Toronto Union Pearson Express | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | MMM Group Limited

One thing that's been demonstrated by the UPE is that traffic from downtown to the airport is not nearly as crippling as one might have believed. That original perception was likely used to justify the UPE in the first place. If I can get from downtown to Pearson in my private car, use the roads for free, park at the airport for about $15 a day and do it all in about 45 min max, why would you bother with the UPE?

Counter this to the Paddington to Heathrow express train in London. Taking a private car from downtown London to a parking lot in Heathrow airport would be an expensive and 2+ hour headache. Put tolls on the 427 and eliminate (or tax) half the parking spots at Pearson and the UPE looks good.
 
Admiral Beez said:
One thing that's been demonstrated by the UPE is that traffic from downtown to the airport is not nearly as crippling as one might have believed. That original perception was likely used to justify the UPE in the first place. If I can get from downtown to Pearson in my private car, use the roads for free, park at the airport for about $15 a day and do it all in about 45 min max, why would you bother with the UPE?

Counter this to the Paddington to Heathrow express train in London. Taking a private car from downtown London to a parking lot in Heathrow airport would be an expensive and 2+ hour headache. Put tolls on the 427 and eliminate (or tax) half the parking spots at Pearson and the UPE looks good.
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Have you ever tried driving to Pearson from DT after work to catch an 8PM flight out, or better arrive in at 8AM from Pearson?

It's not about the car, or the comfort, or the money. It's the fact that I can make it in 20min.
 
ssiguy2 said:
It wouldn't cost the TTC a nickel. The UPX fare would remain exactly the same fare but if you take the TTC to get to the station then you $3.25 fare is automatically deducted off your UPX fare.

As far as Metrolinx, I doubt it would cost them anything either if they stopped at Et.North and Eglinton as the ridership from their smaller fare revenue would be offset by the huge jump in total ridership. The line with ET.N, Eg, and hopefully Humber which take the ridership from 7200 to 72000 overnight.
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Vancouver should pay for it then.

ssiguy2 said:
Electrification should take less than a year for the entire stretch as it's actually quite a easy process. Until electrification they can just use the current stops and when complete they could also add Eglinton, Etobicoke North, and Humber.
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If everything was as easy as you always say it is, the world would have endless fusion energy, an end to poverty, a cure for all cancers, and the music that came after your youth wouldn't have all been ****.
 
muller877 said:
It's not an easy process. Not just stringing some wires on poles and you are done.

You have to:
- build transformers along the line to power the wires
- acquire the land for the substation
- make sure the electrical grid can handle the extra load (probably adding higher capacity wires to get to the substation
- ensure that all the bridges can handle the increased height (for example the Union Station shed is too low...I know not for this project but for future projects)

Plus of course Weston will complain about something...probably the magnetic fields that the wires will produce.

See the EA for the entire scope of the project
http://www.gotransit.com/electrification/en/project_history/default.aspx
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Maintenance facility!
And electrification to the maintenance facility too!
 
UD2 said:
Have you ever tried driving to Pearson from DT after work to catch an 8PM flight out, or better arrive in at 8AM from Pearson?

It's not about the car, or the comfort, or the money. It's the fact that I can make it in 20min.
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Sounds like confirmation bias to me. If your experience was indicative of most travellers I suggest the UPE would be packed.
 
Palma said:
How long is a train ride that a person could not wait to get home to drink water - if one is riding subway from kipling to the east end thats at least 40-45min ride. No water fountains on those trains
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When GO trains run on the same interval as subways, then you might have a point. One can go look for a drink when thirsty and catch the next train in a few minutes. You can get off a subway train if you are dehydrated, and get a drink from a concession or go outside to a store to get a drink. Try doing that on GO. Not to mention that when a subway is stalled, they get you off within four hours.

GO trains are covered under the federal health regulations I posted. Subways aren't.
 
Electrification IS a relatively easy procedure when compared to other to the other costs and construction times of new infrastructure........aka Spadina Ext.

Yes there has to be a maintenance facility but those things could start soon. I find it amazing how Metrolinx and the Queen's Park profess to be so concerned about reducing emissions and getting people on to transit but they have yet to start GO electrification but have found the time and money to build thousands of new covered parking spots.

Again it wouldn't cost the TTC a cent as the UPX fare would stay the same and the discount would only apply if you took the TTC to get to the station. If you read my comment I also said that as electrification continues it can eventually add ET.N, EG, Humber. I know there are capacity constraints now due to being diesel and having too few trains.

The UPX with complete fare integration would be a great way to test the potential success of a RER system. If after fare integration and UPX still only adds modest new riders then that will be proof that RER will be a complete failure or conversely if the ridership soars then that bodes well for RER.

Right now the UPX carries nothing more than a busy bus. It has been a complete failure from a transit point of view because it wasn't built as transit but that doesn't mean they can't turn a lemon into lemonade. Tell Metrolinx to do a 6 month trial and see what happens.
 
W. K. Lis said:
Two or three car trains?

Maybe they need to lengthen the trains, by adding cars (plural). Is there room on the high platforms? Or do they need more construction?
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3 is the max you can get on line since Union and the airport can't handle 4.

Then, 1 out 5 trains are 3 cars long with the rest being 2.
 
UD2 said:
Have you ever tried driving to Pearson from DT after work to catch an 8PM flight out, or better arrive in at 8AM from Pearson?

It's not about the car, or the comfort, or the money. It's the fact that I can make it in 20min.
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That's if you live at or near the UP stop. If you don't, walking/TTC to get to the stop can tack on another 10 to 20 mins. So you're not saving a whole lot of time.
 
Admiral Beez said:
Sounds like confirmation bias to me. If your experience was indicative of most travellers I suggest the UPE would be packed.
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I've taken the UPX a couple of times this month - usually heading out to PIA in the morning and returning in afternoon rush hour. And yes - the cars were full.
Don't know what it's been like mid-day but It was great to see it being used.
 
gabe said:
That's if you live at or near the UP stop. If you don't, walking/TTC to get to the stop can tack on another 10 to 20 mins. So you're not saving a whole lot of time.
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From my home - I would say I save 30-45 minutes, not including the stress of knowing if traffic is going to come to a complete stop on the drive out.
A $12 Uber to Union and a $9 UPX fare is well worth it for a 3-4 day trip for me.
I've also done a UPX/Line 2 trip on the way home mid-afternoon with a quick streetcar ride home for $11.90.

I think what it's done is add some options. And options are good.

The government has spent a lot of money on things I don't use. So, regardless of the talk of it being a waste of money, the UPX is money well spent for me.
 
gabe said:
That's if you live at or near the UP stop. If you don't, walking/TTC to get to the stop can tack on another 10 to 20 mins. So you're not saving a whole lot of time.
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You don't need to live near an UP stop. You just neeed to work near one. The possibility that this opens is huge. People can now leave after work as opposed to waiting until the next day because they will be able to catch 7 or 8PM flights.

Same thing with inbound passengers, who can arrive on the business day morning instead of the night before to catch a morning meeting.

This is an economic tool that will help make Toronto more compatible and business friendly. I have never seen this as a way for people to take their family on holiday on a weekend.
 
gabe said:
That's if you live at or near the UP stop. If you don't, walking/TTC to get to the stop can tack on another 10 to 20 mins. So you're not saving a whole lot of time.
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But you are guaranteed to arrive and driving the Gardiner is anything but. Have not taken the car in a year and a half. No more pre flight stress. 20 minutes guaranteed.
 
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