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TTC: Other Items (catch all)

For all of his good will and good appearances....

Byford is hardly the saint that a lot of people seem to make him out to be.

I would never condemn Andy to religious idolatry.

LOL

I am well aware of his shortcomings; I would still rank him as the best to sit in that chair since David Gunn.

The current downturn in morale within the organization largely started under his watch. Publicly, he was quick to blame the organization for its ills (rightfully or wrongfully), and that wore poorly on a lot of people. A lot of lower and middle management left - or even transferred back into operations in some cases - because it was felt that they were made to be apologists.

They had a lot to apologize for; if you actually meet the expectations of the ridership, you get to start taking credit instead of giving apologies.

Ideally, apologies are a tool of shaming those who under perform into performing better.

I expect a degree of service reliability in line w/the best large systems in the world. I expect stations to be immaculately clean. I expect staff to be unfailing polite, customer-centred and proactive.

The TTC hasn't shown that for a number of years, Byford made some small but real differences in that regard. Something as simple as announcing the brief delay at Coxwell for a crew change, and thanking riders for their patience.

That said, routine gratitude for riders is in short supply, and organization during service interruptions is near non-existent. If that was on Andy, Rick has had several years to fix it.

He also was the one who started the trend of outsourcing operations within the Commission, and that certainly did no favours in that regard.

I'm not a huge outsourcing fan, but the one I'm familiar with at TTC was vehicle cleaning. To my understanding, cleaners were quite well paid at the time for the job (I'm fine w/that) but also under performing.

I was given to understand that following a pilot that outsourced work for some of the buses, that the union was given a choice to improve productivity and to accept lower pay for new hires or have the work contracted out.

The Union opted not to accept those terms.

I'll be fair and say, I think the contracted out cleaners make too little by a noticeable amount.

I would have preferred the service remain in house, and perhaps the compensation offer could have been better. Still, I know too much about how the TTC operates and its union operates from operators themselves. I sympathize w/both sides on that one.

And of course, he also was the one who hired Leary, and look where that's gotten us.

Was Rick really his choice?
 
Something as simple as announcing the brief delay at Coxwell for a crew change, and thanking riders for their patience.
I don't think it's as simple as that, because there is a second part to the equation which the TTC fails colossally on, and is IMO the far bigger part of the problem: the quality of their announcements. And this isn't an issue of old vs. new vehicles, I have been on TRs where the crew is making announcements or playing back messages from transit control and they come out utterly garbled.

My experience has been that the crews are pretty good at making announcements, but the hardware is very poor and I can count on one hand the number of announcements I've actually been able to understand.

Also I'll disagree about the staff being too customer oriented. I'm not saying they should hiss at people who approach them, but there is a bell curve. Having been in many a retail store where those poor folks are forced to brown nose you on pain of being written up, I can say it is definitely not a positive experience to have multiple folks getting up in your business while you're trying to browse. I would be sufficiently pleased with being left alone unless I engage a staff member. This goes double for all the wannabe mall cops who think someone taking pictures of buses is breaking the rules.
 
I don't think it's as simple as that, because there is a second part to the equation which the TTC fails colossally on, and is IMO the far bigger part of the problem: the quality of their announcements. And this isn't an issue of old vs. new vehicles, I have been on TRs where the crew is making announcements or playing back messages from transit control and they come out utterly garbled.

I've been on my fair share of delayed trains, where no one says word one about whether we're holding for a red light, a service adjustment, a delay etc.

Yes, the hardware is an issue, no argument. But there's room for considerably better effort.

Also I'll disagree about the staff being too customer oriented. I'm not saying they should hiss at people who approach them, but there is a bell curve. Having been in many a retail store where those poor folks are forced to brown nose you on pain of being written up, I can say it is definitely not a positive experience to have multiple folks getting up in your business while you're trying to browse. I would be sufficiently pleased with being left alone unless I engage a staff member. This goes double for all the wannabe mall cops who think someone taking pictures of buses is breaking the rules.

Who was asking for any invasive behavior?

How about a smile now and again?

