Richmond Hill Yonge Line 1 North Subway Extension | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx

[ARG1]

Metrolinx Press Room

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This blog mostly reiterates what we already know, but there's a few things to point out.

1) 407 Transitway is still in full active development despite the EA lapsing.
2) Minor thing, but Viva Orange branch to clark is still a thing.
3) This has been hinted at before, but Metrolinx seems pretty serious about this "RT on Steeles" thing, and have concretely labelled this as a line going from Jane to McCowan.
4) This maybe me reading into this, but the section on the Richmond Hill Line mentions a lot about increasing service, and expanding service on the Richmond Hill Line. Possible (yet unlikely) minimal off peak service on RH in the future?

 

[TJ O'Pootertoot]

Metrolinx Press Room

Find the latest Metrolinx news, project updates and more.

blog.metrolinx.com

This blog mostly reiterates what we already know, but there's a few things to point out.

1) 407 Transitway is still in full active development despite the EA lapsing.
2) Minor thing, but Viva Orange branch to clark is still a thing.
3) This has been hinted at before, but Metrolinx seems pretty serious about this "RT on Steeles" thing, and have concretely labelled this as a line going from Jane to McCowan.
4) This maybe me reading into this, but the section on the Richmond Hill Line mentions a lot about increasing service, and expanding service on the Richmond Hill Line. Possible (yet unlikely) minimal off peak service on RH in the future?

The Transitway and Steeles BRT are a couple of projects that always seem 50 years away, kind of like how the DRL used to be. Nice to see them mentioned in official material as alive and kicking.
They've been talking about enhanced (off-peak) service for that GO line for a while. I think proper RER is a long way away, if ever, but it definitely makes sense to start adding some trains to that route in the comin gyears.

 

[Towered]

Metrolinx Press Room

Find the latest Metrolinx news, project updates and more.

blog.metrolinx.com

3) This has been hinted at before, but Metrolinx seems pretty serious about this "RT on Steeles" thing, and have concretely labelled this as a line going from Jane to McCowan.

It should go much further west than Jane.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

The Transitway and Steeles BRT are a couple of projects that always seem 50 years away, kind of like how the DRL used to be. Nice to see them mentioned in official material as alive and kicking.
They've been talking about enhanced (off-peak) service for that GO line for a while. I think proper RER is a long way away, if ever, but it definitely makes sense to start adding some trains to that route in the comin gyears.

Metrolinx Press Room

Find the latest Metrolinx news, project updates and more.

blog.metrolinx.com

This blog mostly reiterates what we already know, but there's a few things to point out.

1) 407 Transitway is still in full active development despite the EA lapsing.
2) Minor thing, but Viva Orange branch to clark is still a thing.
3) This has been hinted at before, but Metrolinx seems pretty serious about this "RT on Steeles" thing, and have concretely labelled this as a line going from Jane to McCowan.
4) This maybe me reading into this, but the section on the Richmond Hill Line mentions a lot about increasing service, and expanding service on the Richmond Hill Line. Possible (yet unlikely) minimal off peak service on RH in the future?

If they can close a deal for Hamilton, they will for Richmond Hill. It's CN. They will need some sweetners, and Doncaster needs to be fixed up. Not really that hard to get hourly service to Gormley if they really wanted it.

 

[allengeorge]

This has been hinted at before, but Metrolinx seems pretty serious about this "RT on Steeles" thing, and have concretely labelled this as a line going from Jane to McCowan.

Interesting. I wonder if there’s a further northward extension of the SSE in our future.

 

[allengeorge]

It should go much further west than Jane.

Didn’t the draft 2041 transportation plan include some sort of rapid transit up Jane? Maybe they’re just penciling in some east-west lines to connect to the aspirational north-south lines?

 

[ARG1]

Interesting. I wonder if there’s a further northward extension of the SSE in our future.

Now that's a scary thought for many on this website...

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

Many high rises on the west side of Yonge at Clark? there are fewer than at royal orchard

If I am not mistaken, half of trains will short-turn at Steeles.

There has been a lot of property movement happening along the Yonge corridor between Meadowview Ave and Centre Street over the past 24 months. Developers are aiming to pack the corridor with density, make no mistake about it.

But more relevant in my opinion is that the current low-rise residential neighbourhood of Thornhill essentially mirrors Summer Hill, Deer Park, Davisville, North Toronto in built-form and density, and all those places provide significant walk-in traffic to the system. Thornhill isn't a suburb in the conventional sense, and there is no reason to think that ridership wouldn't reflect that.

Actually it wouldn't surprise me if a significant share of the current Finch ridership originates from Thornhill.

 

[Undead]

There has been a lot of property movement happening along the Yonge corridor between Meadowview Ave and Centre Street over the past 24 months

Interesting, can you share more?

