Dan416
Senior Member
I disagree wholeheartedly. Take the DRL where people want to go and where they can transfer easily to other modes of transit.
A DRL that skips Union isn't even worth building IMHO.
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TTC: Sheppard Subway Expansion (Speculative)
- Thread starter LAz
- Start date
I disagree wholeheartedly. Take the DRL where people want to go and where they can transfer easily to other modes of transit.
A DRL that skips Union isn't even worth building IMHO.
dowlingm
Senior Member
Coruscanti Cognoscente, I don't know where you work, but I work in the Financial District and walk from City Hall to King Street via PATH. In the morning as it stands there is a one-way tidal wave coming up from Union against me, to a lesser extent the same in the other direction in the evening. Even with the planned additional pathway this will only fulfill demand from increased GO service. Given that passengers from east or west retain the option of transferring at Bloor and accessing Bloor via YUS then it stands to reason that the DRL should account for pedestrian flow and therefore run no further south than Adelaide - I myself would run it along Queen.
In any case, the notion of Union as being a single point of failure should be obvious to those who remember the incident which formed the basis for the first episode of "Flashpoint" - as it is a security or fire incident at Union could paralyze commuter rail, VIA Rail, YUS and Harbourfront LRT.
http://urbantoronto.ca/member.php?166-Coruscanti-Cognoscente
In any case, the notion of Union as being a single point of failure should be obvious to those who remember the incident which formed the basis for the first episode of "Flashpoint" - as it is a security or fire incident at Union could paralyze commuter rail, VIA Rail, YUS and Harbourfront LRT.
http://urbantoronto.ca/member.php?166-Coruscanti-Cognoscente
jwill
Active Member
The DRL will potential pass every single GO line along its proposed route. Transfers from GO to DRL can happen where they cross outside the core. There's no need to force everybody through an already congested Union Station.
nfitz
Superstar
Well said!
jwill
Active Member
Also, this has nothing to do with the Sheppard Subway.
Dan416
Senior Member
None of the threads seem to have anything to do with their titles these days.
CDL.TO
Moderator
It's always been that way. Conversations are organic. I remember complaints about things getting off-topic on Usenet.
A few off-topic posts are no big deal. If it comes to dominate a thread, mods will move posts around.
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Mike in TO
Senior Member
Queen’s Park and city have a $12.4B TTC deal
Robert Benzie
Queen's Park Bureau Chief
Tess Kalinowski Transportation Reporter
The Better Way will get a lot bigger under a new $12.4 billion plan to extend the Sheppard subway line in both directions and build a new Eglinton light rail line from Jane St. to Kennedy station, the Star has learned.
Premier Dalton McGuinty is to announce Thursday that the province is giving Toronto $8.2 billion to pay for the TTC’s new 20-km Eglinton Crosstown Metro. It would run underground all the way from Black Creek to Scarborough Centre and continue above ground along the existing Scarborough Rapid Transit route, which would be converted to the same LRT technology.
But it will be up to Mayor Rob Ford and city council to determine how to finance the $4.2 billion it will cost for the Sheppard subway extensions he wants to build west to Downsview station and east to Scarborough Centre.
Questions remain about whether it is feasible to raise that much money using development charges and tax increment financing to boost the Toronto Transit Commission.
“There are only four ways to do it: existing revenue tools, like property taxes; a private-public partnership; increased federal funding; or, down the road, some kind of new funding arrangement with the province,” one source confided.
The provincial funding had previously been earmarked for Transit City, which was a plan for more extensive light rail on Eglinton, Sheppard, Finch and the Scarborough RT.
But Ford declared that deal dead as soon as he took office last October, vowing there would be no more tracks down the middle of Toronto’s streets like the St. Clair Ave. line.
As a result of the mayor’s objections, the proposed Finch line from the upcoming Finch West station to Humber College has been scrapped.
While Transportation Minister Kathleen Wynne was tight-lipped Wednesday, she confirmed a deal was “close.”
“There’s no more money, but on the Eglinton line we want to get going,” said Wynne, mindful that the Liberals hold 19 of Toronto’s 23 seats and face re-election on Oct. 6.
“It’s been a back and forth conversation for a number of weeks,” she said of the weeks of ongoing negotiations between Queen’s Park and city hall.
“The whole point of this ... has been to find the common ground, to find a way to preserve our principles and to allow the city to move forward on what it wants to do.”
Construction will start this year, with completion set for 2020.
Ford’s dream of an extended Sheppard subway will be the city’s $4.2 billion responsibility alone — in the west, it will run 5.45 km from Downsview station to Yonge; in the east, it will go from Don Mills to Scarborough Centre. It should be finished in 2019.
The plan would take traffic off the Bloor-Danforth line, according to one provincial source. Studies show many people would switch to Eglinton to travel to the Yonge and Eglinton area.
Under former mayor David Miller’s administration, Metrolinx was prepared to fund about 56 km of light rail on separate lanes running down the middle of the road by about the end of the decade.
The idea was to enhance the commutes of residents living in some of Toronto’s priority neighbourhoods such as Jane and Finch, where transit access and social services are scarce.
Light rail advocates argue that such lines encourage mid-rise development that leads to livelier, pedestrian friendly streetscapes.
Ford — and those who voted for him — disagreed, saying construction snarled traffic and removed precious lane space from busy city streets.
In a major concession, meanwhile, the TTC will abandon its “open payment” smartcard and work with Metrolinx to implement the Presto fare card already in use.