What about, a polite announcement similar to what the CSAs on GO do when you arrive or depart Union; "On behalf of the crew and the TTC, we thank you for riding the TTC and wish you a great day." Not at every stop; just at Bloor/Yonge and/or Union.

For comparison, when I was a child, TTC subway operators routinely left the cab door open when operating the subway. As a little boy in the rail fan seat, I got to know the names of the operators I saw on my way to school. I still remember Fred, who explained to me what all the colours of lights on his display meant, why he had to hold down the speed control, and what the signal aspects in the tunnels meant); to be clear, I'm aware cab design and rules have changed. However, I don't see that kind of outreach to enthusiastic kids or warm greetings of familiar faces.

I don't understand the mentality of operators who delay riders by departing mid-route for coffee or taking an inordinately long break in not apologizing for the delay upon their return. It would do so much to diffuse anti-operator sentiment. I don't need to know if you were under the weather or any TMI details; nor do I need an operator to read a 3-page soliloquy due to being 10s late. But if you delay me by 3 minutes or more, a simple, 'Sorry about that folks, we're back underway'. would be nice.
 
For comparison, when I was a child, TTC subway operators routinely left the cab door open when operating the subway. As a little boy in the rail fan seat, I got to know the names of the operators I saw on my way to school. I still remember Fred, who explained to me what all the colours of lights on his display meant, why he had to hold down the speed control, and what the signal aspects in the tunnels meant); to be clear, I'm aware cab design and rules have changed. However, I don't see that kind of outreach to enthusiastic kids or warm greetings of familiar faces.

I did this too!

I remember when the operators let me make the stop announcements and honk the horn for track workers.

Now, as you stated for a number of reasons they do not let people do that anymore. I can see why though, it is not like it was 30 years ago. Now you have parents who do not know how to control their kids and nobody is willing to risk their job in the name of outreach.
 
Who was asking for any invasive behavior?
Invasive behaviour is what I am used to from my own experiences in retail. If that is not what you meant then I will concede your point.

On that general point though I would say that I still find myself to have lower expectations. Basically, as long as I'm not cursed at, leered at, or given the finger, I can't complain. Of course, it's great when you do get one of those rare enthusiastic folks who seems to genuinely love their job and treats you like you are an actual human being, but if someone is quiet, or distant, or cold, I assume there's a reason for it, you never know what someone is going through. Of course, it can only go so far, and just like when I'm on the other side of the plexiglass, there is no excusing rudeness or abusive behaviour, but if I greet an op while boarding a bus and they don't seem at all happy to see me, I'll assume they are going through something in their life, or have had a rough shift, or something like that. I've had my share of shifts like that, so I get it.
 
I would never condemn Andy to religious idolatry.

LOL

I am well aware of his shortcomings; I would still rank him as the best to sit in that chair since David Gunn.
Fair enough...."saint" is not the most apt description.

But there certainly seems to be a certain amount of longing for him from people not within the TTC. Perhaps a bit of "absence makes the heart grow fonder"?

They had a lot to apologize for; if you actually meet the expectations of the ridership, you get to start taking credit instead of giving apologies.
Agreed.

But when demands were made to those below to follow along with that routine, regardless of the situation or position of the staffer? At what point does one draw the line?

Ideally, apologies are a tool of shaming those who under perform into performing better.
They can certainly be used that way, sure.

They can also be taken by those not directly affected as "they don't have my back". And a LOT of the staff feel/have felt that way.

I expect a degree of service reliability in line w/the best large systems in the world. I expect stations to be immaculately clean. I expect staff to be unfailing polite, customer-centred and proactive.
You'll get no arguments from me.

The TTC hasn't shown that for a number of years, Byford made some small but real differences in that regard. Something as simple as announcing the brief delay at Coxwell for a crew change, and thanking riders for their patience.
He did improve communications in an absolutely enormous manner, I will agree. And that has been left to slide back since his departure.

That said, routine gratitude for riders is in short supply, and organization during service interruptions is near non-existent. If that was on Andy, Rick has had several years to fix it.
Let it be clear that I'm not suggesting for a second that Leary is better at ANYTHING than Byford.

