Toronto Sidewalk Toronto at Quayside | ?m | ?s | Sidewalk | Snøhetta

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I just don't get the ardent and immediate response to not even consider it.
Well there's a way to do that, like all other developers wish to do. The Digital Mafia have to follow the law, not be the law.
its financial backing is near unlimited.
Fine, then allow them to make a proposal to take over the massive costs of remediation instead of the taxpayers doing it. Why does something so obvious escape the better judgement of those wishing for Enterprise?

I'm all for Enterprise. Like it or not, it will fund many massive infrastructure projects this province sorely needs. But not after the land is cleared, decontaminated, serviced and the locals assuaged, all for Daddy Digital to come in on their terms to tell us how it's going to be and how we're going to bend the rules and offer them a deal on a plate.

ALL development comes with risks. Why do people bow so low and grovel when money is waved in front of them? They're asking for something investigators would pore over if it was SNC/Lavalin doing this in a third world country.

They want to buy in? They do it on our terms, not theirs.

Doesn't it strike some of you, even just the littlest, that media like the Financial Times (real left wingers them) and US media/academic intelligentsia are raising serious questions about exactly this?
 
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Hmmmm

Blowback on this is ramping up quickly.

Some of the progressive City councillors would be expected..........but it appears Doug Ford's government also has an allergy to this........

 
Google played their hand too fast, especially with the public/city council already mildly wary with the whole data collection issue.

They should have gotten construction underway first for at least a tiny corner of their project to show that their ideas were possible, and then went up to the government(s) with a plan like this. But as of now, a lot of hypotheticals and pretty pictures, and a lot of red flags.
 
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Google played their hand too fast, especially with the public/city council already mildly wary with the whole data collection issue.

They should have gotten construction underway first for at least a tiny corner of their project to show that their ideas were possible, and then went up to the government(s) with a plan like this. But as of now, a lot of hypotheticals and pretty pictures, and a lot of red flags.

This. 100%.

They've really shot themselves in the foot with this plan, and I can't see how an entity like Sidewalk Labs / Google woudldn't have known better if they truly wanted this project to go ahead.
 
Hmmmm

Blowback on this is ramping up quickly.

Some of the progressive City councillors would be expected..........but it appears Doug Ford's government also has an allergy to this........

Well, congratulations to Google!

They managed to united Council and QP alike, unanimously I believe that I can read so far, to tell them to get lost.

Let this be a warning! Now let's see how many of those blind, cheering supporters amongst the last day's posters pull their posts.
Not only is this going to bring much closer scrutiny onto Google, it will on Waterfront Toronto too.

And maybe that's a good thing...I'll Google that later.
 
The extraordinary play Alphabet wants to make in Toronto reminds me of the blowback Amazon just got in NYC.
There's a double twist to Amazon that's more than convoluted. Bezos is a conflicted man. He also owns the WashPost, like a cuddly little toy for him to play with, so he can wear his 'progressive liberal' suit to parties, meantime squeezing Amazon employees in conditions considered Third World.

But that's exactly the 'style' of the Googlios too, albeit Zuckerberg takes the cake for 'likes'.

Let the Blowback begin! It's going to be difficult. There's no shortage of zombies out there. Just read back some of the comments in this string to see how vacant their eyes are.

OPINION
Edward Keenan: Toronto’s approach to Amazon is a model of how to deal with Google

Behind subscription, but you can find other sources on-line:

Instant Insight Andrew Edgecliffe-Johnson
Amazon’s U-turn shows it misunderstands public sentiment
Jeff Bezos failed to anticipate or weather the hostility his Queens plan provoked
 
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This is worthy of a discussion in itself, and indicative of how an entity can have more 'information' than even intelligence agencies, and yet be so fugging stupid as to believe that their farts are the wafting delicacy of roses in the springtime.
I can't see how an entity like Sidewalk Labs / Google woudldn't have known better if they truly wanted this project to go ahead.
Some of us sussed onto the whole Digital Mafia sometime back, but who would ever have expected such 'special people' to blow their ruse so spectacularly?

Guaranteed this is going to be the talk in leading academic and business journals for the next while. The Financial Times will be chortling with delight...As much as Rana Foroohar is American, and so are many of her staff at the FT, there's also the jibe against the US (lack of) oversight over the activities of the Digital Mafia. The EU has come down hard on them. The US is now late in the game, as is the UK with their surprisingly proactive Parliamentary hearings (surprising for the UK, this would be second nature in the Nordic countries and other Germanics), but here in Canada?