“That’s a big win,” said one provincial insider, recalling the feud between Queen’s Park and the previous TTC administration over Presto.
Robert Benzie
Queen's Park Bureau Chief
Tess Kalinowski Transportation Reporter
The Better Way will get a lot bigger under a new $12.4 billion plan to extend the Sheppard subway line in both directions and build a new Eglinton light rail line from Jane St. to Kennedy station, the Star has learned.
Premier Dalton McGuinty is to announce Thursday that the province is giving Toronto $8.2 billion to pay for the TTC’s new 20-km Eglinton Crosstown Metro. It would run underground all the way from Black Creek to Scarborough Centre and continue above ground along the existing Scarborough Rapid Transit route, which would be converted to the same LRT technology.
But it will be up to Mayor Rob Ford and city council to determine how to finance the $4.2 billion it will cost for the Sheppard subway extensions he wants to build west to Downsview station and east to Scarborough Centre.
Questions remain about whether it is feasible to raise that much money using development charges and tax increment financing to boost the Toronto Transit Commission.
“There are only four ways to do it: existing revenue tools, like property taxes; a private-public partnership; increased federal funding; or, down the road, some kind of new funding arrangement with the province,” one source confided.
The provincial funding had previously been earmarked for Transit City, which was a plan for more extensive light rail on Eglinton, Sheppard, Finch and the Scarborough RT.
But Ford declared that deal dead as soon as he took office last October, vowing there would be no more tracks down the middle of Toronto’s streets like the St. Clair Ave. line.
As a result of the mayor’s objections, the proposed Finch line from the upcoming Finch West station to Humber College has been scrapped.
While Transportation Minister Kathleen Wynne was tight-lipped Wednesday, she confirmed a deal was “close.”
“There’s no more money, but on the Eglinton line we want to get going,” said Wynne, mindful that the Liberals hold 19 of Toronto’s 23 seats and face re-election on Oct. 6.
“It’s been a back and forth conversation for a number of weeks,” she said of the weeks of ongoing negotiations between Queen’s Park and city hall.
“The whole point of this ... has been to find the common ground, to find a way to preserve our principles and to allow the city to move forward on what it wants to do.”
Construction will start this year, with completion set for 2020.
Ford’s dream of an extended Sheppard subway will be the city’s $4.2 billion responsibility alone — in the west, it will run 5.45 km from Downsview station to Yonge; in the east, it will go from Don Mills to Scarborough Centre. It should be finished in 2019.
The plan would take traffic off the Bloor-Danforth line, according to one provincial source. Studies show many people would switch to Eglinton to travel to the Yonge and Eglinton area.
Under former mayor David Miller’s administration, Metrolinx was prepared to fund about 56 km of light rail on separate lanes running down the middle of the road by about the end of the decade.
The idea was to enhance the commutes of residents living in some of Toronto’s priority neighbourhoods such as Jane and Finch, where transit access and social services are scarce.
Light rail advocates argue that such lines encourage mid-rise development that leads to livelier, pedestrian friendly streetscapes.
Ford — and those who voted for him — disagreed, saying construction snarled traffic and removed precious lane space from busy city streets.
In a major concession, meanwhile, the TTC will abandon its “open payment” smartcard and work with Metrolinx to implement the Presto fare card already in use.
“That’s a big win,” said one provincial insider, recalling the feud between Queen’s Park and the previous TTC administration over Presto.
Tuscani01
Senior Member
Thank you Rob Ford, for another Stub-way. Eglinton to Black Creek? Way to miss all of Etobicoke, and any connection to the Mississauga Transitway, as well as Pearson.
Rainforest
Senior Member
^ To be fair, the Etobicoke section of ECLRT has been deferred even before Ford took office. The last pre-Ford issue of Metrolinx's plan had the Eglinton line terminating at Jane, with no funding or timetable for extending it to Etobicoke and Pearson.
Surely, completing the Pearson connection should be one of the first priorities in any future transit expansion package.
Surely, completing the Pearson connection should be one of the first priorities in any future transit expansion package.
nfitz
Superstar
But also to be fair, Ford also has completely cancelled the Finch West LRT that would serve Etobicoke; and hasn't pushed for the Eglinton LRT to serve Etobicoke.
I guess Etobicoke voted for Ford, so they can live with the repercussions.
Ford also seems to be breaking his promise that this would be finished by 2015. Now it's 2019.
I guess Etobicoke voted for Ford, so they can live with the repercussions.
Ford also seems to be breaking his promise that this would be finished by 2015. Now it's 2019.
Markster
Senior Member
You can look at it positively:
Etobicoke roads will be as clear as ever for cars!
Eglinton will be torn up across the city building station boxes... except for Etobicoke!
Etobicoke roads will be as clear as ever for cars!
Eglinton will be torn up across the city building station boxes... except for Etobicoke!
M II A II R II K
Senior Member
Assuming this all comes to pass great, in terms of adding service. But what about relieving already existing downtown service....
Ramako
Moderator
Isn't that what the new signalling system and new trains are supposed to do, or will that only make a marginal difference without a DRL?
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By 2031, improvements to the Yonge subway (such as signal improvements and new rolling stock) will increase the overall capacity of the line to 48,000 pphpd. However, demand is also projected to increase to 42,000 (Metrolinx’s estimate) pphpd. Even with the capacity improvements in place, the overall level of congestion on the line is expected to decrease by only 3.5 percent.