But a lot of that "gratitude" was pretty hollow under Byford, and a lot of staff did it because they were made to feel that they were obligated to - regardless of whether it was their place to or not.

I'm not a huge outsourcing fan, but the one I'm familiar with at TTC was vehicle cleaning. To my understanding, cleaners were quite well paid at the time for the job (I'm fine w/that) but also under performing.
That was the story given at the time, and was not completely true.

It was done to drive a wedge within the Union, to try and potentially get some more concessions at contract time and to reduce the Union's headcount, and potentially seen as a means to outsourcing more of the operations of the system if it worked out well. Of course, it hasn't, but who's to let the truth get in the way of a good tale....

(Maintenance and operating staff are under the same Union, although they frequently have vastly different demands when it comes to contact time. As operations are a larger portion of the Union, they are the ones who's demands win out at award time, much to the chagrin of the maintenance staff.)

I was given to understand that following a pilot that outsourced work for some of the buses, that the union was given a choice to improve productivity and to accept lower pay for new hires or have the work contracted out.
It was obviously more complicated than that, but that works as a summary of the situation.

The pilot was expanded before the Union was given a chance to reply to the demands - by the time the contract negotiations had rolled around, IIRC 3 of the garages had been outsourced with a further 2 being slated to change over shortly after the end of the contract. The Union obviously was not happy, but they were given a couple of concessions to make up for it.

And of course those concessions were primarily aimed at the operating staff - much the annoyance of the maintenance staff. Further dividing them.

The Union opted not to accept those terms.
Again, somewhat more complicated.

I'll be fair and say, I think the contracted out cleaners make too little by a noticeable amount.
No argument from me.

I would have preferred the service remain in house, and perhaps the compensation offer could have been better. Still, I know too much about how the TTC operates and its union operates from operators themselves. I sympathize w/both sides on that one.
I think that the ideal situation would be a splitting of the maintenance and operating sides of the Union, with separate negotiations. Of course, that's a discussion for another time....

Was Rick really his choice?
Perhaps not his first, but considering that he was hired to be the Chief Service Officer for the TTC - meaning that he oversaw virtually all revenue service operations - and was positioned just under Byford.....

Dan
 
Fair enough...."saint" is not the most apt description.

But there certainly seems to be a certain amount of longing for him from people not within the TTC. Perhaps a bit of "absence makes the heart grow fonder"?


Agreed.

But when demands were made to those below to follow along with that routine, regardless of the situation or position of the staffer? At what point does one draw the line?


They can certainly be used that way, sure.

They can also be taken by those not directly affected as "they don't have my back". And a LOT of the staff feel/have felt that way.


You'll get no arguments from me.


He did improve communications in an absolutely enormous manner, I will agree. And that has been left to slide back since his departure.


Let it be clear that I'm not suggesting for a second that Leary is better at ANYTHING than Byford.

But a lot of that "gratitude" was pretty hollow under Byford, and a lot of staff did it because they were made to feel that they were obligated to - regardless of whether it was their place to or not.


That was the story given at the time, and was not completely true.

It was done to drive a wedge within the Union, to try and potentially get some more concessions at contract time and to reduce the Union's headcount, and potentially seen as a means to outsourcing more of the operations of the system if it worked out well. Of course, it hasn't, but who's to let the truth get in the way of a good tale....

(Maintenance and operating staff are under the same Union, although they frequently have vastly different demands when it comes to contact time. As operations are a larger portion of the Union, they are the ones who's demands win out at award time, much to the chagrin of the maintenance staff.)


It was obviously more complicated than that, but that works as a summary of the situation.

The pilot was expanded before the Union was given a chance to reply to the demands - by the time the contract negotiations had rolled around, IIRC 3 of the garages had been outsourced with a further 2 being slated to change over shortly after the end of the contract. The Union obviously was not happy, but they were given a couple of concessions to make up for it.

And of course those concessions were primarily aimed at the operating staff - much the annoyance of the maintenance staff. Further dividing them.


Again, somewhat more complicated.


No argument from me.


