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TTC: Yonge North Subway Extension (Finch-Richmond Hill) (Unfunded/Planned)

lead82

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Viva wont be upgraded to LRT in our lifetimes. With 15-20 min service today on Orange and Purple, there is little ridership to justify it. It's more likely we get an LRT on Steeles than we upgrade the Highway 7 BRT.
 

Sagaris88

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Viva wont be upgraded to LRT in our lifetimes. With 15-20 min service today on Orange and Purple, there is little ridership to justify it. It's more likely we get an LRT on Steeles than we upgrade the Highway 7 BRT.
Agreed, I've used Purple a lot and it's mostly empty. There just doesn't seem to be that much need for people to use Viva to get across York Region when most people would rather sit in their own car. Highway 7 is just too car-friendly to get people off cars and into busses.

Though, if there is ever a Viva line that could be turned into LRT, it's Blue. That's packed.
 

TJ O'Pootertoot

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Hard to say how the subway will change travel patterns. Obviously on paper Viva LRT is WAY ahead of a Steeles LRT. If there's actually a subway at Highway 7 in the next 10 years, I suspect ridership on those lines will increase steadily. It also depends what the modal split ends up being as Markham Centre, VMC and RHC/Langstaff develop (I'll even toss Promenade into the mix, since new condo residents would have very easy access to the Yonge subway). Going north on Yonge, to Majjor Mac, seems like it will be very busy as well, given the intensification underway even today.

I get Viva has been around a few years now and it's certainly fair to criticize aspects of how YRT is managing it BUT as I said years ago, when it opened, its present ridership is of only limited relevance. It's not purely a transit initiative. Its purpose is to facilitate and stimulate intensification (and thereby create its own ridership) over the long-term. It's still too early in the experiment to say how that's going or what it might look like in 10 or 20 years. Highway 7 will always be a wide ROW but it's still far less "car-friendly" than it was 10 years ago. The speed limits have dropped, traffic is worse, there are more lights and fewer places to turn with the bus lanes etc.

Ironically, if you'd told me in 1985 that the subway won't go north of Finch for another 30 years, I'd have thought that was pretty crazy so it's a bit of a mug's game trying to guess what transit in this region will look in even 5 years, much less 20 or 30.
 
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11th

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Agreed, I've used Purple a lot and it's mostly empty. There just doesn't seem to be that much need for people to use Viva to get across York Region when most people would rather sit in their own car. Highway 7 is just too car-friendly to get people off cars and into busses.

Though, if there is ever a Viva line that could be turned into LRT, it's Blue. That's packed.
People who are familiar with the area avoid Highway 7 like the plague. 14th, 16th ave. and even Denison are better options.
Reasons behind the lower usage:
- build form.
- low frequency on connecting bus routes.
- viva stations, aside from the main terminals, aren't hubs - you hear people getting dropped off at subway/GO stations, but not so much at the side of a road.
 

raptor

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From the Metrolinx Activities Update - Fall 2019 (at Vaughan Committee of the Whole):

The approval of Bill 107 enables the Province of Ontario to prescribe, through regulation, the design, development and construction of a rapid transit expansion project as the sole responsibility of Metrolinx.
Bill 107 leads to the making of Ontario Regulation 248/19 under the Metrolinx Act, 2006, also known as “Interim Measures - Upload of Rapid Transit Projects”. Ontario Regulation 248/19 came into effect on July 23, 2019, which prescribes the Yonge Subway Extension (YSE) project as the sole responsibility of Metrolinx. The change in legislation also leads to the review of the governance for the YSE project.

Metrolinx and Infrastructure Ontario (IO) retained a team of advisors (referred to as the Review Panel) in July 2019 to perform an independent review of plans for the YSE and the Scarborough Subway Extension projects. The Review Panel is expected to report back to Metrolinx and IO with its draft recommendations report in Fall 2019.

