Richard White
Senior Member
Here's the thing though. There is no signage on that section of King Street idenitfying it as a snow route.
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TTC: Other Items (catch all)
- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
Here's the thing though. There is no signage on that section of King Street idenitfying it as a snow route.
bearcat
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Thanks!
A couple thing then, 1) I think the fine for blocking a streetcar should be higher, as I said the same as blocking the box, at $450, 2) I think the law should simply be "block passage of streetcar" (I assume all streets with streetcars are snow routes already but this makes it easier to understand the law without knowing what a snow route is). 3) There should be more snow route signs along a snow routes. I think for every parking related sign on such a street there should be a snow route sign above it. 4) there should be an official QR code, a phone number, or a website or something written on the snow route signs so one can quickly check from an official source if the parking restrictions are in effect
I do know the law is to park within 30 cm of the curb, and it logically follows that if you can't see the curb, you can't be sure that you're satisfying the law, but not everyone is logical, so I think it should still be laid out in the Driver's Handbook not to park on a street if you can't see the curb and taught like that in driving schools.
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evandyk
Senior Member
There is one between Berkeley and Parliament.
bearcat
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Sorry, which specific area are you talking about, was there an earlier post in the thread that I missed?
Northern Light
Superstar
A car/driver still subject to the 30cm from the curb rule.
However, the Snow Route by-law section for streetcars DOES regulate King street.
King Street East Yonge Street and Queen Street East
King Street West Yonge Street and Roncesvalles Avenue
I do agree, however, that based on a quick glance at Streetview from 2023, I do not see signage reflecting this.
Monarch Butterfly
Superstar
Problem is that the fine is too low. $30.00 is ridiculous, even on a summer day. Should be much higher. Should be charged for the number of passengers on transit vehicles exasperated. Maybe $30 per passenger, for a streetcar that would be 200 X $30 = $6,000.00 (per streetcar). Plus towing.
Richard White
Senior Member
To be honest, when I looked around I saw no stopping and no parking signage but nothing else.
Mihairokov
Senior Member
How about no on-street parking on streetcar routes in general? Regardless of season.
Northern Light
Superstar
That's ridiculous in the other direction.
You're aware some drivers are low or lower middle income, are you not?
$6,000 could make such a person homeless, it could leave them destitute, they might not even recover that selling their car.
A bit of restraint Walter..........the only thing you do with such extreme statements is alienate people who would otherwise be your ally. Stop getting so carried away!
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Northern Light
Superstar
How about no on-street parking on streetcar routes in general? Regardless of season.
I think that's a reasonable position. Though, in some cases, it would need to be phased in, in order to address loading zones, accessible drop-offs etc.
But I think the basic idea makes perfect sense, and it should logically start downtown or other normative bottleneck points.
Northern Light
Superstar
I have long advocated for income-continent fines.
The City, however, would require access to the Canada Revenue Agency database and enabling legislation, both federal and provincial.
I wish it were realistic in the near-term, but I've seen no appetite to go there as yet.
I'm all for continuing to push for it though.
***
In the meantime, I think @Mihairokov is on the right track, so to speak with cleaner, more consistent restrictions on street parking; and @W. K. Lis isn't wrong that the $30 is light as a fine, I think a shift to $60 would be reasonable in respect of the parking distance from the curb offense.
For snow routes, I think they absolutely need to be tow-away zones as well, particularly if you're blocking streetcar tracks, but really, more broadly.
Jonny5
Senior Member
I'm curious about the economics of that. We seem to have a pretty warped system for towing. Would tow truck drivers actually bother accepting such an assignment when they could be bilking money from some fender bender on the 401 in a snow storm?
Would the City of Toronto have to establish its own towing fleet, or sign seasonal contracts?
I am asking as I have genuinely no idea how that all works.
Northern Light
Superstar
The police authorize tows, including for by-law infractions. They have contracts with different towing companies based on the area of the City:
Source: https://www.tps.ca/media/filer_publ...41fd/0a1e1c43-3079-49b6-be31-2369b2696c79.pdf
nfitz
Superstar
It's 46 cm now. That may be the higest since 1999. But I haven't checked through from 2008 to 2021.
The more I think about it, the more I think that the last time they trucked away the snow from residential streets was 2022 - and my memory just thinks that was longer ago.
I don't think they declared a snow emergency for pushing 15 years after the 1999 storm. My vague recollection, is that it just sort of died away, and then there was a bad snow with excessive streetcar issues, and council pushed for it.
Meanwhile, signage had started to disappear, and hasn't been replaced. Queen East - at least east of Woodbine - doesnt seem to have any either.
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