Phhhh....
 
Must read just up from Steve Munro:
[...]
A Leak at Sidewalk

On February 14, the Star's Marco Chown Oved revealed that Sidewalk had designs on the entire Port Lands. His article is based on a presentation deck that has not been released. I asked, and he replied:



A revised presentation was issued by Sidewalk, but it does not include some of the more contentious text cited in Oved's article.

The foundation of Sidewalk's proposal is that they would not only finance infrastructure installation throughout Quayside and the Portlands, but that they would be repaid by tapping into future municipal revenues. They would not become developers, but would reap their reward as others built in the area they had serviced.

Internal documents obtained by the Star show Sidewalk Labs plans to make the case that it is “entitled to … a share in the uptick in land value on the entire geography ... a share of developer charges and incremental tax revenue on all land.” ... estimated to be $6 billion over the next 30 years. [Oved]
This sounds promising if you are a politician accustomed to finding someone in the private sector to take costs off of your hands, at least in the short term. However, it is a form of borrowing just like any debt, and there is no indication of the return Sidewalk (or its funding parent, Alphabet) would expect on its investment. Moreover, there is a risk that economic circumstances will change over coming decades and development could slow or stop in Toronto. Would that risk be part of any deal, shared with Alphabet, or would they expect payment even for infrastructure supporting vacant lots?
[...continues at great and detailed length...]
The Tangled Web of Waterfront Transit and Sidewalk Labs
 
I continue to be so shocked, absolutely shocked and befuddled I tell you:
Google reaped millions of tax breaks as it secretly expanded its real estate footprint across the U.S.
By ELIZABETH DWOSKINThe Washington Post
Fri., Feb. 15, 2019

Last May, officials in Midlothian, Texas, a city near Dallas, approved more than $10 million (U.S.) in tax breaks for a huge, mysterious new development across from a shuttered Toys R’ Us warehouse.
That day was the first time officials had spoken publicly about an enigmatic developer’s plans to build a sprawling data centre. The developer, which incorporated with the state four months earlier, went by the name Sharka LLC. City officials declined at the time to say who was behind Sharka.
[...]
The mystery company was Google — a fact the city revealed two months later, after the project was formally approved. Larry Barnett, president of Midlothian Economic Development, one of the agencies that negotiated the data centre deal, said he knew at the time the tech giant was the one seeking a decade of tax giveaways for the project, but he was prohibited from disclosing it because the company had demanded secrecy.
“I’m confident that had the community known this project was under the direction of Google, people would have spoken out, but we were never given the chance to speak,” said Travis Smith, managing editor of the Waxahachie Daily Light, the local paper.
“We didn’t know that it was Google until after it passed.”
After the deal went through, Sharka changed its main address to that of Google’s headquarters in Mountain View, Calif. Site work began last fall.
[...]
Some New York lawmakers were so outraged by the secrecy of Amazon’s process that they have introduced bills that would ban nondisclosure agreements for development projects in the city and state.
[...]
Officials in eight of the cities signed nondisclosure agreements, or NDAs, in their real estate dealings with Google, according to the documents. The documents also show that the search giant used shell companies to negotiate to build data centres in five of the six localities with data centres that responded to the records requests, including Midlothian; Berkeley County, South Carolina; Council Bluffs, Iowa; Lenoir, North Carolina; and Clarksville, Tennessee. Google’s identity was eventually revealed, but often so late in the process that it precluded public debate.
[...]
Sometimes Google formed multiple subsidiaries, with distinct names, to handle different aspects of negotiations for the same site, according to the documents. In Midlothian, for example, Google created Sharka to negotiate the tax-abatement and the site plans, and used a separate Delaware company, Jet Stream LLC, to negotiate the land purchase with a private owner. In Iowa, Google created Delaware-based Questa LLC for the land sale and Gable Corp. for the development deal.

