stellar either.

Yeah, but AC can be an hour late and still be faster than the train. And current problems are rather unique for AC and airlines and airports in general. Whereas VIA's poor OTP was there before COVID.

 

[AHK]

STRIKE AVERTED: VIA RAIL REACHES TENTATIVE AGREEMENTS​

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News provided by
VIA Rail Canada Inc.
Jul 12, 2022, 02:45 ET

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MONTRÉAL, July 12, 2022 /CNW Telbec/ - VIA Rail Canada (VIA Rail) has reached tentative agreements with Unifor's Council 4000 and Local 100, the union representing some 2,400 VIA Rail employees working in its stations, on board its trains, in its maintenance centres, the VIA Customer Centre, and administrative offices.

These tentative agreements are subject to a ratification vote by VIA Rail's Unifor members. Once ratified, the collective agreements will be retroactive to January 1, 2022, and in effect through December 31, 2024. Please note that details of the agreements will only be released following ratification by members.

"VIA Rail is pleased to have negotiated these agreements and recognizes the hard work of both parties during this process," said Martin R Landry, President and Chief Executive Officer. "We sympathize with the passengers and communities whose plans have been impacted in the past couple of days due to the uncertainty caused by this potential strike. As we look forward to ratification, these tentative agreements allow our teams to get back to doing what we do best: serving Canadians throughout the country."

VIA Rail regrets any uncertainties that the strike notice issued by the union may have caused. We want to reassure our passengers that as we await ratification operations will run as scheduled.

VIA Rail continues to offer customers the opportunity to make changes to their travel plans without service fees for any departures prior to July 31, 2022.

Please visit viarail.ca to modify your reservation or call 1 888 VIA-RAIL (1 888 842-7245), or our TTY service (for persons who are deaf or hard of hearing) 1 800 268-9503.

About VIA Rail
As Canada's national rail passenger service, VIA Rail (viarail.ca) and all its employees are mandated to provide safe, efficient and economical passenger transportation service, in both official languages of our country. VIA Rail operates intercity, regional and transcontinental trains linking over 400 communities across Canada, and about 180 more communities through intermodal partnerships, and safely transported over 5 million passengers in 2019. The Corporation has been awarded nine Safety Awards and three Environment Awards by the Railway Association of Canada since 2005. To learn more, visit the "About VIA Rail" section.

 

[roger1818]

The one point that everyone is missing in the discussion on choosing rail vs flying is that VIA rail in the corridor is almost never on time recently. The on time status is atrocious. Just checking todays Toronto - Montreal status and all the trains are delayed by 40-60mins. That makes a 5hr journey 6hrs. That is very slow and unless there is better service in economy or better wifi, the trip is not enjoyable or time competitive. Most would rather be on a plane. Even with delays, if flying within the corridor and avoiding YYZ, the train is not an option for business travel - being late for meetings and not enough frequency of trips.

That is why we need HFR. Most of VIA's tardiness is caused by interactions with freight trains so removing those interactions should result in a significant improvement in on time performance. The new fleet will also help as delays can also be caused by mechanical issues.

The one thing that VIA should consider is making the experience at the status better. One is to simplify boarding at end stations. Why can’t I just board the train in Toronto and instead have to line up for a boarding check? In Europe they don’t check tickets before the train unless it’s a special train. Most checks are only done on the train. The other is better food options in economy. It’s atrocious. The airlines offer better paid options for continental flights. Certainly VIA can do better than cheese and crackers for 6hr journeys.

This has been discussed before, but the big problem is a combination of platform width and each platform only having one escalator. There are safety concerns about having too many passengers squeezing onto a small platform. In Europe, the platforms at major stations are significantly wider. Also, since most VIA passengers have luggage (unlike GO), they want to use an escalator in both directions, so they need to wait until all the alighting passengers are off the platform before reversing the escalator to allow passengers onto the platform.

Since VIA doesn't own either Toronto Union Station or Montreal Central Station, it is difficult for them to fix these issues. They do own the Ottawa Train Station and have started station improvements, but have only received funding for phase Ia (which they have completed).

 

[Urban Sky]

This has been discussed before, but the big problem is a combination of platform width and each platform only having one escalator. There are safety concerns about having too many passengers squeezing onto a small platform. In Europe, the platforms at major stations are significantly wider. Also, since most VIA passengers have luggage (unlike GO), they want to use an escalator in both directions, so they need to wait until all the alighting passengers are off the platform before reversing the escalator to allow passengers onto the platform.

I like to highlight this by comparing the platform widths (and heights) of Wien Hauptbahnhof with those of Toronto Union:

Thank you for sharing this great European example of a passenger-centric rail hub, but I believe the most important difference between European rail hubs like Wien Hauptbahnhof and North American rail hubs like Toronto Union only becomes clear when you draw the attention at the width of the platforms and of the vertical access (stairs or escalators):

Source: 5TEF4Ns Blog

Source: Urban Toronto article by Robert Mackenzie


We can laugh all we want about the archaic boarding practices on which VIA insists, but they are a direct consequence of the severe historic underinvestment in rail infrastructure on this continent. If we want passenger-centric boarding processes like across Europe, we'll have to heavily invest into passenger-centric infrastructure first...

 

[crs1026]

^I would want us to make changes (which really aren’t that expensive) rather than perpetuate what we have.

Take three track widths, make the inner track into a pair of short stub tracks, and install more escalators.

- Paul

 

[Urban Sky]

^I would want us to make changes (which really aren’t that expensive) rather than perpetuate what we have.

Take three track widths, make the inner track into a pair of short stub tracks, and install more escalators.

- Paul

Many rail hub stations in Europe certainly cope with significantly more train movements and passenger numbers on a considerably lower number of platforms. Considering that some of these stations (Köln Hbf and Hamburg Hbf come to mind) are located in Germany, I have confidence that Deutsche Bahn is aware of ways to retrofit Union Station for higher passenger and train volumes...

 

[Allandale25]

Northumberland County, residents call on Via Rail to reinstate commuter link to Toronto | Globalnews.ca

Northumberland County is asking residents to weigh in on restoring the commuter rail link, between Kingston and Toronto, in an online survey.

globalnews.ca

“We are planning to complete the impact evaluation of 12 other frequencies not slated to return in June in the coming weeks, including train 651.”