Richmond Hill Yonge Line 1 North Subway Extension | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx

[ciceror]

My postal address is Thornhill. Just to confirm if anyone is interested.

On a random thought, it’s too bad there wasn’t original plans to bring the line up to Yonge and 16th (where Hillcrest Mall is locates). Was in the area today and it’s getting built up at a good pace. My guess is the small lots have been pieced together by developers and it’s just a matter of time before another condo goes in. The same can be said for Yonge St south of the cemetery to Royal Orchard.

View attachment 308127

View attachment 308128

The people who live here are extremely hostile to the condo development. they just rejected at 43 story condo on the intersection by 7 - 2 in council.

it would be nice to bring the subway up to 16. but now that they've spent hundreds of millions on the rapid bus it would feel like a waste to tear it up after only a decade

 

[Sandpit]

The people who live here are extremely hostile to the condo development. they just rejected at 43 story condo on the intersection by 7 - 2 in council.

it would be nice to bring the subway up to 16. but now that they've spent hundreds of millions on the rapid bus it would feel like a waste to tear it up after only a decade

The problem is that pretty much any tall building on that site is going to look like a wall that blocks off the Beverly Hills condos to the south. People don't necessarily expect their views to be preserved permanently, but the tight squeeze there means that people in the north-facing units will pretty much be staring at a wall. They might just have to settle for a building that shorter than Beverly Hills.

The latest proposal means that they could bring the subway to Yonge and 16th on the rail corridor, placing the station to the east of the intersection and leaving the bus lanes to serve Yonge directly.

 

[aquateam]

I don't know how things work at Canada Post these days but I'm guessing computers just scan the postal codes first.

Why did I write Willowdale? I don't know But I don't recall having any issues receiving mail. If I lived there today, I'd probably just write Toronto (I generally use Thornhill the vast majority of the time now, only writing Vaughan if some system I'm using seems to favour it, like as it fills out the address automatically.)

I currently live in Willowdale and the official Canada Post address shows up "North York" (not Toronto) for me.

I wish some of this was above ground. The area he is talking about would be a good candidate.

The councilor raises a good point, though. I don't see how the cemetery could have more NIMBY's than the Kirk drive neighbourhood.

My postal address is Thornhill. Just to confirm if anyone is interested.

On a random thought, it’s too bad there wasn’t original plans to bring the line up to Yonge and 16th (where Hillcrest Mall is locates). Was in the area today and it’s getting built up at a good pace. My guess is the small lots have been pieced together by developers and it’s just a matter of time before another condo goes in. The same can be said for Yonge St south of the cemetery to Royal Orchard.

I'm kind of surprised too, given that they are already on the surface they could have a station at 16th (maybe instead of "High Tech") for probably ~5% more of the cost of the budget.

 

[TJ O'Pootertoot]

The councilor raises a good point, though. I don't see how the cemetery could have more NIMBY's than the Kirk drive neighbourhood.

The land is owned by the Catholic Archdiocese of Toronto which means there's only one NIMBY to worry about. Unfortunately, it's this guy:

I'm not a Catholic and I'm happy to defer to an expert, but it's consecrated ground so it's less about disturbing bodies or families visiting graves feeling vibration than the religious principle. There must be tunnels and subways under cemeteries somewhere but the alignments they looked at suggest they were pretty clear they weren't gonna be tunnelling under this one without a big hassle

As I said before, I understand the Councillor being concerned about this thing suddenly coming under an established subdivision but that doesn't mean there aren't a bunch of reasons and considerations that got us to this point. I look forward to seeing and hearing how the public consultations go for Metrolinx. Hopefully residents will be concerned but not hysterical when they get their chance to speak.

 

[Undead]

The land is owned by the Catholic Archdiocese of Toronto which means there's only one NIMBY to worry about

 

[W. K. Lis]

The land is owned by the Catholic Archdiocese of Toronto which means there's only one NIMBY to worry about. Unfortunately, it's this guy:
View attachment 308206

I'm not a Catholic and I'm happy to defer to an expert, but it's consecrated ground so it's less about disturbing bodies or families visiting graves feeling vibration than the religious principle. There must be tunnels and subways under cemeteries somewhere but the alignments they looked at suggest they were pretty clear they weren't gonna be tunnelling under this one without a big hassle

As I said before, I understand the Councillor being concerned about this thing suddenly coming under an established subdivision but that doesn't mean there aren't a bunch of reasons and considerations that got us to this point. I look forward to seeing and hearing how the public consultations go for Metrolinx. Hopefully residents will be concerned but not hysterical when they get their chance to speak.

Wonder how the city of Rome handled its metro (subway) construction with all its catacombs and ancient graveyards?