 

[TJ O'Pootertoot]

There has been a lot of property movement happening along the Yonge corridor between Meadowview Ave and Centre Street over the past 24 months. Developers are aiming to pack the corridor with density, make no mistake about it.

But more relevant in my opinion is that the current low-rise residential neighbourhood of Thornhill essentially mirrors Summer Hill, Deer Park, Davisville, North Toronto in built-form and density, and all those places provide significant walk-in traffic to the system. Thornhill isn't a suburb in the conventional sense, and there is no reason to think that ridership wouldn't reflect that.

Actually it wouldn't surprise me if a significant share of the current Finch ridership originates from Thornhill.

Yup. I've said this all along: the Day 1 effect of the YNSE opening will be that all the people from Thornhill who now drive to Finch will be able to get on further north, either by bus or walking to Clark or Steeles. That will be more efficient for them and the transit network, taking hundreds of cars and buses off the road. I'd argue there is no downside whatsoever to this. I think a lot of people in Toronto who are opposed to 905ers taking up seats fail to realize how many are already doing it, because they've never gone to Finch to see all the people getting on the TTC from their cars and the GO/YRT buses.

The downstream capacity issues arise from the growth that will occur as a result of the subway but they also won't be instantaneous though clearly some development is going to start happening before opening day. I'm curious - but not surprised, about the property movement. Certainly there are a few plazas there ripe for redevelopment and I don't know what their timeline is but it's gonna be a jackpot when the owners of the Roy Foss dealerships decide to cash in.

Clark will probably be that Summerhill kinda station, picking up the walk-ins and bus traffic between 7 and Steeles. It doesn't have to be packed, because the 2 north stations and Steeles will be doing all the heavy lifting in terms of generating density and ridership.

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

Interesting, can you share more?

Actually looking closer the examples I was thinking about were closer to Steeles and Royal Orchard, rather than centering around Clark.

One site (7115 Yonge) already has a thread on UT: https://urbantoronto.ca/forum/threads/7115-yonge-street-terrabona-developments-s-ibi-group.32468/

While the other (8051 Yonge) doesn't seem to have a thread but just traded hands to Greenpark Group: https://mbpd.ca/portfolio_page/8051-yonge-street-markham/

 

[syn]

There has been a lot of property movement happening along the Yonge corridor between Meadowview Ave and Centre Street over the past 24 months. Developers are aiming to pack the corridor with density, make no mistake about it.

But more relevant in my opinion is that the current low-rise residential neighbourhood of Thornhill essentially mirrors Summer Hill, Deer Park, Davisville, North Toronto in built-form and density, and all those places provide significant walk-in traffic to the system. Thornhill isn't a suburb in the conventional sense, and there is no reason to think that ridership wouldn't reflect that.

Actually it wouldn't surprise me if a significant share of the current Finch ridership originates from Thornhill.

Does it?

Not only is the area surrounding Summerhill much more pedestrian friendly, I think it's higher density as well.

In what ways would you say Thornhill isn't a suburb in the conventional sense?

 

[boilwater]

Does it?

Not only is the area surrounding Summerhill much more pedestrian friendly, I think it's higher density as well.

In what ways would you say Thornhill isn't a suburb in the conventional sense?

Definitely agree with the pedestrian friendliness but density is probably pretty close as most of the density in that area is closer to st clair.

I like the parallel between the two in terms of both being impacted by an east-west rail corridor that cuts through the neighbourhood

I expect a larger share of passengers transferring from buses at clark than summerhill

 

[syn]

Definitely agree with the pedestrian friendliness but density is probably pretty close as most of the density in that area is closer to st clair.

I like the parallel between the two in terms of both being impacted by an east-west rail corridor that cuts through the neighbourhood

I expect a larger share of passengers transferring from buses at clark than summerhill

Perhaps, but the lot sizes lead me to think that the area surrounding Summerhill are generally higher density. In terms of built form it's certainly more suited to a subway.

The Summershill comparison is interesting. It has been used more than a few times as an example of a city station with low ridership, so I'm not sure it exactly makes a great case for justifying a suburban station, especially given the context.

 

[ARG1]

Perhaps, but the lot sizes lead me to think that the area surrounding Summerhill are generally higher density. In terms of built form it's certainly more suited to a subway.

The Summershill comparison is interesting. It has been used more than a few times as an example of a city station with low ridership, so I'm not sure it exactly makes a great case for justifying a suburban station, especially given the context.

As @boilwater mentioned however, its a station that currently has the density of Summerhill, but is also located along a major street and is served by several major busroutes including a future branch of Viva Orange, plus there are a ton of high density development planned for the area. In its current state, it will already see a lot more passengers than Summerhill through just though bus connections, and long term it could be a pretty major station when it comes to walk in traffic, easily more than Summerhill.