I think that the ideal situation would be a splitting of the maintenance and operating sides of the Union, with separate negotiations. Of course, that's a discussion for another time....


Perhaps not his first, but considering that he was hired to be the Chief Service Officer for the TTC - meaning that he oversaw virtually all revenue service operations - and was positioned just under Byford.....

Dan

A thoughtful reply, as always; with which I take no material issue.
 
Was Rick really his choice?
Not me reading "Rick really" as "Rick Leary", had to read twice 😆
I can say it is definitely not a positive experience to have multiple folks getting up in your business while you're trying to browse.
Totally agree, and it's doubly annoying online when you open up a webpage and right away a pop-up chat shows up with "how can i help you". Like, I just wanna browse the site on my own, but having this chat pop-up is a sure way to guarantee I won't be going back to that site. Luckily, at least one store came up with a pretty genius solution to this:
1699999233646.png

From personal experience, I never felt the need for this while shopping, it's definitely more of an issue online. Now we need the same solution implemented on all those websites so you can browse on your own terms without being bombarded by needless chats.
 
Looking at the agenda for next week's TTC meeting, the Financial update and Major Projects report contains some tidbits of interest.


Off the top, we have a large scale upstaffing of stations. I'm uncertain on the value of this, is this just more warm bodies or is there a purpose, utility and duty set that needs carrying out?

The ratio of supervisors to front line staff seem problematic at roughly 4 to 1.


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Hmmm RIDETO sorta/kinda lives:

View attachment 507741

Line 1 Capacity Expansion Update
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I'm skipping items I think are of somewhat lower interest as its a big report.
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I'll cross-post the Yonge-Bloor stuff to the applicable thread, lots of other items of interest if you follow the link.
Building this siding between Rosedale and Bloor would allow trains to "dwell" in the siding without blocking the main line. The question I have is will they need to shift the mainline to create space for the siding?

Will it be a pocket track or be connected on both ends? They should look at utilizing Davisville build up more often to allow additional train capacity.
 
The TMSF is interesting, the only site that jumps out at me as feasible is south of Langstaff GO.
Having a station at around Steeles is pointless because is so close to Old Cummer. You really need to be able to terminate trains at Langstaff for the service to make sense.
 
In regards to St Clair W and the way they are slowly replacing the overhead working a few hours a day on certain days makes me wonder who tendered these jobs? Like come on shutting down a line for almost a year so you could take your time to replace the overhead is such a joke. If you really wanted to you could get it done in two months.

Also with the RT replacement shuttles what would it take to hire traffic constables at certain intersections to get traffic moving.

The funny thing is for shuttle bus traffic management they use TPS. Is that because traffic constables don't work weekends? I saw one of them helping cars turn left onto Allen Rd from Eglinton and 4 others standing around chatting. Must be great to get paid to socialize on your shift while one guy does all the work.

They should have a floater who goes from site to site relieving the guy directing traffic instead of how it's done now.

Utter waste of resources.
 
Building this siding between Rosedale and Bloor would allow trains to "dwell" in the siding without blocking the main line. The question I have is will they need to shift the mainline to create space for the siding?
The ideal location would be between the mainlines, as that would allow trains to enter northbound without affecting trains running southbound - and vice versa.

And if that is what they plan on doing, then they would shift one or both of the mainlines to do this.

They should look at utilizing Davisville build up more often to allow additional train capacity.
They already do, every day in fact.

But as it is located on the west side of the mainline, it can be problematic having out-of-service northbound trains accessing it.

Dan
 
Like come on shutting down a line for almost a year so you could take your time to replace the overhead is such a joke. If you really wanted to you could get it done in two months.
Time to implement "lane rental" for the tracks - the asset owner specifies a cost per hour for closing a km of track in the tendered docs, then each bidder includes that cost in their bid price based on the time they'd need to complete their work plan. This encourages innovative work methods and rewards contactors who minimize the time a lane (or track) is not available.

Here's an example from Alberta's Ministry of Transportation: https://www.transportation.alberta....aneRentalAndSpeedReductionChargesBulletin.pdf
 

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