 

[ciceror]

Wonder how the city of Rome handled its metro (subway) construction with all its catacombs and ancient graveyards?

Probably why its one of the smallest in Europe. Rome has only 3 lines and 73 stations compared to London's 270 stations and Paris's 300

 

[NoahB]

Probably why its one of the smallest in Europe. Rome has only 3 lines and 73 stations compared to London's 270 stations and Paris's 300

That's a huge assumption on your part. It probably has more to do with the population and history...
Rome: 2.8m, 1200km
Grand Paris: 7m, 800km
Greater London: 8.9m, 1500km

 

[MisterF]

Probably why its one of the smallest in Europe. Rome has only 3 lines and 73 stations compared to London's 270 stations and Paris's 300

Rome has a bigger network than people give it credit for. It also has a network of regional trains that's much like the Paris RER and what GO is slowly transitioning into. It runs through tunnels in the centre of the city and stations look and function like metro stations. Plus the metro Line C is currently being extended through the heart of the ancient city, terminating beside the Forum and Coliseum.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Rome has a bigger network than people give it credit for. It also has a network of regional trains that's much like the Paris RER and what GO is slowly transitioning into. It runs through tunnels in the centre of the city and stations look and function like metro stations. Plus the metro Line C is currently being extended through the heart of the ancient city, terminating beside the Forum and Coliseum.

Rome even has trams (streetcars) running through the heart of Rome. Surface transit will be the ruin of anyone's downtown. Just look what happened to Rome's sport coliseum with their trams, making it a ruin...

From link. (Being sarcastic to Brampton folks.)

 

[Leo_Chan]

Found this proposal on Reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/TTC/comments/meu9zd

 

[kamira51]

Found this proposal on Reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/TTC/comments/meu9zd

I dont think Ford came up with this Alignment, but I could be wrong.

Why is this thread still labeled as TTC when it's a Metrolinx project?

 

[aquateam]

Found this proposal on Reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/TTC/comments/meu9zd

I'm not a fan of this:

1. It makes the sharp turns even sharper and the speeds even slower
2. If the inviolability of the Holy Cross cemetery from the center of the earth to Low Earth Orbit is the reason for our current alignment, then I don't see why using the southern end to run an above-ground train (that also cuts off the south eastern section for the curve) would be acceptable. Unlike all the other proposals, this would actually involve re-interring bodies and expropriating sections of the cemetery.
3. If the goal is to add a stop at Baythorn (which seems to have better development potential but worse street connectivity than Royal Orchard) then the options that involve staying on Yonge are better for that since they don't force sharp curves
4. If the stop is at Bay Thorn drive/Thornhill avenue, I think it would make more sense to name it Thornhill (as a homage to the area) rather than after a local street name.

But I like the very sleek map, it looks like it was made with Adobe illustrator.

 

[aquateam]

Is "Thornhill" Station not reserved for the one at John/Centre. And of course we tell York Region we are not building a subway for 2km with no station and no development. If you want to reach RH Centre, you need development along the way too.

To lower cost, as I believe had been mentioned before, use cut-and-cover to lower the cost enough to pay for all neighbourhood Stations (Cummer, Clarke, Centre/John and Royal Orchard/Baythorne). Also bridge over Cricklewood Creek (Don River).

Right now there is no "Thornhill" station planned at Centre/John. That was proposed by @sunnyraytoronto to consolidate Clarke and Royal Orchard into a single, more centrally-located stop with more bus coverage. If we get all the original stops then I think adding in Centre would be excessive, considering the obstacles to developing the neighbourhood around John/Centre to something transit-supportive.

The last leg. 400m radius curve off Yonge, north of cemetary. Langstaff Station - which slightly below grade (with development above it). Another 400m radius curve to get you back onto the Rail corridor (at-grade). Need to "tunnel" under 407 - which is a touch deeper than the Kitchener GO/401 tunnel (which is good) and the trains are not as high so tunnel diameter is less (which is also good) but it will still cost in the $100M range.

Your proposal is my favourite. I like that Langstaff station is located inside the Langstaff gateway. The original plan was to have it just touch the corner of the Langstaff gateway lands, with the cemetery covering the east side, a park and ride on the west side, and a highway interchange on its north.

Your proposal puts it a lot closer to all the development.

Welcome to UT!

 

[allengeorge]

Thanks. Longtime lurker. But these developments on Yonge a couple of weeks ago and Ontario Line more recently pushed me to join.

Using cut-and-cover definitely opens up a lot more options, since stations become less expensive. Unfortunately Metrolinx seems to have deemed them persona non grata. I'm not sure they'll reconsider, but we can always hope.

Thanks for putting in the time and drawing out options.