With the Review Panel initiatives currently underway, Executive Committee direction has been given to pause some design work plans for YSE, however, the following activities are proceeding as planned:
- Interim design submissions for the stations, tunnels and systems contracts have been reviewed and Regional/Municipal comments have been consolidated and provided to the project partners
- Elevating design work of Richmond Hill Centre Station to a 15% level is progressing
- The analysis of the benefits of a potential mega-bore option is moving forward;
- Metrolinx’ work on the YSE business case is underway
- A procurement options analysis is near completion; and
- Geotechnical and topography surveying continue and are expected to be completed in October 2019
 

Reecemartin

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Viva wont be upgraded to LRT in our lifetimes. With 15-20 min service today on Orange and Purple, there is little ridership to justify it. It's more likely we get an LRT on Steeles than we upgrade the Highway 7 BRT.
I tend to agree with thelater comment
 

TJ O'Pootertoot

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Not that it's a decisive factor but I'm kind of fascinated by the notion that the Ontario Line and Yonge Extension are among the most important matters to the federal Conservative Party.
(Also interesting, that the Eglinton West LRT and Line 2 extension aren't...)
 

AlvinofDiaspar

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Not that it's a decisive factor but I'm kind of fascinated by the notion that the Ontario Line and Yonge Extension are among the most important matters to the federal Conservative Party.
(Also interesting, that the Eglinton West LRT and Line 2 extension aren't...)
Because Line 2 already received federal funding, and nobody takes EW seriously (a big whatever, and airports don't vote).

AoD
 

raptor

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19-177 - TA for Scarborough Subway Extension and Yonge North Subway Extension Projects

DESCRIPTION
Announced by the Government of Ontario in April 2019, the Scarborough Subway
Extension (“SSE”) Project and the Yonge North Subway Extension (“YNSE”)
Project (collectively the “Projects”) are each extension of TTC’s existing lines.
The SSE will replace the existing Scarborough Rapid Transit line and is an
extension of the existing line 2 to Scarborough Centre. The YNSE is an extension
of TTC’s existing line 1 from Finch Station through the York Region (including City
of Markham, the City of Vaughan and the City of Richmond Hill).
 

Allandale25

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This article was posted in the Ontario Line thread but there's a reference to the Yonge North Subway:

"He admitted Metrolinx is rethinking the Yonge North subway extension route as currently configured, with the thinking there could be more “bang for the buck” with an alternate route."

 

salsa

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"He admitted Metrolinx is rethinking the Yonge North subway extension route as currently configured, with the thinking there could be more “bang for the buck” with an alternate route."
I'm guessing it's some sort of scheme to divert part of it onto the Richmond Hill GO line.
 

Coolstar

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This article was posted in the Ontario Line thread but there's a reference to the Yonge North Subway:

"He admitted Metrolinx is rethinking the Yonge North subway extension route as currently configured, with the thinking there could be more “bang for the buck” with an alternate route."

Knowing Doug it can't be good.
 

Rainforest

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I'm guessing it's some sort of scheme to divert part of it onto the Richmond Hill GO line.
And, that's not necessarily a bad idea.

Looking at the map, I expect the Toronto section (up to and including the Steeles station) to be safe anyway, as there is no other route from Finch Stn to the 416' border. North of Steeles, two options might exist:

A) Join the CN mainline just north of Doncaster, and head east. Not sure if CN will be particularly thrilled, but perhaps there is a way. Then, turn north up Bayview, and then join the Bala sub all the way to RH Centre station. There would be one new station at Bayview and John, while the Clark and 407 stations would be gone.

B) Or, continue up Yonge to Clark Stn, then go into a deep tunnel heading north-east, and join the Bala sub somewhere north of Royal Orchard Blvd, then go to the RH Centre station.

Affected homeowners will be unhappy, and some TOD at the would-be 407 station will be lost. So, the route straight up Yonge is optimal, but if the alternative costs a lot less, then I wouldn't dismiss it right away.
 

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