When Google’s representatives first approached Midlothian in 2016, they used a code name that was not the same as either of the subsidiaries, Barnett said. (He declined to say what it was.) Google also asked Midlothian officials to sign a confidentiality agreement before they knew the developer’s identity, Barnett said. He said Google revealed its identity a year later, as the deal approached.
[...]
The records also demonstrate how Google was able to keep publicly relevant information out of view. Lenoir, North Carolina, where Google announced in 2007 it would build a data centre, agreed to treat as a trade secret information about energy and water use, the number of workers to be employed by the data centre, and the amount of capital the company would invest, according to the documents. The Google subsidiary, Tapaha Dynamics LLC, then moved to exempt such trade secrets from transparency laws that allow citizens to make public information requests. At one point, according to the documents, Lenoir’s city attorney instructed city council members not to answer questions about the project during a public hearing.

Williams, the Google spokesperson, told The Post that it considers information such as water and energy usage to be trade secrets because competitors could use it to draw sensitive conclusions about the company’s technology.
[...]
In Midlothian, a July article in the local newspaper, the Waxahachie Daily Light, announcing Google’s role in the new data centre elicited hundreds of comments and shares, with many residents complaining about the low number of jobs and the tax incentives. “There goes our small town living,” one local wrote.

“So Google comes in and pays no taxes for 10 years, and only brings in 40 jobs hmm sounds like a great idea,” wrote another.

Smith, the managing editor of the local paper, said, “I’m not going to say we’ve been lied to, but we’ve been strung along.”

Gosh, they could have had the lumber mill and everything...lol...there's so many gullible people, and so much time...

"But, but, but...the nice man said he loved me, and we were special and I know he'd never lie to me..."

So Toronto, how's the romance coming along?
 
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Those bastards at Alphabet want to collect property taxes and build transit. How dare they? This is Toronto - the City collects property taxes and doesn’t build transit. That’s how we roll.
 
Just reading as much as I can on this, just to see where the mirrors were placed to deflect the light, and this is classic:
  • We would build a tall-timber factory in Ontario to supply wood that will be used to build the Quayside neighbourhood — and other neighbourhoods as well. This innovative and sustainable initiative could create 4,000 new jobs in manufacturing, sawmill, transportation and logging sector. Sidewalk Labs would help jumpstart this next-generation Canadian industry.
This is close to an outright lie, and/or Doctoroff is no doctor, Canada was one of the pioneers in the use of 'parallam' (a brand name) via both the NRC and
Parallam® PSL Beams :: Weyerhaeuser.

Export Canada was heavily involved in the export of the product, concept and the application. CMHC actually had a section on it years back on their website. It may still be up. (Edit: It is, but even better is this, with full accreditation to CMHC, And note how advanced this is already at UofW: http://www.civil.uwaterloo.ca/beg/archtech/cmhc_wood_frame_bpg.pdf )(note the date: © 1999, Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation. That's almost a generation ago)

See here: ENGINEERED WOOD: MANUFACTURING PROCESSES OPTIMIZE FIBER UTILIZATION & ENGINEERING PROPERTIES Donald J. Sharp Trus Joist MacMillan October 1995
http://www.forum-holzbau.com/pdf/sharp_95.pdf

I can produce a lot more reference if anyone doubts my claims. The Europeans (mostly Swiss and Germans, via Sweden and Finland) spearheaded the concept for rearranged strands but development shifted to the supply source, in this case, Canada.

Here's the point: Sidewalk have been engaged in a massive propaganda exercise selling us what is already ours, then deciding to tax us on top of that, all the time begging for adulation: "Aren't we great?"

I leave it at that for now, but the more I read, the more I'm flummoxed that so many Torontonians, Canadians, have been so readily hoodwinked on this whole affair.

Brace for more revelations, they've only just started.

Late addendum: Sidewalk has been very careful to do what Alphabet has been doing in many other cases: Claiming that they are not the developers. No sir, they will administer development out to others (save their Quayside development and Villiers Island HQ). And who do they administer/outsource development to?

Why their own little stand-alone companies with hidden ownership....turning out to be, oddly, with HQ at the same address as Alphabet. Nothing to see here folks, nosirreee, we're building something For the People...whoops...wrong mafia...
 
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This is worthy of a discussion in itself, and indicative of how an entity can have more 'information' than even intelligence agencies, and yet be so fugging stupid as to believe that their farts are the wafting delicacy of roses in the springtime.

Some of us sussed onto the whole Digital Mafia sometime back, but who would ever have expected such 'special people' to blow their ruse so spectacularly?

Because there's always a supply of 'disruptors' who believe that their ideas will revolutionize the world (and so their ideas must be implemented), and the tech world seems to foster this sort of savior complex.
 
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